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2021... 50 years since the end of LT steam


L49
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Hi folks.

 

This might be a cloud cuckoo land idea, but it has just occurred to me that we will be approaching the 50th anniversary of the end of steam on LT in two and a bit years time.

 

We have had successful steam on the Met type events, including the fantastic sight of Met 1 running into Moorgate back in 2013, now I am wondering whether there might be enough interest (and interested people in the right places) to do something special to mark the 50th anniversary of steam's passing.

 

Does anyone remember back in the 'old' days of Steam on the Met, a photo charter with the B12 hauling LT engineers stock around the Met with Sarah Siddons on the back? I'm thinking it might have been 1999, but not quite sure. I was wondering whether we felt that there might be a chance of putting something similar together using one or more of the surviving Panniers.

 

Obviously the big problem (operationally) is braking.

 

In 1971 (and before), they ran unfitted, a practice which was quickly done away with after the end of steam, especially following the lessons learned from the Neasden collision of 1968. I know L94 is mainline certified, but I can't see whether she is air fitted, or whether she is allowed to run on the mainline with vacuum stock. L150 is of course air fitted, but is obviously not a pannier (which is probably the daftest point I have ever made)

 

My question here is would anyone else think it would be a good idea? Would we be willing to raise awareness of the event? Would we be willing to put some money towards something along the lines of a Plandampf for LT (using steam on regular duties for a specific week or weekend) And does anyone know what might be the best avenue of approach?

 

As I write this, it is sounding more and more off the wall, but then we would never have believed steam hauled wooden framed stock on the Inner Circle would have been a possibility before 2013.

 

Any thoughts or ideas (other than rude ones!!!)

 

Cheers

Charlie

 

PS... Edited to add in a complete 'duh' moment that of course Met 1 has air brake, so she could definitely be used, maybe with a specially repainted maroon battery on the other end... Just a thought.

 

I'd happily chip in for the 300 or so pots of Phoenix Precision LT maroon!

Edited by L49
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  • 2 weeks later...

Looking at it practically you need to approach TfL for one and be ensnared in a myriad of bureaucracy but this could be overcome....

More importantly, you'd need engagement from Bucks Railway Centre about the use of Met 1 as I think her boiler certificate expires in 2020. You might have more luck with getting Tyseley's L94 down there as she has all the necessary equipment (not sure about brakes) and is mainline ticketed. For a consideration you might even get both Tyseley panniers in maroon down to West Ruislip. However, as far as I know there are no brake vans which would be useful to have (unless someone can correct me!). I know 2 Ashford 20T are sat at Acton awaiting some love and care.... As always, finding funding is key but I don't see why you couldn't a run to Watford in principle...

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The main problem will be the new signalling system which won't be compatible with steam locos. As I understand it by 2021 all of the sub-surface routes apart from the outer sections of the Met will be converted. I believe only the Hammersmith branch and possibly the northern half of the Circle line have been converted so far. I believe the southern half of the Circle Line is next.

 

PS... Edited to add in a complete 'duh' moment that of course Met 1 has air brake, so she could definitely be used, maybe with a specially repainted maroon battery on the other end... Just a thought.

Kind of, it has a train air brake but not a source of air to operate it. So Sarah Siddons, a battery electric or a class 20 would have to be in the train to provide the air. For a vacuum braked loco, such as 9466 or one of the preserved LT Pannier Tanks, a translator loco would have to be used between the loco and train like how Sarah Siddons and Class 20s were used for the Steam On The Met events in 2013 & 2017.

 

More importantly, you'd need engagement from Bucks Railway Centre about the use of Met 1 as I think her boiler certificate expires in 2020.

Met 1's boiler certificate runs out in 2022. L94's runs out in 2020 or early 2021.

 

 

I know 2 Ashford 20T are sat at Acton awaiting some love and care....

I think that those two are the two that are to be restored as part of the Q stock restoration, as mentioned on the bottom of https://donate.ltmuseum.co.uk/q-stock-restoration/

Edited by Paul.Uni
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No sections of the sub surface lines have been cut over to the new signalling system yet. I understand the first section at the end of the Hammersmith branch is likely to be done in late November (usual caveats apply).

 

Yes, it would be nice to do and might be feasible over the sections of line that will retain Tripcocks for ATP on Chiltern Line trains.

 

Regards,

 

Dan

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The main problem will be the new signalling system which won't be compatible with steam locos. As I understand it by 2021 all of the sub-surface routes apart from the outer sections of the Met will be converted. I believe only the Hammersmith branch and possibly the northern half of the Circle line have been converted so far. I believe the southern half of the Circle Line is next.

 

Kind of, it has a train air brake but not a source of air to operate it. So Sarah Siddons, a battery electric or a class 20 would have to be in the train to provide the air. For a vacuum braked loco, such as 9466 or one of the preserved LT Pannier Tanks, a translator loco would have to be used between the loco and train like how Sarah Siddons and Class 20s were used for the Steam On The Met events in 2013 & 2017.

 

Met 1's boiler certificate runs out in 2022. L94's runs out in 2020 or early 2021.

 

 

I think that those two are the two that are to be restored as part of the Q stock restoration, as mentioned on the bottom of https://donate.ltmuseum.co.uk/q-stock-restoration/

 

 

Fair enough, always willing to stand corrected

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  • 1 year later...

Any more thoughts as to how feasible it is? I was looking at the 'End of (LT) Steam' poster on my wall earlier and began wondering whether I might ever see an LT Pannier on an engineer's train...

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  • 10 months later...

My Dad, Ray Wood, was foreman at Neasden Steam shed.  Loads of pictures of him in the book, Red Panniers.  He started there on demob in about 1946.  Got a picture of him leaning out the cab of L52, taken by CRL Coles in the 50s.

 

He loved the Panniers.  Said they were brilliant,  would pull anything. Would never slip if being handled by a competent driver.

 

He laughed at the very gentle handling of the engines at the steam on the Met events.  He said when he started away with L44 there'd have been sparks, and cinders flying- and "always be ready to knock her back if she starts losing her feet boy" he always said to me. 

 

As for the Panniers, nothing but nothing sounds like the bark of a western loco working hard.

 

Was full of tales Dad, - wish I'd recorded him.  He was once given the road from the bay at Aylesbury about 20 minutes before the up Master Cutler was due through.  I believe there was colourful language on the footplate that day, as his fireman and he worked hard to not get in the way of the MC.

 

He loved driving steam locos.  Battery locos and the Rolls Royce 0-6-0 locos they had at Neasden just weren't the same to him.  He had to stop driving when diagnosed with diabetes in 76, and finished up as a ticket collector at Ricky, which he loathed.  However,LT were really good as an employer to him.

 

Love London Transport steam.  That 45xx just doesn't look right to me though.

 

Best regards

 

Matt W

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  • 3 months later...

Blast! I missed the anniversary.

 

It was my first railway event. I was 11. I'm the boy on the platform on the extreme right of the  picture, clutching a sketch pad 'cos I didn't own a camera.  I still have the paperwork: Special train ticket (child, 50p), Programme, and copy of The Last Drop.

 

 

 

Barbican001.jpg

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