Class 50 Large Logo Variants

[francoes]

Hello

Hope i'm in the right area here sure ill be redirected if not.

And if it has been discussed before please forward me to the appropriate place. 

 

I'm modelling various class 50 locos at present and trying to fit all large logo liveries into a certain time.In order to use all RTR models made by Hornby it appears that this would be 1985.

Anything previous to this would just be blue with grey roof.

Unfortunately as far as I can see Hornby never produced one in this livery every grey roof variant has an orange roof lining.

Then comes the blue with black roof again with orange lining.

After study of many photos I now see blue with black roofs and no lining,some that appear to be blue all over(although I only thought this to be on Monarch).

Also did buffers get painted out in Red.Did buffers get painted out in Silver on some Locos.From what I see black roof usually went with red buffer beam and grey roof with black although I have a photo showing grey roof with red buffer beam.

This is becoming a mine field now.

Can anybody point me in the direction of the class 50 guru that could help me with individual loco liveries in 1985,well to be quite honest the whole 50.

 

Thanks in anticipation Rob

 

[royaloak]

Unfortunately its probably a question of which day you want to model the loco on, they seemed to change an awful lot back then, photographic evidence is the only way to be sure and even then you need to be 100% certain the date is correct.

[francoes]

Yes agreed

But is it correct that the black roof variant did not appear until 1985.

Also did any other members carry an all blue roof other than monarch and were buffer faces painted.

Regards

[Flood]

I have got a complete list of dates for most of the major changes, the likes of 50036 having a grey roof with red buffer beams would have to be checked from photos.

 

The earliest black roof examples did not have red buffer beams or orange stripes with the first being 50042 in July 1984

50042  Penzance  19-07-84 by Gray Callaway, on Flickr

 

Other examples were 50046 (7/4/85), 50028 (~1/6/85), 50008 (~1/7/85), 50043 (~1/11/85), 50027 (~1/12/85) and 50044 (~1/12/85). Note that 50042 and 50008 were repainted back to grey (with orange stripes) by Doncaster in 1986, the others kept their black roofs (and all but 50044 gained orange stripes although only 50027 and 50043 gained red buffer beams).

 

The remainder of the black roof 50s (with orange stripes and red buffer beams) were 50024 (16/1/86), 50047 (~1/2/86), 50049 (~1/2/86), 50002 (~1/4/86), 50006 (10/4/86), 50014 (14/4/86), 50011 (17/5/86), 50003 (~1/6/86) and 50016 (29/3/88). These locos all had their black window surrounds to the bottom of the gutter for the length of the front windows, the earlier examples had angled window surrounds at the top so a little yellow showed (like the grey examples).

 

Only Monarch carried the blue roof* (painted by Cardiff Canton Landore in August 1983; entered Doncaster January 1985, released and repainted grey April 1985). So by the time 50046 received a black roof Monarch was already at Doncaster under repair.

(*see posts 6 and 7)

 

Orange stripes did not appear on Class 50s until 1986. Hornby's current offering, 50040, has no orange stripe on the model (although it is on the box!).

 

Silver buffer heads were really only for Royal Train duties or possibly depot open days and would have to be checked individually.

Edited October 15, 2018 by Flood

[Not Captain Kernow]

Monarch received its blue roof at Landore, not Canton.

[Phil Mc]

IIRC, Howe had a partial Blue roof for a very short time.

 

I've done a few Grey roof examples without the Orange stripe, I found it easier to mask to the bottom of the Orange and respray the whole roof !!

 

As already stated, photo's are essential, there are examples of just about any Roof/Bufferbeam colour combination you could mention !!

 

I think Eagle was unique in having Black roof, Red bufferbeam and Red bufferbeam steps at some time !!

 

Cheers,

Phil.

[Flood]

IIRC, Howe had a partial Blue roof for a very short time.

 

I've done a few Grey roof examples without the Orange stripe, I found it easier to mask to the bottom of the Orange and respray the whole roof !!

 

As already stated, photo's are essential, there are examples of just about any Roof/Bufferbeam colour combination you could mention !!

 

I think Eagle was unique in having Black roof, Red bufferbeam and Red bufferbeam steps at some time !!

 

Cheers,

Phil.

50023 was painted with a black middle section to the roof and blue cab roofs from Sept 1984 to Feb 1985, I hadn't realised it was that date range.

 

50 023, Old Oak Common depot, 13-10-84 by afc45014, on Flickr

[Phil Mc]

Not my pic, so apologies if I shouldn't post it !!!

 

Cheers,

Phil.

[francoes]

Thanks

For all who posted

Ive been away for a while and will have to digest information and these photos.

I will repost by the end of the week with some pictures regarding buffers and roof colours with date.

Thanks again much appreciated

Regards Rob

[francoes]

Hello all

Just thought I would post up some pictures of why I was asking previous questions.

These are my locos but cant take credit for the work.

A few finer details needed and might not be everybody's cup of tea but how I remember them. 

[daveyb]

They look very good. Was it a commercial weathering service or a friend?

 

As a one off, there was a pic of one the first 50s in LL on a test run ex-works from Doncaster (might have been 030 or 031) with big yellow ends but small nos and logos. No idea whether it was just unfinished or a trial... Interesting option for a clean one, though probably earlier than your 85ish date.

[adb968008]

On 08/08/2019 at 19:35, francoes said:

Hello all

Just thought I would post up some pictures of why I was asking previous questions.

These are my locos but cant take credit for the work.

A few finer details needed and might not be everybody's cup of tea but how I remember them. 

Wow !  That’s exactly how I remember them to !

[royaloak]

26 minutes ago, daveyb said:

They look very good. Was it a commercial weathering service or a friend?

 

As a one off, there was a pic of one the first 50s in LL on a test run ex-works from Doncaster (might have been 030 or 031) with big yellow ends but small nos and logos. No idea whether it was just unfinished or a trial... Interesting option for a clean one, though probably earlier than your 85ish date.

50023 had a test run to Newcastle sometime in July or August 1980 in that livery, a picture was posted in Rail Enthusiast at the time.

Edited August 13, 2019 by royaloak

[daveyb]

That's the pic I mean. I used to buy RE regularly then. I'd have never guessed it was as early as 1980!

[The Pilotman]

Only another 43 to go then...

[francoes]

Late 1980 seems to be the starting date for the large logo transformation in any guise although it seems rail blue can push into 83.At a push i am going for 85-86 obviously Monarch does not fit but having bought this ,its in there.Only another 43 to go?

Yes the next 7 are in progress,Achilles,Agincourt,Dauntless,Superb,Neptune,Temeraire and Eagle .That leaves another 14  that i have after that.I do have a problem with Hercules for this date range also.

Anyway i would say more of a friend.

My areas to work on as regards to finer weathering would be the wheel sets and bogies,far to clean for me and also the ETH/Jumper connectors,too red.

[MJI]

I remember them cleaner than that. But that was in early 80s

[GordonC]

On 13/08/2019 at 18:31, royaloak said:

50023 had a test run to Newcastle sometime in July or August 1980 in that livery, a picture was posted in Rail Enthusiast at the time.

 

It also only did its test run in that livery and the livery was corrected to normal Large Logo livery with grey roof and normal numbers for release to traffic

[Phil Mc]

I really should have picked a date range to work in, but I hadn't really planned on them all, it just kinda happened !!

They cover the last 10 years of regular service (83-93), with the exception of Exeter, which is in the condition of it's last mainline runs.

I will do 044 in a 'retro' condition at some point !!

& at least one of the GBRf liveried ones....

& 031 in INTERCITY livery....

 

Cheers,

Phil.

[BR Blue]

I picked 1987 to 1988 for mine although not all would have existed concurrently in the condition I have depicted them. Some like 50011 barely made it to this timeframe at all. 50049/50149 is the only one I have duplicated so far. I must take a picture like the previous post. I avoided the dark blue NSE versions altogether.

[adb968008]

On 23/09/2019 at 21:55, Phil Mc said:

I really should have picked a date range to work in, but I hadn't really planned on them all, it just kinda happened !!

They cover the last 10 years of regular service (83-93), with the exception of Exeter, which is in the condition of it's last mainline runs.

I will do 044 in a 'retro' condition at some point !!

& at least one of the GBRf liveried ones....

& 031 in INTERCITY livery....

 

Cheers,

Phil.

Absolutely fantastic.

 

Ive got the same idea for 50032 Courageous... great memories of it, with blue nameplate speeding through Clapham

[Phil Mc]

16 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Absolutely fantastic.

 

Ive got the same idea for 50032 Courageous... great memories of it, with blue nameplate speeding through Clapham

 

032 & 046 are the grubbiest two in my fleet, and probably the most run !!

 

Cheers,

Phil.