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Hornby Class 87 model to P4


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Has anyone attempted changing the new Hornby 87 model from OO to P4 at all?  If so, can I ask which wheels did you use, and how did you find the conversion?  I am assuming it cannot be a particularly difficult swap?

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I am assuming there are probably a limited number of P4 modellers working with OHL electrics.  

 

My plan therefore is to use Alan Gibson wheels to attempt a conversion.  The wheels on the 87s were 3' 9.5", but the AG website lists 4' as options for electrics.  Given that 0.5" relates to 0.16mm I cannot see that the difference will matter too much. 

 

First time that I've looked at P4 gauge, and the first time I've attempted a wheel set conversion, so any thoughts, comments, hints/tips etc would as ever be welcome.

 

Rich

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Guest teacupteacup

They'll string you up for .16mm in P4 :)

 

I'd imagine the guy who is doing Birmingham New Street in P4 has/Will be doing it. Can't remember his name.

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I’d check what dia the Hornby wheels are first in case fitting a different size might have an impact on any clearance issues or buffer ride height, as well as the actual axle dia. Often the latter isn’t a standard size or might be shouldered. The gears fitted may just be a tight push fit on them, or they might be splined.

 

These are all aspects that usually need looking at if a conversion pack has not been produced.

 

Izzy

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The wheels on the 87s were 3' 9.5", but the AG website lists 4' as options for electrics.  Given that 0.5" relates to 0.16mm I cannot see that the difference will matter too much.

 

 

No sure that I'm following your calculations; (there are 12 inches to the foot - not 10).

 

3'-9.5" at 4mm. scale equates to 15.166mm. diameter; 4'-0'' at 4mm. scale equates to 16.000mm. diameter.

 

The error in scale diameter would therefore be 16.000 - 15.166 = 0.834mm.; (2.5'' at full size).

 

I would say that such an error would be noticeable.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

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Hi guys,

Thanks for the input from you all, much appreciated.

 

They'll string you up for .16mm in P4 :)

I'd imagine the guy who is doing Birmingham New Street in P4 has/Will be doing it. Can't remember his name.

 

Haha! Your probably right about that, may be I should stop before I start!

 

Jim Smith Wright was/is doing BNS in P4

 

His site is here: http://www.p4newstreet.com/

 

I have not looked to see what, if anything he has done to the Hornby 87, but the site is worth a look anyway, no matter what you are modelling.

 

Regards

 

Ian

 

Thanks Ian - I've spoken with Jim, having followed his New Street project for ages.  He's not looking at the Hornby 87 at all, but did say that the Heljan 86 has 2mm axles so 3' 8" coach or tender wheels can be used for that one - they 87 may of course be similar.

 

I’d check what dia the Hornby wheels are first in case fitting a different size might have an impact on any clearance issues or buffer ride height, as well as the actual axle dia. Often the latter isn’t a standard size or might be shouldered. The gears fitted may just be a tight push fit on them, or they might be splined.

These are all aspects that usually need looking at if a conversion pack has not been produced.

Izzy

 

Thanks Izzy - this is all a little new to me, so very grateful for your advice.  I'll wait until the model arrives in the next couple of days and measure up the existing wheel sets before ordering.  

 

No sure that I'm following your calculations; (there are 12 inches to the foot - not 10).

 

3'-9.5" at 4mm. scale equates to 15.166mm. diameter; 4'-0'' at 4mm. scale equates to 16.000mm. diameter.

 

The error in scale diameter would therefore be 16.000 - 15.166 = 0.834mm.; (2.5'' at full size).

 

I would say that such an error would be noticeable.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

 

Thats one of the duh, stupidity moments isn't it when you realise such a rooky mistake!  Cheers for pointing that out John, yes almost a mm may well be noticeable. I'll report back once I've done some measuring of the existing wheels.  

 

For anyone that has converted to EM or P4 before, do you find any issues with the slightly wider wheel sets causing problems with the bogie frames at all?

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My first rule with these P4 conversions (I started in the early 1980’s with the ring field type Hornby diesels), is that there are no rules when it comes down to doing them. Some are easy and quick - especially when 2mm axles are involved - and others.....are not.

 

In recent times the departure from the ‘standard’ sizes of 1/8” or 2mm axles I.e. much of China production, means more fiddling around is needed. Indeed until you strip a model down there is no particular guarantee of what sizes you might find. Generally there is enough room between the bogie frames, but take nothing for granted. You need of course 22mm+ to normally clear a P4 wheelset.

 

Even if 2mm axles are used be aware that when wheels use this size it might be a nominal value. This is particularly so when gears are a force fit on the originals, but not so on the replacements you intended to use.......

 

Have fun!........

 

Izzy

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