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Heljan announce re-tooled Class 86 in OO


Andy Y
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According to Kernow's facebook page Heljan have a newly developed Bracknell Willes  high speed pan for some of these forthcoming 86/4, 86/6 loco. But which loco get's which pan?

 

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22 minutes ago, Markwj said:

Are those printed on jumper cables on the front?

It looks like they are.  I really hope this wont make it to production like that.

Clutching defeat from the jaws of victory yet again.

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I think the RES colours look good, but otherwise it's a huge disappointment IMO. The jumper cables look as terrible as the original run of Heljan 86s, and the blanking plates on the ends covering the old MU cable attachment points look printed. Heljan, please rethink these! I was expecting to buy many 86/4, 86/6 and eventually 86/2s, but on the basis of this, I won't buy any at all.

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Echoing other comments re the jumper cables. May be a deal breaker for the heritage blue one, though they may scrub off, and I'm becoming a dab hand at scratchbuilding them. The intercity one is slightly earlier vintage, so will wait and see for that one. It does look good apart from the end details.

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Also looks like the rainstrips over the cab doors havent changed either.

On Heljan facebook page they repeatedly say the jumper cables arent printed but are moulded detail.  Not impressed with moulded detail on cab fronts. On top of that windows are poor too.

Good news is at least the holes for the handrails look better.

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10 minutes ago, The Ghost of IKB said:

Also looks like the rainstrips over the cab doors havent changed either.

On Heljan facebook page they repeatedly say the jumper cables arent printed but are moulded detail.  Not impressed with moulded detail on cab fronts. On top of that windows are poor too.

Good news is at least the holes for the handrails look better.

They were moulded on the original Heljan release too, but they are so 'square' and unflowing that it ruins the look for me. They really should be separately fitted a-la Hornby 67, 87 etc. Makes a huge difference to how they look.

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19 minutes ago, The Ghost of IKB said:

Also looks like the rainstrips over the cab doors havent changed either.

On Heljan facebook page they repeatedly say the jumper cables arent printed but are moulded detail.  Not impressed with moulded detail on cab fronts. On top of that windows are poor too.

Good news is at least the holes for the handrails look better.

Ooh, I didn’t notice the rainstrips. Though I have a fix for that.

 

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2 hours ago, 97406 said:

Ooh, I didn’t notice the rainstrips. Though I have a fix for that.

 

At first I couldn’t work out whether there was a rain strip error, or just an orange line issue. Seems there’s both. 
 

this is, once again, so close to being a great model, I hope it’s not rushed from here

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  • RMweb Gold

Rainstrip is definitely not right, that cab corner roof moulding looks a bit rough too.


Lower down at the cab front is a cover (is that for sand ?) anyway is it latched / hinged the wrong way around for the RES sample shown ? Looking at various pictures I don't find a common standard, and and some 86/6s have a totally different cover.

 

One to watch carefully is the Door kick plate on some its the same number of ribs as the footstep kick plate, on others, a second door handle was added at floor grab height reducing those ribs on the door plate.

 

Really hope the cables arent printed on.. thats back to Hornby of the 1990’s.. and lets face it the Hornby model wasnt that bad, it just needs a few tweaks, if you have to re-make those tweaks are you doing it on a £50 s/h one, or a £160+ new one ?


if these areas can be tightened up it’ll be a good un.

 

 

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Cables aren’t printed on according to their FB page where a lot of people have asked same.

they are raised moulded detail. I’m not sure why they wouldn’t be a separate item .

 

 

5CC1DCA6-889F-4BB5-8887-41E190E07DEF.png

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2 hours ago, rob D2 said:

Cables aren’t printed on according to their FB page where a lot of people have asked same.

they are raised moulded detail. I’m not sure why they wouldn’t be a separate item .

 

 

5CC1DCA6-889F-4BB5-8887-41E190E07DEF.png

There’s bolt heads, but the former MU blanking plates and the upper RCH plates need to be raised compared to the rest of the cab front. I hope the old style MU-fitted ones have separate fittings, plus the early RCH fittings were positioned slightly differently.

 

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3 hours ago, rob D2 said:

Cables aren’t printed on according to their FB page where a lot of people have asked same.

they are raised moulded detail. I’m not sure why they wouldn’t be a separate item .

 

 

5CC1DCA6-889F-4BB5-8887-41E190E07DEF.png

very surprised you haven't seen another issue with the marker lights in former route indicator box area 

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Not quite sure why people are having conniptions over the RCH jumpers and blanking plates when Heljan have clearly stated, multiple times, they will be moulded in relief.  This is obviously a test model.  If I was Heljan, frankly I wouldn't bother putting up images of test models knowing how too many keyboard warriors with a wasp up their knickers about Heljan will pile in and blithely ignore the accompanying text just so they can feel good about having a dig at Heljan.

However, if Heljan Ben is reading this can I suggest the Inter City Executive model is based on one of the locos that didn't have the full depth grey band under the cab windows, rather than the one they have chosen?  Very few 86/4s had the full depth grey band over the marker lights, very early on BR moved to keeping the whole cab front area below the cab windows yellow, and if Heljan release the ICX 86/4 with the full yellow end, it would probably increase sales as people will be able to renumber them into other examples without having to splash non-matching yellow paint over the front.  Like me wanting a model of "Wulfruna"...

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29 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

Not quite sure why people are having conniptions over the RCH jumpers and blanking plates when Heljan have clearly stated, multiple times, they will be moulded in relief.  This is obviously a test model.  If I was Heljan, frankly I wouldn't bother putting up images of test models knowing how too many keyboard warriors with a wasp up their knickers about Heljan will pile in and blithely ignore the accompanying text just so they can feel good about having a dig at Heljan.

However, if Heljan Ben is reading this can I suggest the Inter City Executive model is based on one of the locos that didn't have the full depth grey band under the cab windows, rather than the one they have chosen?  Very few 86/4s had the full depth grey band over the marker lights, very early on BR moved to keeping the whole cab front area below the cab windows yellow, and if Heljan release the ICX 86/4 with the full yellow end, it would probably increase sales as people will be able to renumber them into other examples without having to splash non-matching yellow paint over the front.  Like me wanting a model of "Wulfruna"...

I think the full yellow end was adopted on those that didn’t have a headlight fitted originally, however the lines became blurred later, and some were still outshopped with the grey band very late in the 80s, the original 86501 (ex-86258) being one of them.

As for the front end detail, I have 2 on order, and would prefer for them to be as close as possible, hence the feedback given, rather than keeping quiet and they end up staying like that. Especially as removing and replacing details on the executive liveried one will be trickier than on a plain yellow end, though it would perhaps become a full yellow end in the process. However I do prefer the look of the grey band after years of banger blue.

Edited by 97406
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8 hours ago, rob D2 said:

Cables aren’t printed on according to their FB page where a lot of people have asked same.

they are raised moulded detail. I’m not sure why they wouldn’t be a separate item .

 

 

5CC1DCA6-889F-4BB5-8887-41E190E07DEF.png

 

Apologies if it has already been mentioned. But to my eyes the tail lights look to be too large in diameter and makes the marker lights look too small. I also noticed the buffer shanks should be stepped if they are portraying the Oleo buffers.

Edited by RP82
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23 hours ago, Markwj said:

Are those printed on jumper cables on the front?

 The MW jumper plates and TDM parts are raised moulded details, not printed, complete with bolt head detail. Please see the photo below (the orange deco is a mistake and will be corrected before production starts).

Emphatically not. They were on some of the first run of Heljan 86s but we’ve moved beyond that now. 
Unfortunately the raised details are not obvious in the heavily compressed photos on Facebook. 
We’ve tooled two different bodies to cater for MW/TDM and TDM only locos, which covers most requirements except the very early conversions with MW cables and no headlights. 
 

As always, happy to clarify such things as they arise. 
 

Hope this helps. 
 

Ben

1A56B446-E4FB-41D9-BE7D-77FF6B35DBC7.jpeg

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5 hours ago, wombatofludham said:

Not quite sure why people are having conniptions over the RCH jumpers and blanking plates when Heljan have clearly stated, multiple times, they will be moulded in relief.  This is obviously a test model.  If I was Heljan, frankly I wouldn't bother putting up images of test models knowing how too many keyboard warriors with a wasp up their knickers about Heljan will pile in and blithely ignore the accompanying text just so they can feel good about having a dig at Heljan.

However, if Heljan Ben is reading this can I suggest the Inter City Executive model is based on one of the locos that didn't have the full depth grey band under the cab windows, rather than the one they have chosen?  Very few 86/4s had the full depth grey band over the marker lights, very early on BR moved to keeping the whole cab front area below the cab windows yellow, and if Heljan release the ICX 86/4 with the full yellow end, it would probably increase sales as people will be able to renumber them into other examples without having to splash non-matching yellow paint over the front.  Like me wanting a model of "Wulfruna"...

Not sure why you are having “ conniptions “ ( WTF ?) about people pointing stuff out.

I know nothing about class 86s, and I don’t want one , but I have been collecting  models for 25 years and I’m surprised that cables aren’t modelled by cables. 
 

it looks a bit poor if that is the final result - and there won’t be amendments to the tooling if they’ve reached the final decorated sample stage.

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8 minutes ago, 61661 said:

Emphatically not. They were on some of the first run of Heljan 86s but we’ve moved beyond that now. 
Unfortunately the raised details are not obvious in the heavily compressed photos on Facebook. 
We’ve tooled two different bodies to cater for MW/TDM and TDM only locos, which covers most requirements except the very early conversions with MW cables and no headlights. 
 

As always, happy to clarify such things as they arise. 
 

Hope this helps. 
 

Ben

1A56B446-E4FB-41D9-BE7D-77FF6B35DBC7.jpeg

Ooh, that’s better! One request I have is if the cables themselves could be separate fittings rather than moulded, though I will replace mine if not. 

Edited by 97406
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5 minutes ago, rob D2 said:

Not sure why you are having “ conniptions “ ( WTF ?) about people pointing stuff out.

I know nothing about class 86s, and I don’t want one , but I have been collecting  models for 25 years and I’m surprised that cables aren’t modelled by cables. 
 

it looks a bit poor if that is the final result - and there won’t be amendments to the tooling if they’ve reached the final decorated sample stage.

And it’s not a dig at Heljan. Far from it. I have lots of their products and will continue to keep buying them, including the new 86s when they come out. The 86s are one of my favourite locos of all time.

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7 minutes ago, 97406 said:

Ooh, that’s better! One request I have is if the cables themselves could be separate fittings rather than moulded, though I will replace mine if not. 

Not at this stage unfortunately. Tooling is fixed and we’re moving through the deco stage. So far I’ve received messages asking for them to be printed cables(!), separate cables and saying they’re OK as they are, so it’s obviously a subjective thing. We can’t please everyone! 
However, given the feedback we’ll investigate whether it’s possible/practical to have separate cables on future releases.

 

Ben

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8 minutes ago, 61661 said:

Not at this stage unfortunately. Tooling is fixed and we’re moving through the deco stage. So far I’ve received messages asking for them to be printed cables(!), separate cables and saying they’re OK as they are, so it’s obviously a subjective thing. We can’t please everyone! 
However, given the feedback we’ll investigate whether it’s possible/practical to have separate cables on future releases.

 

Ben

I’ll get me scalpel, plus the wire from the inside of sandwich bag ties makes for good cables. At least the other fittings look OK, the Hattons pic sold it short. 

From the example picture of the real thing, the executive one has just the older-style MW jumpers on it anyway. 86426 looked a right dogs dinner in service with both, so look forward to seeing what you make with that one.

Edited by 97406
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2 hours ago, 61661 said:

Not at this stage unfortunately. Tooling is fixed and we’re moving through the deco stage. So far I’ve received messages asking for them to be printed cables(!), separate cables and saying they’re OK as they are, so it’s obviously a subjective thing. We can’t please everyone! 
However, given the feedback we’ll investigate whether it’s possible/practical to have separate cables on future releases.

 

Ben

Hi Ben,

 

Great to have your insight on here, and responding directly to people.

 

I think for me, it's a bit of a shame because it looks very much like the first batch in terms of the TDM cables. I have several myself, and you can feel the cables with your finger nail, so they are definitely moulded on the original batch too. But I find the thing that most makes them look odd is their uniformity - they don't look like a loose cable with a very regimented, square, S shape. Again, this is as per the original batch. 

 

To me (appreciating they are not the same prototype), the Hornby 87 looks much more natural than the Heljan 86 with regards to the TDM cables.

 

Wishing Heljan luck with these, but if I'm brutally honest, I had much higher hopes for these and I'm left thinking it's unlikely I'll purchase any for the time being. I just think the 'face' doesn't look quite right and I'm not sure I have the skill to rectify it!

16274128519167234933566085037032.jpg

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