Popular Post Prometheus Posted November 21, 2018 Popular Post Share Posted November 21, 2018 A box of Triang Clerestories had been nagging me for surgery for quite some time and I'd been looking around for an interesting early GWR coach to bash from them. I didn't want another Clerestory and was looking for a short, low-roofed bogie coach, similar to those which once ran on the Burry Port and Gwendraeth Valley Railway and which, as a schoolboy, I sometimes saw stabled outside Cardiff General.Googling around, I found an interesting RMWeb blog from early 2016, written by Rosie's Boss, showing a conversion of a standard Triang Clerestory Brake Third into quite a reasonable approximation of a GWR Brake Third to Dia. D15. So, whilst I can't take credit for an original bash [and am grateful for the inspiration], it suited my needs and I rather like it, too. Brake pull rods have yet to be fashioned [i've just noticed!]. Triang could have never imagined what a resource their Clerestories were to become: has any other r-t-r provided such scope for surgery? Tony 21 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold nickwood Posted November 22, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 22, 2018 Nice job Tony. The paintwork looks superb. The main compromise you appear to have made is in keeping the three panels either side of the rear doors, the D15's only had two, albeit they were much wider. You do appear to have addressed the positioning of the guards duckets though which should be opposite each other not offset like on the Triang donors. I am in the process of making a pair of D15's. The bodies are complete and ready priming however I have done the opposite to you and removed the panel strips and made new ones out of 10thou strip to make two panels but have left the duckets offset. I've also gone a little further on the ends and removed the handrails and steps and adding then back in brass wire and etched steps. I'm interested to know how you have done the roof and the glazing? I have tried bending plasticard for the roof but I'm not happy with it and I'm currently waiting for a friend to have a go at 3D printing the roof section. The glazing looks like it is almost flush ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted November 23, 2018 Author Share Posted November 23, 2018 (edited) Thanks for your comments nickwood - much appreciated. You are quite right: there are too many panels in this compromise build. I didn't bother posting the link to my build blog for this coach as it pretty much - in essence anyway - follows that of Rosie's Boss back in 2016. In it, I acknowledged the fact that the coach was a little over-length as a consequence but even though I had quite a fine razor saw, it was not fine enough to remove the errant panels without creating a cosmetic disaster, one which no amount of careful filling could subsequently address. So, I aimed for what someone else on here aptly once coined, a 'train set' result, not a show-case model. The glazing: SouthEast Finecast Triang Clerestory flush-glazing. Cheap and cheerful and, once fitted, all the better for a coat of Johnson's Klear on both sides [to improve the clarity / transparency]. The roof: this was my greatest concern at the outset. In my blog I said that I intended using stiff card [somewhat reluctantly] as bending plastic card to the correct profile along the entire length of the body seemed a bridge too far. However, half-way through the project I purchased [for a fiver] a poorly constructed D&S Models Dean Passenger Luggage Van, a 40 footer. The roof from this was perfect, almost an exact fit [so close you could not tell] and to the correct profile. It needed some attention, repairs and rain strips, but it has worked well. I wish that I could find a proprietary roof with this profile for other coaches. The D&S kit also provided the bogies, although they needed considerable attention for them to be usable. They were also assembled to P4 standards and so the wheelsets required re-gauging and some desoldering was necessary to allow this to happen. The coach runs beautifully smoothly however on its compensated underpinnings. I am kicking myself for not removing the moulded end handrails. They are simple enough to construct out of wire and look so much better. The twin gas tanks are 5 amp fuses. They actually look the part[ish] once painted. Tony Edited November 23, 2018 by Prometheus 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
88D Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 Thanks for your comments nickwood - much appreciated. You are quite right: there are too many panels in this compromise build. I didn't bother posting the link to my build blog for this coach as it pretty much - in essence anyway - follows that of Rosie's Boss back in 2016. In it, I acknowledged the fact that the coach was a little over-length as a consequence but even though I had quite a fine razor saw, it was not fine enough to remove the errant panels without creating a cosmetic disaster, one which no amount of careful filling could subsequently address. So, I aimed for what someone else on here aptly once coined, a 'train set' result, not a show-case model. The glazing: SouthEast Finecast Triang Clerestory flush-glazing. Cheap and cheerful and, once fitted, all the better for a coat of Johnson's Klear on both sides [to improve the clarity / transparency]. The roof: this was my greatest concern at the outset. In my blog I said that I intended using stiff card [somewhat reluctantly] as bending plastic card to the correct profile along the entire length of the body seemed a bridge too far. However, half-way through the project I purchased [for a fiver] a poorly constructed D&S Models Dean Passenger Luggage Van, a 40 footer. The roof from this was perfect, almost an exact fit [so close you could not tell] and to the correct profile. It needed some attention, repairs and rain strips, but it has worked well. I wish that I could find a proprietary roof with this profile for other coaches. The D&S kit also provided the bogies, although they needed considerable attention for them to be usable. They were also assembled to P4 standards and so the wheelsets required re-gauging and some desoldering was necessary to allow this to happen. The coach runs beautifully smoothly however on its compensated underpinnings. I am kicking myself for not removing the moulded end handrails. They are simple enough to construct out of wire and look so much better. The twin gas tanks are 5 amp fuses. They actually look the part[ish] once painted. Tony Brilliant ruse to use 5A fuses. I shall try it —-but being a cheapskate, I shall use 3A fuses in the hope they are a halfpenny cheaper! Been living in Yorkshire too long! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rovex Posted November 23, 2018 Share Posted November 23, 2018 Brilliant ruse to use 5A fuses. I shall try it —-but being a cheapskate, I shall use 3A fuses in the hope they are a halfpenny cheaper! Been living in Yorkshire too long! You can't possibly live in Yorkshire too long. ☺ 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jcm@gwr Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 Brilliant ruse to use 5A fuses. I shall try it —-but being a cheapskate, I shall use 3A fuses in the hope they are a halfpenny cheaper! Been living in Yorkshire too long! Blown fuses are cheaper! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Budgie Posted November 24, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 24, 2018 Blown fuses are cheaper! You could wait a long time for your fuses to blow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
88D Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 Blown fuses are cheaper! Are you from Stevenage in Yorkshire? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted November 24, 2018 Share Posted November 24, 2018 Beautiful paint job. I have to go and find a Clerestory brake now to put under the knife!(Well, razor saw) 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted November 25, 2018 Author Share Posted November 25, 2018 (edited) Thank you Lofty. Be sure to post! One thing that has surprised me though is the gradual rise in price for these coaches: they used to be two-a-penny, they ‘aint no more. I’ll not pay more than a tenner (inc postage) for one although many have starting prices in the 20’s and even 30’s. Tony Edited November 25, 2018 by Prometheus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fleetfoot Mike Posted November 28, 2018 Share Posted November 28, 2018 (edited) So, I aimed for what someone else on here aptly once coined, a 'train set' result, not a show-case model. The wargamers' term for it is 'passes the two foot test'. Nice job, though: I am suitably inspired (*eyes ever-growing eBay saved search list*). Edited November 28, 2018 by Fleetfoot Mike 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnarcher Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 (edited) Could you post a link to that original blog, I've had a quick google to no avail. Edited December 9, 2018 by johnarcher Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Prism Posted December 9, 2018 Share Posted December 9, 2018 https://srmg.org.uk/a-cambrian-brake/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 I’ve gone for the two panel route but got a paint reaction so am currently gently sanding things back. Will post a pic when I get it to a reasonable state. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted December 10, 2018 Share Posted December 10, 2018 Oh! I found the Keyser K14/ Siphon F roof is a pretty good match and with a bit of fettling and new gas tops should pass muster Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dana Ashdown Posted December 12, 2018 Share Posted December 12, 2018 Hello Lofty. You can use the original roof for the altered body. After cutting the original clerestory roof to length, glue a couple of reinforcing pieces across the lower roof sides, so the two sides are joined independent of the clerestory. This is optional, but it helps prevent the roof from coming to pieces during the alterations. Next, take a razor saw and cut the clerestory off, following along where the sides and ends of the clerestory meet the lower roof. This is fairly easy to do and, if you're careful, you should only have a little bit sticking up. The offending edges can be filed off. Now that the clerestory has been removed, cut a piece of thin plastic card stock (I used Evergreen .010 inch if I remember correctly), to the length of the roof and wider than the opening, so it overlaps the roof sides. Glue this in place. With the plastic card securely glued, you can then fair the edges with a sharp knife, file or sandpaper, until you have a smooth transition. The thin card is strong enough by itself, but if you plan to drill through it you might want to reinforce it from below. Otherwise, that's it. Dana Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted December 12, 2018 Author Share Posted December 12, 2018 Thanks for that post Dana - I had wondered about trying that but decided that it would probably just fall apart. I'll try it now. I also bought some Roxey Mouldings vac formed roofs to try those in the next build. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lofty1966 Posted December 13, 2018 Share Posted December 13, 2018 Thanx Dana for the info. I'll be using the Keyser roof as it's pretty close and won't require to much settling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted December 16, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 16, 2018 The coaches you remember stabled outside Cardiff General may have been Clifton Downs autos, especially if you saw them on the 'strawberry sidings' on the south side of the station by the Riverside (Clarence Road) branch. Some of these ended up in the area and worked until the early 1950s, and autos were stabled on these sidings over weekends. Nice coach, though; I'd be more than happy with that as a D15 on Cwmdimbath. I have a 3 coach set of Triang shorties worked up to represent a miner's workman's, with replacement buffers and ersatz Dean bogies (the original B1s with the tie bars cut off and wooden footboards added). These probably don't pass a 2 foot rule, but might manage at 3... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted December 16, 2018 Author Share Posted December 16, 2018 The coaches you remember stabled outside Cardiff General may have been Clifton Downs autos, especially if you saw them on the 'strawberry sidings' on the south side of the station by the Riverside (Clarence Road) branch. Some of these ended up in the area and worked until the early 1950s, and autos were stabled on these sidings over weekends. Nice coach, though; I'd be more than happy with that as a D15 on Cwmdimbath. I have a 3 coach set of Triang shorties worked up to represent a miner's workman's, with replacement buffers and ersatz Dean bogies (the original B1s with the tie bars cut off and wooden footboards added). These probably don't pass a 2 foot rule, but might manage at 3... '...might manage at 3...': that's good enough for me! You could be right about those coaches although when i saw them [twice], they were stabled on the north side of the station in a siding just to the west of that splendid water tower, the same siding that seemed to hold some bogie Siphons for ages and ages. This would have been around '58, '59 or '60 though, so it could have been too late. Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 Hello Lofty. You can use the original roof for the altered body. After cutting the original clerestory roof to length, glue a couple of reinforcing pieces across the lower roof sides, so the two sides are joined independent of the clerestory. This is optional, but it helps prevent the roof from coming to pieces during the alterations. Next, take a razor saw and cut the clerestory off, following along where the sides and ends of the clerestory meet the lower roof. This is fairly easy to do and, if you're careful, you should only have a little bit sticking up. The offending edges can be filed off. Now that the clerestory has been removed, cut a piece of thin plastic card stock (I used Evergreen .010 inch if I remember correctly), to the length of the roof and wider than the opening, so it overlaps the roof sides. Glue this in place. With the plastic card securely glued, you can then fair the edges with a sharp knife, file or sandpaper, until you have a smooth transition. The thin card is strong enough by itself, but if you plan to drill through it you might want to reinforce it from below. Otherwise, that's it. Dana I did this years ago, but used car body filler to fill the gap Over the years it has shrunk (which doesn't say much for the product), so I'll have to do it again. I'll use plastic this time. There are various roofs available, but they are all slightly different in profile. In addition the K's one is very thick and needs to be scraped down. It isn't even a particularly good fit for the K14/15/16/25 van and SIPHON F it's intended for. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 (edited) I have just completed one and will post photos in due course. I braced the bottom with 4 squares of 2mm plastic card, packed out the centre with a long strip of the same, overlaid .010 plastic card and then commenced the long, painstaking and quite tedious process of scraping, sanding, priming, sanding, priming and sanding until I got what I wanted. And do you know what? It worked! Tony Edited December 21, 2018 by Prometheus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 (edited) Here's the roofwork...... Starting point: Reinforced from below [before clerestory section razor-sawed out]: Clerestory removed and gap packed out from above with 2mm card: .010 plastic sheet overlayed and endlessly scraped/sanded back with primer sprayed in between to check progress: Near final finished state with one or two very small areas of dressing still to attend to: It's near to impossible to completely remove all signs of the overlay and I wouldn't want to do too many of these but the finished product has a nice profile and fits perfectly. Once sprayed matt black it'll be fine. Tony Edited December 21, 2018 by Prometheus 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brighty1674 Posted December 21, 2018 Share Posted December 21, 2018 Hi....I was just wondering if the Branchlines universal brass roof may be any good, it is 260mm long and I have used them a number of times and found them very good, hope it helps......Dave..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Prometheus Posted December 21, 2018 Author Share Posted December 21, 2018 Dave - is the profile of the brass roof anything like that of my post of the 22Nov above? Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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