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Hornby - New tooling - LMS Princess class


Andy Y
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On 21/08/2019 at 00:10, Buhar said:

The LMS had installed a trough at Strawfrank near Carstairs but I don't know if one was put in on the flat bit between Carlisle and Gretna Junction. If there wasn't, then the pick up at Dillicar needed to see you over both Shap and Beattock. 

 

There were troughs at Floriston on the stretch between Carlisle and Gretna. They appear to have been installed at the same time as the ones at Strawfrank, i.e. about 1927.

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9 hours ago, robmcg said:

I'm curious. Did Hornby say they were producing three styles of tender for the new Princess models, and if so was one of them the original 1933 flat-sided one?

 

I see 6201 will have vacuum pump on cross-head, lovely, and there are two styles of firebox in the EP photos...   I presume the 1934-5 changes to boiler and superheater etc would have some external evidence?

 

I look forward to this model...

 

6201_princess_r3709_1_2abc_r1466.jpg.83d7ac13df890363253e96d4dcfa7ada.jpg

 

 

The three tenders will most likely be

 

9 ton Stanier

10 ton Stanier

10 ton Stanier with Coal pusher (46206 had this)

 

Though they may do the original tenders that 6200 and 6201 carried though the three above would be the safe bet.

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20 hours ago, Brocp said:

The three tenders will most likely be

 

9 ton Stanier

10 ton Stanier

10 ton Stanier with Coal pusher (46206 had this)

 

Though they may do the original tenders that 6200 and 6201 carried though the three above would be the safe bet.

 

You are probably right.  They did do the watercart tender for the N15 back in about 2010 which was quite unusual. But a complete early Princess tender might be a bridge too far....

 

The early powered tender fitted to some 6200 models in the past looks maybe the same as the LMS 4P Compound...  and as far as I know it was rather 'representative' and anything vaguely right would never please today's critics! 

 

Edit; here is an approximation of what an early version might look like, courtesy a bit of PSP6 editing.

 

6201_princess_elizabeth_fowler_tender_2abcd_r1500.jpg.41e176007f6a03d0aa2d2f9bd4b1945e.jpg

 

pic edited, will remove if required.

Edited by robmcg
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17th - 18th August 2019 saw Hornby Hobbies open their doors to the public for their first Open Weekend, held at their headquarters in Margate.
The 2 day event Celebrated Hornby's return to Margate with the first official public viewing of the 1:1 Locomotive Collection, which is curated in parted of the old factory, along with a selection of layouts and displays, including my WW1 Trench Railway - "Amiens 1918" and my Hornby Micro Layout - "Winters End". The Hornby Team were also on hand at the event, greeting visitors, and displaying some of their latest products and projects, from the vast Hornby Hobbies range.  
In this video we take a look at the Hornby Stand, featuring Models such as the latest prototypes for the up and coming Princess Class 4-6-2, the eagerly anticipated B2 Pecketts and popular Coca Cola Train Set, plus much more! 
Hope you enjoy!

 

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Any comments on the front bogie pivoting arrangement on the forthcoming Princess.

It doesn't look at all prototypical of elegant to me. Hopefully the production models will have a central pivot,

like Hornby's excellent Bulleid pacifics.

 

Still taken from Callum's video, hope that's OK.

P1380997.JPG

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3 hours ago, SDJR7F88 said:

17th - 18th August 2019 saw Hornby Hobbies open their doors to the public for their first Open Weekend, held at their headquarters in Margate.
The 2 day event Celebrated Hornby's return to Margate with the first official public viewing of the 1:1 Locomotive Collection, which is curated in parted of the old factory, along with a selection of layouts and displays, including my WW1 Trench Railway - "Amiens 1918" and my Hornby Micro Layout - "Winters End". The Hornby Team were also on hand at the event, greeting visitors, and displaying some of their latest products and projects, from the vast Hornby Hobbies range.  
In this video we take a look at the Hornby Stand, featuring Models such as the latest prototypes for the up and coming Princess Class 4-6-2, the eagerly anticipated B2 Pecketts and popular Coca Cola Train Set, plus much more! 
Hope you enjoy!

 

 

Thanks for that video SDJR7F88,  I hope you don't mind I've taken a still or two of it  of the new Princess models... which I think I and many others eagerly await.

 

Image21a_Hornby_Princess_2019.jpg.4b351bcc91d4a92022d8b1d2aeef3a47.jpg

 

 

Image31a_Hornby_Princess_2019.jpg.cad3840337b2ec5af85ab44324e33067.jpg

 

of course there will be many more finishing touches... here is my edited speculation..  For this I used a current tooling 46208 and scaled-down drivers from a Duchess, among other things.

 

6201_princess_portrait21_20abcdef_r1500.jpg.518ad5c8860b18400e13b12663abd20a.jpg

 

 

Edited by robmcg
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14 hours ago, trevor7598 said:

Any comments on the front bogie pivoting arrangement on the forthcoming Princess.

It doesn't look at all prototypical of elegant to me. Hopefully the production models will have a central pivot,

like Hornby's excellent Bulleid pacifics.

 

Still taken from Callum's video, hope that's OK.

P1380997.JPG

Standard Hornby front bogie mount which is an extension from the main chassis block. It is pivoting from the correct point and the false frame sides will cover the bracket. Same arrangement as the Duchess and other recent  Hornby models. 

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4 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Just posted on Facebook. 

32DEE792-6800-4573-A3F1-E91101EDCB9F.png

 

I'm very curious!   It's great to see this progress,

 

... soon I will find out whether or not my edited pics of 6201 in 1935 condition bear any resemblance to the model! I used a 2001-tooling 6201 and scaled down Duchess wheels and other bits and pieces to create the pics.

 

will remove if required.

 

6201_Princess_Portrait5_rain_1abcdefg_r1500.jpg.f2f3ac1cdd0a6307412767d70ca1dc34.jpg

 

6201_Princess_Portrait15_rain_3abcd_1500.jpg.33b58d19890c3f4e0cfe7ee7ac0e6f85.jpg

 

cheers

 

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I  am all a-tither with excitement, a close look at the previously shown video a few messages back shows there are already front bogie and front frame mouldings in the making, on the version with vacuum pump on crosshead and bump on smokebox side above handrail... the bogie has the horizontal rod along its lower edge too.  This combination of short firebox, bump on smokebox upper rear,  and crosshead could be early model Princess 6200 or 6201?

 

But neither 6200 or 6201 had a domed boiler until, I think, late 1934 for 6201. 

 

Image12a.jpg.dca0fbda74e7ab226d565a84606a28a1.jpg

 

I shall have consult my books (out of reach right now)  but I know that all the Princesses changed boilers from domed to non-dome regularly, and I'm not sure if the firebox length changed too, nor when the bump on the smokebox all but disappeared, or did disappear..

 

Someone might know?

 

Hornby have certainly got the bases covered. Long firebox (top) and shorter (bottom), and there will be variations in reversing levers,  lubricators and various hardware fittings, and valve gear mounts.  Who'd be a product developer?  :)  The various combinations are eye-watering, brain-curdling stuff.

 

Image41a.jpg.c7dab0ff5d147c8cdc2a45a998a56d0a.jpg

 

Dunno what that green engine at the bottom is.  Probably some industrial shunter or something....

 

Still, we will all know on Friday! 

 

Cheers 

 

edit; never seen this before...

 

6201_princess_Image4_1abcde_r1500a.jpg.a8205ecba707bbce7ce34ee86fc33448.jpg

 

 

If you modelled it like that people would say, 'didn't exist'...   :) the photo was from a google search, I did not add the chimney.

 

 

Edited by robmcg
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8 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Fowler tender too - never seen that on a Pacific.

 

Although reading back through the thread, there are a few images of it....

 

Did she actually run with that tender or just pose for some press photos?

 

It's a hybrid Fowler/Stanier 4000 gallon tender. Soon rebuilt into a normal 4000 gallon.

 

 

 

Jason

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On ‎25‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 19:24, trevor7598 said:

Any comments on the front bogie pivoting arrangement on the forthcoming Princess...

 

On ‎26‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 09:28, MikeParkin65 said:

Standard Hornby front bogie mount which is an extension from the main chassis block. It is pivoting from the correct point and the false frame sides will cover the bracket. Same arrangement as the Duchess and other recent  Hornby models. 

Absolutely, this has been the standard method for bogies on all of Hornby's completely newly tooled models, certainly since the A4 and A3, and works very well; especially when it is remembered that the model will be expected to stay on the rails on the unfeasibly small radii of set track, and to negotiate abrupt incline transitions. (Hornby usually forget to install a soft spring, despite often showing one on their assembly diagram, but that's an easy user addition.)

 

On ‎25‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 19:24, trevor7598 said:

...It doesn't look at all prototypical or elegant to me...

 

BUT, and it is a big but, this loco has the wrong layout of cylinders to neatly conceal the unprototypical model gubbins on which the bogie pivots. The Princess is a King as far as the cylinder layout is concerned, so it is to that Hornby model that comparison should be made, for how well the model's bogie mounting can be concealed. It can probably never be quite as well done as on a proper pacific, with the cylinders so elegantly disposed between the bogie wheels, thus neatly interposing a large 'blocker'  which fully conceals the untruth within. (If Hornby can make this look good, quelle horreur!we may still be in for one of unsteady Eddie's creations, which take pacific inelegance to a whole new level...)

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19 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Fowler tender too - never seen that on a Pacific.

 

Although reading back through the thread, there are a few images of it....

 

Did she actually run with that tender or just pose for some press photos?

It has been mentioned earlier on here that they were probably not just standard Fowler tenders, although they looked like it.

 

6200/6201 were the class prototypes, built in 1933. They had some differences including their tenders & round front buffers. I believe they both ran like this but I am not sure how long for.

The others in the class did not appear for a further 2 years. I would expect changes such as tender & buffers to have been made in the mean time.

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On 27/08/2019 at 17:09, MikeParkin65 said:

Just posted on Facebook. 

 

What looks like an open fire-hole door  (with separately moulded lever mechanism). Operating firebox glow?

 

Back to the days of of the Tri-ang M7. Yay!

Edited by Porcy Mane
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4 hours ago, robmcg said:

 

Hmmmmm....

 

I don't know if I'd want to pay so much for something with the keeping qualities of a Lancia Beta or one of Hornbys Mazak Rot fleet.

 

This is what it should look like inside!

http://www.tri-ang.co.uk/OONew/chassis462Early.htm

 

It would be nice to know if it had the XO1 disc commutator motor too, or the slightly later XO3

 

Edited by Hroth
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