Hornby - New tooling - 57' Bow-ended suburban coaches

[M.I.B]

It is a custom job from Railtec

[eastglosmog]

Finally succumbed today and cheered up my local model shop by buying the Birmingham Division set. Noticed an oddity on the brake third - the No Smoking sign is on one side only of the left hand compartment.  Not to bothered about it though, as the rest of the coach is superb.  Pity they had to go for white rooves, though. 

[The Johnster]

Preaching to the choir re white roofs, Alan.  No easy way around this for the manufacturers without offering 'weathered' versions of stock, though, and it is known that this is a bit of a 'niche' market; the bulk of purchasers want their stuff clean and shiny.  But white roofs look particularly prominent on model railways with overhead lighting.  Maybe a coat of matt varnish will tone them down a touch!

 

I'd recommend a coat of matt black on the buffers and wheels as well, and matt varnish on the handrails, which catch the light a bit.

 

In 1964, when I was 12, I want on a family package holiday to Lido de Jesolo, near Venice.  This featured a coach trip to the city of Trieste, on the Yugoslavian border, where I have a very clear memory of the Orient Express running along the sea cliffs approaching the city from a hill the other side, immaculate white roofs gleaming in the sun; absolutely spectacular!  Not all white roofs are a bad thing...

Edited March 30, 2019 by The Johnster

[Coach bogie]

Finally managed to open and run mine. I am really pleased. As others have said, the roof of each need toning down a bit, otherwise sun glasses needed. I will sort close coupling out later. Too busy running them at the moment. Interesting conversion coming up.

 

Mike Wiltshires

 

[Coach bogie]

If anyone is looking for a conversion...... I have had the parts for a E129 B set for some time. As I am not getting any younger, I am always on the lookout for quick fixes to avoid an 8 - 12 week build. This way it can be sorted in a week.

 

The compos are ideal donor for the Comet E129 sides. The 7ft bogies re just plug fit and I have several projects there will be used under. I need to alter the Truss rod pitch, move the bogie centres and replace with 9fts, take the buffers off the inner ends, and we are on our way. It may appear a lot of work , but much quicker than building the whole thing from kit parts.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[No Decorum]

4 hours ago, Coach bogie said:

Finally managed to open and run mine. I am really pleased. As others have said, the roof of each need toning down a bit, otherwise sun glasses needed. I will sort close coupling out later. Too busy running them at the moment. Interesting conversion coming up.

 

Mike Wiltshire

Nice coaches. Very nice County Tank!

[Coach bogie]

1 hour ago, No Decorum said:

Nice coaches. Very nice County Tank!

It was scratch built for me years ago. I need to change the number on it. 2221 was the only one to have cab sides flush with the tanks. It will become 2235 as it ended its' days working in the Westbury area out of Reading in 1934, when the 61XX had taken over all the main suburban work.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[M.I.B]

On 27/03/2019 at 14:44, john dew said:

 

Railtec offer custom GWR Toad depot branding for about £2.50.... I already have a set of Granby transfers I will check how they look size wise and let you know

 

Cheers

 

Super fast service from RailTec - Here are my altered brakes:

 

 

Many thanks Railtec - awesome service and product.

[M.I.B]

On 27/03/2019 at 14:44, john dew said:

 

 

Sorry - Dual post of the same post.

 

 

Edited April 2, 2019 by M.I.B

[tomparryharry]

On ‎31‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 15:06, No Decorum said:

Nice coaches. Very nice County Tank!

 

I do like those photos;  as well as the County tank, I wonder what other locomotive I can use? Oh! I know! Where's that Holden tank? Painted yellow, of course....

 

Should have gone to Specsavers....

 

Ian.

[melmerby]

Got mine yesterday, close couplings fitted, had to use two Hornby as my usual one Hornby, one Roco caused buffer locking on 3' reverse curves, likewise had to use a Kadee #19s on end of rake as #18s were too short.

Really nice looking set but the bogie footboards are even more fragile than some other coaches I have. One was off without me really doing anything.

 

Running around behind a 5101 tank (Hornby, ex Airfix). Big Praries were common in the Birmingham area with these sorts of trains.

The crudeness of the loco now stands out amongst the fineness of recent rolling stock releases.

[The Johnster]

Fortunately there are 2 new 5101s in the pipeline that should close the gap a bit, Keith.  I've seen photos of 56xx working with them in the Birmingham area as well, but 5101s would be the go to.  In South Wales the Taff A and Rhymney P got a look in with similar coaches but in 5 coach sets, as well as 56xx of course, and BR Standard 3MT tanks in the early 50s.  

[melmerby]

I think this has been linked to before but it shows a Birmingham outer suburban train with a 5101 (51XX?) & B set:

https://www.warwickshirerailways.com/gwr/gwrwe1366.htm

Edited April 4, 2019 by melmerby

[Ian Hargrave]

13 hours ago, The Johnster said:

Fortunately there are 2 new 5101s in the pipeline that should close the gap a bit, Keith.  I've seen photos of 56xx working with them in the Birmingham area as well, but 5101s would be the go to.  In South Wales the Taff A and Rhymney P got a look in with similar coaches but in 5 coach sets, as well as 56xx of course, and BR Standard 3MT tanks in the early 50s.  

 

IIRC,the 51XX also worked to Treherbert ?

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, Ian Hargrave said:

 

IIRC,the 51XX also worked to Treherbert ?

Yes - they were tried on the Rhondda but according to some sources they were said to have not been found to be very satisfactory.  However Merthyr had a number of them for several years so presumably they were considered to be ok on the TRVR main line.

[Ian Hargrave]

16 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

Yes - they were tried on the Rhondda but according to some sources they were said to have not been found to be very satisfactory.  However Merthyr had a number of them for several years so presumably they were considered to be ok on the TRVR main line.

 

Thanks for that Mike.I thought my memory was correct. I cannot remember them on Merthyr workings however which in my time were TVR ‘A’ ,56/66XX and latterly BR Standard 82XXX.

[The Johnster]

IIRC (and I'm a little younger than you, Ian, so the C in that is important) they were allocated to Barry, Cathays, Rhymney, and Merthyr so far as Cardiff Valleys were concerned.  They worked to Treherbert, and I have seen a photo of one working in the Afan Valley, presumably a Treherbert-Swansea working, perhaps a Dyffryn Yard loco.   Many of the late 41xx series, the last built, were allocated to South Wales sheds, some to the Newport Valleys and the main line sheds, in replacement for withdrawn TVR As and Rhymney Ps that had been 'Swindonised' by the GW.  When the 82xxx were built, at Swindon (they use a domed version of the Swindon standard no.2 boiler), they were allocated in continuance of this practice.  

 

They were considered by Barry drivers I spoke to in the 70s to have more 'range' than the 56xx on account of the larger driving wheels; they needed less topping up of the tanks which was useful on the longer Barry turns such as Clarence Road-Bridgend via Sully.  They were capable of better speeds as well.  I have no idea why they might have been thought unsuitable for the Rhondda Valleys, as they had no problem with Merthyr, steeper and more curved.  The traffic on the Rhondda Fach Maerdy Branch probably did not warrant them.

 

Tondu had one on the books from 1946 to 1948 (4145, brand new to the shed) which I assume was a reserve to 3100 which was the regular loco for the Porthcawl-Cardiff commuter train, and the class returned to the shed in later years.  Post dmus, 1958, they were ousted from the regular passenger work in the Cardiff and Newport valleys and found employment on transfer freights and excursions right up to the end of steam in the area; their 'replacement' 82xxx were transferred away when the dmus arrived.  Severn Tunnel used them on the Pilning car ferry as well as assisting freights through the Tunnel, and one could achieve a fair turn of speed on the downhill run with these trains!  Often thought Pilning HL was a very modellable station...

[Ian Hargrave]

I well remember that car journey through the tunnel and the intrepid loading of the vehicles on the flats.We did it but once to shorten a journey to Cornwall with ,I think,a Morris Oxford .All vehicles had to be chained and passengers joined the train in an attached coach.By the time loading,attaching the Large Prairie,finding a path through the tunnel which apart from passenger traffic was usually stuffed with slow moving freight which had to be banked had been done ,we would probably have been quicker to have driven the long way round via Gloucester.Still,it was an adventure.That was really the point of it.

 

  On the subject of the Large Prairie,Neath had one of the derivatives....an 81XX....8104 which usually worked The Vale of Neath line in the early 50’s. The other oddity you have already mentioned...the 31XX..for the Porthcawl-Newport turn.Still stuck in the mind though .....probably a trick of memory...is of one on a Barry-Treherbert service but I still cannot remember one on a Merthyr Valleys turn.We changed at Abercynon.....and the 64XX auto train.

 

 

[JZ]

Gave mine an airing today, behind a 45XX and later a 64XX. Lovely coaches and all part fitted. One thing I did find though was that the NEM pockets are inset some way and needed #20 Kadee, fortunately I had a few in reserve. This also meant that my usual method of using Keen Systems Buckeyes between carriages came up short. I tried Bachmann 'jumper' cable type, those that come with Mk1s, were a bit too long. Finally found some rigid bars, I think from Heljan Westerns, that were just right. Buffer touching on straight track and just touching on curves. No issues with reverse curve as mine are 36" minimum. I did make up a little video to post, but as we can no longer post MP4 files, I can't be arsed to load it up on YouTube for just a three second clip.

[The Johnster]

On 04/04/2019 at 15:43, Ian Hargrave said:

I well remember that car journey through the tunnel and the intrepid loading of the vehicles on the flats.We did it but once to shorten a journey to Cornwall with ,I think,a Morris Oxford .All vehicles had to be chained and passengers joined the train in an attached coach.By the time loading,attaching the Large Prairie,finding a path through the tunnel which apart from passenger traffic was usually stuffed with slow moving freight which had to be banked had been done ,we would probably have been quicker to have driven the long way round via Gloucester.Still,it was an adventure.That was really the point of it.

 

  On the subject of the Large Prairie,Neath had one of the derivatives....an 81XX....8104 which usually worked The Vale of Neath line in the early 50’s. The other oddity you have already mentioned...the 31XX..for the Porthcawl-Newport turn.Still stuck in the mind though .....probably a trick of memory...is of one on a Barry-Treherbert service but I still cannot remember one on a Merthyr Valleys turn.We changed at Abercynon.....and the 64XX auto train.

 

 

We did the Tunnel ferry a couple of times on Cornish Hollys, always good fun, Ford Prefect in our case!  Severn Tunnel Jc station had a refreshment room on the island platform, which had a massive Cunard poster featuring the (scrapped by then) Mauritania; ‘holder of the Blue Riband’ in one of the end walls.  

 

We we also used the Beachley-Aust ferry sometimes, but the queues for it negated any time saving as against Gloucester and the A38.  Almost impossible now to imagine life before the bridges.  

 

Never saw saw any large prairie  except 5101s on Valley services.  

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 7, 2019 by The Johnster

[melmerby]

2 hours ago, JZ said:

 One thing I did find though was that the NEM pockets are inset some way and needed #20 Kadee.

I mentioned that last Wednesday.

I got away with #19s on the ends and used Hornby close couplers between coaches .Usually have one Hornby + one Roco

[JZ]

52 minutes ago, melmerby said:

I mentioned that last Wednesday.

 

 

Must have missed that one

[chrisf]

I need to check the details and cannot do so now because I am between medical appointments but there was a time when 51xx were not allowed into Merthyr.  I'm guessing that this was for clearance reasons.  Those allocated to 88D worked out of Rhymney, a sub-shed of Merthyr.

 

Chris

Edited April 8, 2019 by chrisf
typo, again

[The Stationmaster]

7 hours ago, chrisf said:

I need to check the details and cannot do so now because I am between medical appointments but there was a time when 51xx were not allowed into Merthyr.  I'm guessing that this was for clearance reasons.  Those allocated to 88D worked out of Rhymney, a sub-shed of Merthyr.

 

Chris

There was a gap, I think of some years, between the unsuccessful 1942 trials of a large prairie on the Taff Vale Section (which resulted in a runaway) and the allocation of the engines to the area (where presumably the earlier experience suggested they should not be used, or could not be trusted, on mineral train working?).

 

There were no large prairies in the Cardiff Valleys Division in January 1948 and the first engines to arrive appear to have some been 416X series new builds allocated to Barry and Treherbert in September of that year.   Their first allocation to Merthyr appears not to have taken place until September 1953.  The latter is, as Chris surmised, almost certainly linked to clearance restraints because even as late as winter 1949 outside cylinder engines were prohibited between Abercynon and Merthyr.  In  addition the 2-6-2Ts were subject to quite a lot of restrictions being barred from numerous sidings and restricted to the Main lines only between Cardiff General (i.e. Queen Street South) and Treherbert and to the through lines only on the Rhondda Fach branch.

Edited April 8, 2019 by The Stationmaster
correct some typos - note one date

[Ian Hargrave]

So  my memory is not at fault.Thanks for that,Mike & ChrisF