Hornby 2019 announcements

[1ngram]

On 07/01/2019 at 16:21, Islesy said:

 

 

Our reference comes from from the North British Railway Study Group, in their Journal 125 of July 2015. Euan Cameron, of that Society, states that several photographs in the NBR collection exist showing the engines painted in an all-over drab of either khaki or dark grey, although khaki would have been the easiest colour to apply over the NB livery of the time, similar to the GWS’s Mogul 5322 between 2008 and 2012. As we've dealt closely with the NBRSG throughout the J36 project, we see no reason to doubt their take on the subject and whilst I will cross reference against Aves, the information supplied by the NBRSG, along with reference to ROD files at the National Archives, has guided our interpretation of the subject.

 

I hope that helps?

 

Best wishes,

 

Paul.

 

 

 

Thanks to the invaluable assistance of the North British Study circle I’ve managed to get my hands on a copy of the 2015 article on the J36s in France with the R.O.D. that Islesy says Hornby are taking their information from.  But in fact the article doesn’t say the J36 were painted khaki.  Indeed all the evidence is to the contrary.

 

The article by Euan Cameron appears in issue no. 125 and is entitled “The Holmes 18” 0-6-0s.”  Of their colours when in the ROD he says:

 

“Several photographs exist of NBR locomotives as returned from war service: the locomotives were painted in all-over drab which may have been khaki or dark grey, though khaki would have been the easiest colour to apply over the NB livery of the time.”

 

By 1917/8 when the locos were sent to France the NBR locos were either in their pre-WW1 lined olive livery or the new goods livery of black lined yellow.  In the recent “British Military Railways Overseas in the Great War” compiled by The British Overseas Railway Historical Trust there is a chapter  by Dr. P.E, Waters detailing the ROD broadgauge locomotives.  There he says:

 

“Liveries varied.  Locomotives requisitioned in the early stages were usually sent to France in the livery of the owning company, but later locomotives were painted dull black . . . .Some engines may have been painted grey when new.”  (page 309)

 

In William Aves first book on the ROD “The Railway Operating Division in France”  he says on page 128:

 

“Such photographic evidence as survives indicates that where engines were repainted by their parent companies before dispatch, they were turned out in plain or matt black, or dark grey.”

 

Then on page 129 he says:

 

“As time went by, most ROD tender locomotives were repainted plain black. . .”

 

The intended Hornby ROD loco, ROD 5662 is based on a photo of the loco on its return to Eastfield shed in 1919, which appears in Aves book on page 118.  There are two other photos of these locomotives in Aves’ second book on the ROD (The Lines Behind the Front), of ROD 6682 again at Eastfield in 1919 (page 79), and a lone one in France of ROD 5666 on page71). The colour of these locos could be a faded dirty black or a dark grey.  There is no evidence that they were ever coloured khaki and by 1919, when the photograph Hornby are undoubtedly copying was taken, they would almost certainly have been repainted.

 

So, Dark Grey or Black.  Hopefully it is not too late for Hornby to avoid a livery error spoiling what looks set to be a very welcome addition to its range of J36s and give us an accurately coloured ROD loco.

[Dunsignalling]

On ‎06‎/‎02‎/‎2019 at 17:41, Pete Darton said:

Hattons buys second hand models because they are wanted by customers. This is no different than having stock for a few years. Also I wasn’t saying stockists buy excessive stock up front but companies like Hornby producing models in several batches over time and making them available to customers for several years.

They do that already, but what they don't do is make them with the same number and name over and over (Flying Scotsman excepted), as used to be the case in years gone. Back in the day, if you wanted a Bulleid Light Pacific, it would only ever be Winston Churchill or a Britannia  was forever Britannia unless you renamed them yourself.

 

Now you can get different ones every couple of years. Currently Bideford and Anzac respectively. Much better for everyone.

 

John

Edited February 28, 2019 by Dunsignalling

[Coryton]

1 hour ago, Dunsignalling said:

They do that already, but what they don't do is make them with the same number and name over and over (Flying Scotsman excepted), as used to be the case in years gone. Back in the day, if you wanted a Bulleid Light Pacific, it would only ever be Winston Churchill or a Britannia  was forever Britannia unless you renamed them yourself.

 

Now you can get different ones every couple of years. Currently Bideford and Anzac respectively. Much better for everyone.

 

John

 

And in the world of Railroad steam 0-4-0's, they keep coming up with different imaginary liveries, presumably because there are some people out there who have to have one of everything they produce.

 

On the other hand, if it's the "class 06", then at the moment they just seem to keep doing the BR blue with the same number for some reason.

 

 

[brushman47544]

21 hours ago, Coryton said:

On the other hand, if it's the "class 06", then at the moment they just seem to keep doing the BR blue with the same number for some reason.

 

I have often wondered why Hornby chose the Class 06 rather than, say, the more common 03 or 08. I assumed it was because its boxy shape made tooling easier. It pretty accurate especially considering its longevity.

[The Johnster]

I'd suspect the '06' was chosen because it could easily be configured to sit on the Nellie chassis.  The 03 is actually quite a complex thing by comparison, effectively an 0-8-0, and Triang had already produced something they regarded as an 08 with no attempt to disguise it's completely incorrect Jinty chassis.  I think this travesty is still being knocked out in a train set, but there is a decent 08 in the range now as well!

 

IIRC the '06' model was originally not claimed to be any specific class, just a semi-freelance BR liveried small diesel shunting engine which one assumed to be diesel electric or hydraulic from it's lack of a jackshaft.  It acquired the '06' designation later as being less unlike that prototype than any other.

[chuffinghell]

I’m looking forward to seeing the finished ‘large’ GWR prairie

 

The retooling of this loco is long overdue, although it looks like Dapol will pip them to the post when it comes to the release date

Edited March 2, 2019 by chuffinghell

[Steamport Southport]

On ‎01‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 13:19, brushman47544 said:

 

I have often wondered why Hornby chose the Class 06 rather than, say, the more common 03 or 08. I assumed it was because its boxy shape made tooling easier. It pretty accurate especially considering its longevity.

 

There was already a pretty decent 03 available from Mainline and Hornby already had a Railroad standard 08.

 

If we are talking about "open goal" small BR diesels then the Class 02 must be the obvious candidate. Twenty BR ones built, but seven preserved and fifty industrial variants as well. Even one in the NRM as a possible commission.

 

Also no currently available kit so they aren't treading on the feet of any of the small suppliers. I can see one being announced when I finally track down a DJH or Craftsman kit.  

 

 

Jason

[Miss Prism]

36 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

I’m looking forward to seeing the finished ‘large’ GWR prairie

The retooling of this loco is long overdue, although it looks like Dapol will pip them to the post when it comes to the release date

 

Really?

 

[The Johnster]

04 is another open goal IMHO; Airfix once made a plastic construction kit for this but it has not been available for many years.  It's different enough from the 03 to be worth a shot I reckon, and can share chassis.  Different cab and 'chimney'.

[Steamport Southport]

1 minute ago, The Johnster said:

04 is another open goal IMHO; Airfix once made a plastic construction kit for this but it has not been available for many years.  It's different enough from the 03 to be worth a shot I reckon, and can share chassis.  Different cab and 'chimney'.

 

Bachmann already do one.

 

I think it's in the queue for a retool along with the 03.

 

The Airfix kit is still available from Dapol.

 

 

 

Jason

[chuffinghell]

55 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Really?

 

 

Have I said something wrong?

[Miss Prism]

2 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

Have I said something wrong?

 

Not necessarily. But you said something that implied you knew something nobody else does.

 

We're just curious...

 

[chuffinghell]

1 minute ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Not necessarily. But you said something that implied you knew something nobody else does.

 

We're just curious...

 

 

I thought I’d read a Hattons press release that said the Dapol version would be available during the first quarter of this year

 

However looking back it appears to be an early press release so production times have probably since changed 

 

My apologies, I’ll do everyone a favour and throw myself off a bridge

 

 

[Hilux5972]

Hornby already have physical samples of the Prairie. Dapol are still at CAD stage, which they need to redo looking at some of the detail on them. Hornby will win the race for sure. 

[The Stationmaster]

45 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

 

I thought I’d read a Hattons press release that said the Dapol version would be available during the first quarter of this year

 

However looking back it appears to be an early press release so production times have probably since changed 

 

My apologies, I’ll do everyone a favour and throw myself off a bridge

 

 

 

If you do throw yourself off a bridge will you please take with you that awful CAD of the large prairie which Dapol showed last year.  Miss P has done an awful lot to help them get their 43XX right but they're very long way behind Hornby when it come to the large prairie.

[chuffinghell]

6 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

........they're very long way behind Hornby when it come to the large prairie.

 

I never suggested otherwise

 

I was just mistaken with regards to the release date

 

My other statement was factually though I am looking forward to the release from Hornby

Edited March 2, 2019 by chuffinghell

[Hilux5972]

2 hours ago, chuffinghell said:

 

The retooling of this loco is long overdue, although it looks like Dapol will pip them to the post when it comes to the release date

 

 

4 minutes ago, chuffinghell said:

 

I never suggested otherwise

 

Actually you did, as highlighted above

[chuffinghell]

I thought he meant a long way behind from a ‘getting the design right’ point of view not a long way behind on the ‘realise date’

Edited March 2, 2019 by chuffinghell

[tomparryharry]

Post deleted.

 

 

Edited March 4, 2019 by tomparryharry
Post removed for piffle

[The Johnster]

On 02/03/2019 at 16:00, The Stationmaster said:

If you do throw yourself off a bridge will you please take with you that awful CAD of the large prairie which Dapol showed last year.  Miss P has done an awful lot to help them get their 43XX right but they're very long way behind Hornby when it come to the large prairie.

 

 

Don't chuck yourself off a bridge, Chuff, but by all means chuck Dap's CAD off...

[The Johnster]

Large prairies are a bit of a problematic thing for me; I don't really need one but could just about justify one.  My locos have to suit a period 1948-58 and have been at Tondu shed in that timeframe.  4145 was there from 1/1/48 but transferred away at the end of March, and 4144 was transferred in in October '58, so I'd be pushing Rule 1 a little if I were to include either.  I have an antediluvian Airfix as 4145, supplied new to Tondu in 1946 in unlined green G W R initials livery, but it is not a good runner or up to the standard of more recent models, and only gets a very occasional outing these days.

 

A really good 5101 from either Dapol or Hornby might tempt my wallet out of my pocket, but I really ought to be saving up for the Bachmann 94xx and improving my coaching stock, so it has to be well down the shopping list.  On the other hand, a discount offer might push it up the list a bit...

 

Looks like the H 5101 will hit the shops first; it has probably been in quiet development for some time.  Look at the performance with the completely new Collett 57' Suburbans, announced 6 weeks ago and the first run are in the shops already!

 

The Airfix 61xx was not a bad model in it's day, but the game has moved on a lot since then.  Hornby upgraded it a bit over the years; better motors, proper pony wheels with daylight between the spokes, and so on, but cabs full of motors, moulded lamp irons, no rivet or drawhook detail on the buffer beams, and crude running gear by current standards are not going to cut the mustard anymore; nor, IMHO, are traction tyres.  But this is, AFAIK, the only RTR model to ever feature fire irons, the moulded shovel strapped to the top of the left hand tank ahead of the spectacle plate.

Edited March 3, 2019 by The Johnster

[tomparryharry]

On ‎02‎/‎03‎/‎2019 at 16:00, The Stationmaster said:

If you do throw yourself off a bridge will you please take with you that awful CAD of the large prairie which Dapol showed last year.  Miss P has done an awful lot to help them get their 43XX right but they're very long way behind Hornby when it come to the large prairie.

 

As far as I know, the original 2018 CAD-generated image was just a 'declaration of intent'. Let's see what the future holds.

 

Ian.

[Steamport Southport]

16 hours ago, The Johnster said:

 But this is, AFAIK, the only RTR model to ever feature fire irons, the moulded shovel strapped to the top of the left hand tank ahead of the spectacle plate.

 

Moulded on fireirons yes. A few others have them in the detail pack.

 

DJ Models/Kernow have a very good set included with the O2 and Beattie Well Tanks.

 

 

Jason

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

Why was someone being ritually beaten for the simple and pardonable error of accepting a Dapol announcement?

 

19 hours ago, The Johnster said:

  But this is, AFAIK, the only RTR model to ever feature fire irons, the moulded shovel strapped to the top of the left hand tank ahead of the spectacle plate.

Back in the day Hornby had crew and sometimes fire irons included with their locos. (I recall estimating the weight from the moulded dimensions, and thinking of the superhero expected to wield that mighty pricker.) Surely we can do much better with some thin wire. Steel wire especially.

 

Sometimes the fireman was moulded complete with shovel. A less serious error than moulding any piece of loose kit onto the loco body. For all the welcome improvements Airfix GMR brought to RTR OO, this particular idea should go into the 'under no circumstances repeat this silly idea' category. (I would suggest the same for moulded 'coal' permanently attached to bunkers.)

[The Johnster]

I would prefer to see moulded coal 'phased out immediately' (one of my favourite Arthur Scargill quotes from the 80s) and tenders/bunkers modelled empty; perhaps a pack of coal could be included in the box.  Most locos spent most of their working lives with the coal well below the visible from the trackside level, and one hears tales of long distance expresses approaching Kings X or Euston grateful for the downhill approach and with only dust in the tender for the last 10 miles or so... 

 

But RTR models are always fresh off the shed with full bunkers, and I haven't forgotten my Airfix Dean Goods which had a highly unlikely mountain of coal to hide it's tender drive.  Removing this moulding is sometimes harder than it could be, a particular bete noir of mine at the moment being the Bachmann 45xx/4575 which features the coal moulded integrally with the lamp iron shield which has to be very carefully removed if you are to re-use it.  If you wish to add real coal, which is always a worthwhile improvement in appearance over the moulded rubbish, this usually means an even bigger unlikely pile in the bunker as you glue the real coal over the top of the moulding.  

 

Even if you can remove the moulded coal, there is often a ballast weight or part of the chassis or mech in there and you still end up having to have a bunker more than ¾ full on tank engines.  I work my BLT to a sequence timetable, and the presence of full bunkers on locos that have been working their diagrams for 8 or 9 hours as the imaginary day moves towards the end of the sequence grates a little...

 

And while we're at it, how about a set of lamps, 2 front and a tail at least, that can be fitted to the brackets, in the box as well!

Edited March 4, 2019 by The Johnster