Now with Videos! Stranraer ‘themed’ loft layout 1959-64

[The Johnster]

Puffers are very popular as models, for understandable reasons; they are very attractive little ships, and very small.  There is also the Para Handy/Vital Spark factor.  These ships were developed for a specific purpose and specific traffic; general purpose freight from Glasgow to the remoter parts of the Argyll coast and the Western Isles at a time when road access to these communities was very poor and railways thin on the ground.  

 

Their size and form was determined by the locks of the canals they had to negotiate.  They were not really suitable for open sea work, and most of their trade took place in the sheltered sea lochs and the Firth of Clyde out of the way of the big waves.  So, while it is by no means impossible that one would turn up at Stranraer, the exposed passage down the coast south of Ayr, where the shelter offered by the natural breakwater of the Mull of Kintyre is not available, would mean that she was a little out of her comfort zone.  They were designed for tiny harbours and jetties which had no handling equipment; the ship had a derrick crane that could unload her cargo to the quay.  This is not needed at Stranraer, and I would expect most coastal trade using the port to be in more conventional small vessels that were more suitable for the exposed part of the route.

 

Puffers are a bit of a modelling cliche; by their very nature they did not appear at harbours that were rail connected and look a bit wrong to my eyes outside their 'area', the upper Firth of Clyde and the sea lochs off it, and the canal accessed western Argyll coast.  Their low speed and small size, as well as the flat bottomed hull profile that enabled them to 'take the hard' and sit upright in harbours that dried out at low tide, made them unsuitable for open sea work, even the short (but somewhat lively) North Channel to Ulster.

 

Cattle boats tended to be older vessels with a central superstructure, a good bit bigger than a Puffer and with no need for their own unloading equipment.  

 

 

[danstercivicman]

Here’s my low relief lairage

 

The doors will be open and the interior detailed so you can peer out onto the layout.

 

The cattle boat will moor up between here and the protrusion where the link span is.  This is currently where the control panel sits...

 

Cheers for the info on the ship.

 

I have found a cattle ship prototype that’s not too big and should look ok.

 

Will have to move the control panel...

 

[danstercivicman]

1 hour ago, The Johnster said:

Puffers are very popular as models, for understandable reasons; they are very attractive little ships, and very small.  There is also the Para Handy/Vital Spark factor.  These ships were developed for a specific purpose and specific traffic; general purpose freight from Glasgow to the remoter parts of the Argyll coast and the Western Isles at a time when road access to these communities was very poor and railways thin on the ground.  

 

Their size and form was determined by the locks of the canals they had to negotiate.  They were not really suitable for open sea work, and most of their trade took place in the sheltered sea lochs and the Firth of Clyde out of the way of the big waves.  So, while it is by no means impossible that one would turn up at Stranraer, the exposed passage down the coast south of Ayr, where the shelter offered by the natural breakwater of the Mull of Kintyre is not available, would mean that she was a little out of her comfort zone.  They were designed for tiny harbours and jetties which had no handling equipment; the ship had a derrick crane that could unload her cargo to the quay.  This is not needed at Stranraer, and I would expect most coastal trade using the port to be in more conventional small vessels that were more suitable for the exposed part of the route.

 

Puffers are a bit of a modelling cliche; by their very nature they did not appear at harbours that were rail connected and look a bit wrong to my eyes outside their 'area', the upper Firth of Clyde and the sea lochs off it, and the canal accessed western Argyll coast.  Their low speed and small size, as well as the flat bottomed hull profile that enabled them to 'take the hard' and sit upright in harbours that dried out at low tide, made them unsuitable for open sea work, even the short (but somewhat lively) North Channel to Ulster.

 

Cattle boats tended to be older vessels with a central superstructure, a good bit bigger than a Puffer and with no need for their own unloading equipment.  

 

 

 

 

The cattle boat I’m looking at had a side loading ramp  

 

Its also a small boat  

[St Enodoc]

7 hours ago, danstercivicman said:

Here’s an idea of the Ferry in low relief...

 

Its on the backscene and can be ‘either’ just departed or just backing onto the pier? 

 

Position two would be against the linkspan but... it would be obvious that the whole side is missing 

I'd go for position 1.

[danstercivicman]

4 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

I'd go for position 1.

 

 

cheers

 

Yes definately it makes more sense.  There will be some water running round the side of the dock yard and hopefully it will look like the Ferry is doing something!!! 

 

Best

 

Dan 

[danstercivicman]

I’ve found the missing link between Princess Victoria and the Caledonian Princess which was launched in 1961 and I think took over...December 1961

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/thedouglascampbellshow/2962631316/

 

Hampton Ferry 

Edited February 17, 2019 by danstercivicman
Corrected inaccuracies

[danstercivicman]

Silver Sidelines has very kindly helped with the timetables.  I have digested the 1962 timetable (hopefully corectly) ...

 

Please have a look? 

 

The timetable needs the town side to make sense as return workings appear also to use that which would make sense given running around at the town was possible and the loco sheds were there. 

 

Occupants of the sleeper coaches were allowed to remain in their cabins until 06:25am.  Although what sleep they would have got?? 

 

Edited February 17, 2019 by danstercivicman
To put pictures in the right way!

[danstercivicman]

Missed a couple...

 

The one I can see in books and photos but can’t find on the timetable is the 12:20pm Stranraer to Newcastle.   There is also reference to an 11:44am departure which the loco bringing the early hours Northern Irishman hailed back to Carlisle but the closest I can find is the 8:15am UP from the town then the 1:30pm 1:40pm trains? 

[danstercivicman]

Missed a couple...

 

The one I can see in books and photos but can’t find on the timetable is the 12:20pm Stranraer to Newcastle.   There is also reference to an 11:44am departure which the loco bringing the early hours Northern Irishman hauled back to Carlisle but the closest I can find is the 8:15am UP from the town then the 1:30pm 1:40pm trains? 

Edited February 18, 2019 by danstercivicman
Spelling

[danstercivicman]

Got my daughter assisting with the painting  

 

The best way to use half term  

[danstercivicman]

Here is the fruit of our painting  

 

Again Silver Sidelines (legend) has helped with resources which give a better idea of the lairage.

 

The spot to the left of the cattle wagons will be the lairage pens with the dockside road running behind.  

 

Its still drying and the yard needs another coat! 

 

Edited February 18, 2019 by danstercivicman
Grammar

[danstercivicman]

This picture is one of the most useful in modelling the Harbour Station.

 

 

Here we have Hampton Ferry (drafted in between 1953-61).

 

Of note:

 

1) cargo ship fits amply in front.  I do not have this space as I have had to compress my headshunts.  I’d need to add on another 60cm probably.

 

2) linkspan protrusion starts where the signal box is.  This I’ve got about right 

 

3) cranes...  nice cranes to model on the dockside

 

4) open vans/wagons being loaded from the cargo ship. 

 

5) Signal box colour-reddish not the white seen later

 

 

Edited February 19, 2019 by danstercivicman
Signal box

[danstercivicman]

Looking at the maps:

 

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=16.705003226050323&lat=54.9077&lon=-5.0228&layers=170&b=1

 

The Harbour Station appears to have been linked to the other side... by a road!!!

Edited February 19, 2019 by danstercivicman
No light railway it’s a road

[svitapeneela]

5 hours ago, danstercivicman said:

Looking at the maps:

 

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=16.705003226050323&lat=54.9077&lon=-5.0228&layers=170&b=1

 

The Harbour Station appears to have been linked to the other side (fishing boats) by a disused light railway...

 Do you mean the Cairnryan Military Railway?

[calvin Streeting]

is this the line https://movingimage.nls.uk/film/3696 your modeling?

 

 

 

[danstercivicman]

No that was completely seperate coming off a junction elsewhere..

 

Actually looking at the map more closely I don’t think it is a light railway!  I think it’s a disused light and the line must be the harbour wall!  Whoops!  

[danstercivicman]

4 minutes ago, calvin Streeting said:

is this the line https://movingimage.nls.uk/film/3696 your modeling?

 

 

 

 

Yup that’s the one! Cracking film  

[calvin Streeting]

cool hope it helps.. was looking at boat to see if a cut of line (for model etc)  so as to show enough for viewers to get idea, but not whole 4 foot of boat

 

would be good to get to atleast the second deck, so the name would be visable. and the side boarding ramp in low relif .. but just ideas

Edited February 19, 2019 by calvin Streeting
found pic to explain

[danstercivicman]

10 minutes ago, calvin Streeting said:

cool hope it helps.. was looking at boat to see if a cut of line (for model etc)  so as to show enough for viewers to get idea, but not whole 4 foot of boat

 

 

Cheers  

 

My plan will be to model the very back stern of the Ferry in low relief.

 

They had to back up to the linkspan (stern loaders only) so it can be ‘departing’ or ‘arriving’  

 

I think it only sailed morning and evening but there were relief ships in the summer 

[danstercivicman]

31 minutes ago, calvin Streeting said:

cool hope it helps.. was looking at boat to see if a cut of line (for model etc)  so as to show enough for viewers to get idea, but not whole 4 foot of boat

 

would be good to get to atleast the second deck, so the name would be visable. and the side boarding ramp in low relif .. but just ideas

 

Yup that’s the plan

 

stern to second deck  

 

Then a backscene outline of the rest of the Ferry  

 

I’ve been looking at a how to do back scene video by Andy Peters on YouTube  

[Pacific231G]

On 13/02/2019 at 15:39, Legend said:

The Caledonian Princess , which I think was the one on Colms layout took over from about 65 I think . She had the CSP Lion on her funnel as for a while the Stranraer Larne route was operated by the Caledonian Steam Packet company , the subsidiary of BR operating the Clyde Services . I'm away from home at moment  and so don't have references to the ships that were on the route before that , but I think it might be Princess Margaret or Princess Louise . But in any case these are large steamers around the same size as Caledonian Princess and probably not dissimilar to the unfortunate Princess Victoria previously referred to, although not car ferries.

 

There is a book "Death on the North Channel" which documents the Princess Victoria disaster , which I think I'm correct in saying in British Maritime disasters was second only to the Titanic in loss of life .

he Princess Victoria sinking cost 133 lives and many believe it should have been a warning about the dangers of RoRo ferries that if heeded might have prevented the Herald of Free Enterprise and  Estonia disasters. 

The Princess Alice disaster near Woolwich Pier on the Thames in September 1878 killed between 630 and 700 people, a high proportion of them children. The paddle steamer was returning from an evening "moonligtht" cruise and got in the path of a collier, the Bywell Castle. After the collison it sank in four minutes and only two of the people who were below decks or in the saloon survived.

The Princess Alice disaster as portrayed in Harper's Weekly

 

Around 130 survivors were rescued by the crew of the Bywell Castle who put down ropes and launched their boats as did other ships moored nearby and local boatmen but sixteen of them died later from the effects of ingesting the toxic Thames water which was full of industrial effluent and untreated sewage that had recently been discharged from the Crossness and Abbey Mills outfalls. 

Five years after the disaster, the Bywell Castle, carrying general cargo from Alexandria to Hull , was lost with all hands in the Bay of Biscay. No doubt the superstitious Victorians made much of this co-incidence though such losses were all too common .

Edited February 19, 2019 by Pacific231G

[danstercivicman]

5 minutes ago, Pacific231G said:

The Princess Alice disaster near Woolwich Pier on the Thames in September 1878 killed between 630 and 700 people, a high proportion of them children. The paddle steamer was returning from an evening "moonligtht" cruise and got in the path of a collier, the Bywell Castle. After the collison it sank in four minutes and only two of the people who were below decks or in the saloon survived.

The Princess Alice disaster as portrayed in Harper's Weekly

 

Around 130 survivors were rescued by the crew of the Bywell Castle who put down ropes and launched their boats as did other ships moored nearby and local boatmen but sixteen of them died later from the effects of ingesting the toxic Thames water which was full of industrial effluent and untreated sewage that had recently been discharged from the Crossness and Abbey Mills outfalls. 

Five years after the disaster, the Bywell Castle, carrying general cargo from Alexandria to Hull , was lost with all hands in the Bay of Biscay. No doubt the superstitious Victorians made much of this co-incidence though such losses were all too common .

 

I think the storm of 1953 was labelled the worst piecetime disaster therefore that’s how the Princess Victoria tragedy got labelled the worst maritime disaster after the titanic. 

 

Although I maybe completely wrong!

 

I watched a documentary about the storm.  It was harrowing lots of lives lost including infants.

 

In memory and out of respect there will be a memorial at the end of the pier.  Heartbreaking that the women and children’s life boat was dashed into the ship...

 

I had read about the one you linked to and like you say disasters at sea were very common!  

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, danstercivicman said:

 

Yup that’s the plan

 

stern to second deck  

 

Then a backscene outline of the rest of the Ferry  

 

I’ve been looking at a how to do back scene video by Andy Peters on YouTube  

How about:

 

- car deck and the one above in full relief

- next two in very low relief, just the rails

- top deck, masts, lifeboats and funnel painted on the backscene?

[lmsforever]

The great storm of 1953 covered the east coast all the way down to the Thames Estuary and onto the Kent coast it was doubly worse because of the lack of communication meaning people were totally unaware that is was on its way.I saw the results at Canvey Island Essex my mums sister lived at Sth Benfleet the place of access onto Canvey ,we stood on the downs at Hadley and all you could see was water with the odd house sticking up everything else was washed away.It took many months to repair the damage and sea walls were built around Canvey, the government forbade people going there for  holidays and it became a residential environment.When I was at Sth Benfleet I used to spend many days on the Canvey buses a pleasant way to enjoy myself plus the views of the oil refineries were wonderful  !  I hope that this storm surge is never repeated as the death toll was very high and even with the so called advances in communication I think that many people would still lose their lives.

[danstercivicman]

36 minutes ago, St Enodoc said:

How about:

 

- car deck and the one above in full relief

- next two in very low relief, just the rails

- top deck, masts, lifeboats and funnel painted on the backscene?

 

It very much depends on the ferry  

 

The Hampton Ferry has a completely different stern to the Caledonian Princess!  

 

It had had two large derrecks and less of a rounded look.  

 

I haven’t decided on which ferry yet, but it will literally only be 15cm max due to space but yeah basically like you have suggested as much as I can fit...and actually build having never built a ship!