GWR Fire-iron brackets

[John_Hughes]

Does anyone have any ideas about modelling the three fire-iron brackets which typically adorn the rear of GWR tank-engine bunkers, and which frequently also had a bucket slung on one of them?

 

In the past I've tended to leave them off on the grounds that it's better to leave the space empty rather than put on something that doesn't look right, but if I can find a good way to model them so that all three of them match nicely I might change that.

 

Thanks for any suggestions, pointers and advice!

 

[Siberian Snooper]

Dart Castings, part L122 includes the irons and brackets.

[Gordon A]

A piece of narrow brass strip folded to shape.

 

Gordon A

[John_Hughes]

Thanks for the thoughts - most grateful.

 

The castings look a little on the chunky side, but perhaps they're better 'in the flesh.' The prototype brackets are made of quite hefty strip, and were presumably bashed into shape over a wooden former in much the same way as those lovely - and awkward to model - rear top corners of GWR tenders, but in 4mm they translate into not much more than shim; and of course the problem isn't just folding up brass strip (possibly annealed in a match flame first) but getting them to be identical to each other, or at least as near as makes no difference.

 

I'll try and see how things work out, and maybe try those castings as well. Wish me luck!

[jwealleans]

I’d use the square N/S wire Wizard sell for point rodding.

[John_Hughes]

I’d use the square N/S wire Wizard sell for point rodding.

 

An interesting idea, but the brackets themselves aren't square section. Still, it might be a good starting point, so thanks!

[The Johnster]

I use no.13 staples, which I also use for lamp irons in conjunction with Modelu lamps, bent around a rat tail file with a mark scratched on to it to show the sweet spot for radius, a fair approximation of the bar used on the prototype.  94xx, and I assume 15xx and 16xx, had a different, more angular profile than the sheperd's crook of earlier locos.  But I will be using Springside in future; there's quite a bit of faff in getting them all identical, which is more important than getting them right since they must be in a neat row.  There are 4, by the way, not 3, at least on 57xx, 8750, and 64xx.

[John_Hughes]

I use no.13 staples, which I also use for lamp irons in conjunction with Modelu lamps, bent around a rat tail file with a mark scratched on to it to show the sweet spot for radius, a fair approximation of the bar used on the prototype.  94xx, and I assume 15xx and 16xx, had a different, more angular profile than the sheperd's crook of earlier locos.  But I will be using Springside in future; there's quite a bit of faff in getting them all identical, which is more important than getting them right since they must be in a neat row.  There are 4, by the way, not 3, at least on 57xx, 8750, and 64xx.

 

Yes, four of course, you're quite right - I must have had the lamp brackets in my head when I said there were three - I'd actually been staring at my piccy of 1450 on the Dean Forest when I wrote that, so thanks for the heads-up or I'd certainly have done something stupid!

[Darwinian]

Like Johnster I use staples. Brass tends to bend a bit too easily and the staples look reasonably close. Nickel Silver steel strip might be another alternative but I've not tried it

Just use a suitable drill bit (or mark a file as Johnster suggested) to form the curve around 1st. Then bend the straight bits and end angled bit. Make twice as many as you need. Half will be virtually identical!

[The Johnster]

Half is about right; the failure rate is considerable.  It is more important in my view that they are identical, at least on that individual locomotive, and in line, than that they are absolutely spot on correct.  Make up a batch and separate them into piles of more or less identical examples; they only take a couple of seconds each.  I bend the radius around the rat tail as described, leaving a long tail at the other end of the staple to make a 90 deg. bend in just before the radius starts using flat pliers; you can trim any excess with rail cutters.

Edited January 7, 2019 by The Johnster

[John_Hughes]

Half is about right; the failure rate is considerable.  It is more important in my view that they are identical, at least on that individual locomotive, and in line, than that they are absolutely spot on correct.  Make up a batch and separate them into piles of more or less identical examples; they only take a couple of seconds each.  I bend the radius around the rat tail as described, leaving a long tail at the other end of the staple to make a 90 deg. bend in just before the radius starts using flat pliers; you can trim any excess with rail cutters.

 

Thanks, and to everyone else who's replied.

 

I tend to assume that I'll need triple the amount of material that things are scratched from to be sure of getting enough of them right, a proportion that I learned from Mr. Wurmser (Alfred, I think?) back in the 50s, when he created all sorts of animated stuff for the telly long before it could be done digitally.

 

I've not been out to the workshop for a couple of days (back trouble again, sadly) but I hope to have a go before the end of the week.

[John_Hughes]

I finally got round to making a set of those fire-iron hooks, having been putting it off for as long as I could. In the end - like most things that I've been a bit leery of - they turned out to be quite simple and only took about 20 minutes.

 

[Killybegs]

I filed the wire flat before bending to shape, leaving a full circular section to go into the hole in the body. See below