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Hornby - New Tooling - Terrier


Andy Y
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In the Hornby Rockumentary a few years back, some scenes showed them recording the sounds of a a Terrier.. so they did some work as it was on the TV…

here 2 minutes in..

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x74frf8

 

 

talking of which, Hornby the Series is due soon.

https://corporate.uktv.co.uk/news/article/uktv-yesterday-channel-Hornby/

Since the first rockumentary, Hattons & Rails are no longer customers, covid came, so did a break-even year, a 100 year anniversary, and whats looking like a bit of a product drought this year.

Edited by adb968008
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10 hours ago, adb968008 said:

...Since the first rockumentary, Hattons & Rails are no longer customers, covid came, so did a break-even year, a 100 year anniversary, and whats looking like a bit of a product drought this year.

 

I'm not aware that Hattons are no longer a customer of Hornby. If any shop majoring on supplying RTR were to lose both Bachmann and Hornby, I'm pretty sure they'd be out of business fast. I think what is true is that apparently Hornby have 'demoted' the larger suppliers who also do their own production further down the supply chain. But they are still customers (but not Rails, of course, but that's a different story).

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30 minutes ago, Ian J. said:

 

I'm not aware that Hattons are no longer a customer of Hornby. If any shop majoring on supplying RTR were to lose both Bachmann and Hornby, I'm pretty sure they'd be out of business fast. I think what is true is that apparently Hornby have 'demoted' the larger suppliers who also do their own production further down the supply chain. But they are still customers (but not Rails, of course, but that's a different story).

Pedantic, Semantics.


There are a lot of very unhappy people out there, who thought they were Hattons’ Hornby customers, and found out the hard way they werent any longer.

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On 14/01/2020 at 18:31, AJ'S said:

How did you remove the keeper plate? I undid the screws but could not get it off.

 

On 15/01/2020 at 22:41, Yankee said:

Yes the pickups on my 2662 are very thin with very little tension. It ran fine on DC, but initially on DCC it was a very poor runner. The pickups seem to go out of adjustment after some 30 mins of running. Finally after careful adjustment I managed to get sufficient tension in them to stay firmly against  all the wheels at full travel. DCC running was still not good. However after a day’s running at the Wimborne open day and all weekend at Frome on Pine Road it’s running better than ever. Only thought at the moment is that due to prolonged running any thin film on either the pickups or backs of the wheels has broken down.

Time will tell if they stay in adjustment, I have my doubts, Sheffield sound fitted one ordered as insurance. Long term I feel these pickups are going to prove the Achilles heel for these New Terriers.

 

Finally decided to do something about the light tension on the pick ups on my Terrier and remove the keeper plate for better access.

 

Hornby why do you glue the brake rods to the rear operating arm which is attached to the chassis making removal of the keeper plate so awkward. Luckily  the rods are not plastic so a little Glue Buster does the trick and then the plate can be removed.

 

I've tried increasing the tension by stroking the wipers rather than bending them, something you can't do without removing the keeper plate. Time will tell if I've been successful  

IMG_9694.jpeg

IMG_9695.jpeg

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16 hours ago, Yankee said:

Hornby why do you glue the brake rods to the rear operating arm

 

I've just been dismantling mine, and there was no glue at all on the brake rods.

 

Same issue with the pick-ups. It's been run in for several hours, but put it back on the layout and it stutters and stalls. Put it upside down and touch wires to the wheels - same issue; put the same wires to the pick-ups - seemingly no problem at all.

 

I was thinking of soldering additional wires to the pick-up strips, but there are other layout (and work!) things to do first.

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Later Terriers have different pick ups which are more substantial. 

 

They can be retro fitted to the earlier examples. 

 

Rob. 

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16 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

Later Terriers have different pick ups which are more substantial. 

 

They can be retro fitted to the earlier examples. 

 

Rob. 

 

Thanks for the heads-up, Rob.

 

It's presumably not yet available as spares. (Although that I can't find it at the moment is not conclusive ... the only spares on eBay appear to be the same one I've got on 32636.)

 

It's a shame really, having taken it apart, the engineering is (IMO) a beautiful piece of work.

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4 minutes ago, DavidH said:

 

Thanks for the heads-up, Rob.

 

It's presumably not yet available as spares. (Although that I can't find it at the moment is not conclusive ... the only spares on eBay appear to be the same one I've got on 32636.)

 

It's a shame really, having taken it apart, the engineering is (IMO) a beautiful piece of work.

 

 

Have you tried Lendons in Cardiff for spares? 

No connection other than satisfied customer but they certainly hold a sizeable amount of Terrier pick-ups..........and their pricing is very reasonable, cheapest by far. 

 

They will know if this is available yet. 

 

Rob. 

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34 minutes ago, NHY 581 said:

 

 

Have you tried Lendons in Cardiff for spares? 

No connection other than satisfied customer but they certainly hold a sizeable amount of Terrier pick-ups..........and their pricing is very reasonable, cheapest by far. 

 

They will know if this is available yet. 

 

Rob. 

I have asked Hornby in the recent past. The spares available at present are the older version, and the new ones are unlikely to be available as spares until the older ones are used up. Any spares you can find of the new version will have been removed from locos, rather than having started life as a spare.

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On 19/10/2021 at 13:56, DavidH said:

 

I've just been dismantling mine, and there was no glue at all on the brake rods.

 

Same issue with the pick-ups. It's been run in for several hours, but put it back on the layout and it stutters and stalls. Put it upside down and touch wires to the wheels - same issue; put the same wires to the pick-ups - seemingly no problem at all.

 

I was thinking of soldering additional wires to the pick-up strips, but there are other layout (and work!) things to do first.

 

Have checked again and the rods on mine are definitely glued on, will be getting another soon so will be interesting to compare.

 

22 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

Later Terriers have different pick ups which are more substantial. 

 

They can be retro fitted to the earlier examples. 

 

Rob. 

 

Three X7425 sets purchased last week from Lendons, good service, but look no different, how can one tell apart. ?

 

IMG_9700.jpeg

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Here's a view of the pickups as fitted to my 'Bembridge' for comparison. 

 

 

20211020_185404-01.jpeg.cdf54ae8d4ed20138204b3bec70364d5.jpeg

 

Rob. 

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Thanks Rob, they do look substantially stronger than the originals, very helpful.

 

Following Fireline's post looks like no point at the moment searching out these new pickups.

 

Suppose we might have to wait until Hornby update their service sheet HSS 445B to get the new part number.

 

 

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Dunno about the Terrier but the pickups on my B2 Peckett were quite fragile so out of curiosity I offered them up to a magnet, and they stuck :o. Could Hornby be using tinplate on the assumption that "nobody" is going to take things apart? I've since replaced them with PB wire.

 

Cheers,

 

David

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On 21/10/2021 at 00:34, davknigh said:

Could Hornby be using tinplate on the assumption that "nobody" is going to take things apart? I've since replaced them with PB wire.

 

I think that's what I'll probably do. Tinplate (or other metal foil?) certainly suggests why there is no "spring" in them.

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On 20/10/2021 at 17:08, Yankee said:

 

Three X7425 sets purchased last week from Lendons, good service, but look no different, how can one tell apart. ?

 

IMG_9700.jpeg


I had similar problems with a German loco from Tillig, it appears the stamping of the 90° bend destroys the springiness of the fold and they soon just fold flat against the chassis. It really needed a radius so try on one of the spares gently rolling the pickup around round pencil, or similar, between the yellow lines so it curves out slightly more than the distance from chassis to wheel. 
F9D79DED-3E6C-472A-99D0-A26D15F4E911.jpeg.322283566755376207d70358056ef605.jpeg

 

Even if the 90° bend folds flat the curve should maintain contact. 

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Funny you should say that Paul, I came to the same conclusion.

 

Here is my attempt with the existing Keeper plate.

 

IMG_9704.jpeg.f09dbcf66c9c7d25f4bbcd55244e1dab.jpeg

 

 

And here is one of the replacement keeper plates once I have managed to remove the brake rods to transfer over.

 

IMG_9706.jpeg.14071572ad7f55574f11abfa20ce59fa.jpeg

 

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On 22/10/2021 at 07:34, DavidH said:

 

I think that's what I'll probably do. Tinplate (or other metal foil?) certainly suggests why there is no "spring" in them.

Probably spring steel if they are magnetic, at that gauge of metal tinplate wouldn't work at all.

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A total of 5 new, eclectic terrier identities in the 2022 announcement today:

 

In the main range is the genuinely interesting, and a bit different choice of:

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/departmental-a1x-terrier-0-6-0-ds680-era-6-r30122

I'm sure most will know, but this is No.54 Waddon. Now in Canada, there were some rumours that it could return for the Barrow Hill event this year. I don't see this happening, but who knows?

 

The club exclusive:

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/sr-terrier-0-6-0t-662-martello-era-3-club-exclusive-r30217

Martello as it has run since 2016. Martello was never, I understand, an IoW engine yet gained an extended bunker in BR days. Despite this product being marked as era 3, it seems to be more a preservation era model as it would not have had the extended bunker when it originally wore olive green. Please correct me if I'm wrong! If I manage to see the real Martello before the model comes out, it might be worth joining the collectors' club for.

 

The IoW set:

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/isle-wight-central-railway-terrier-train-pack-era-3-r3961

The Hornby 4 wheelers seem to look good in this livery. The engine is 11 Newport, which currently sports olive green, but has worn the black IoW livery in preservation previously and therefore the model can cross-era roles. I find it a bit odd that a 3 coach train needs so much braking and luggage capacity, but an attractive set all the same.

 

The anniversary edition:

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/kesr-terrier-150th-anniversary-pack-era-23-r30123

A very nice touch. Some had predicted a nod to the 150th anniversary of the class. To expect all 10 would have been unrealistic, so to pick 2 that we will hopefully be able to see together in these conditions is a good idea. It will be really interesting to see if the real Bodiam/Poplar returns from overhaul in Norfolk in the same condition as the model. For example, Bodiam's distinctive coal rails are not included in the render - a mistake by Hornby or will the real loco have them removed? I have not managed to find any up to date information about its overhaul as to how far the back-dating will go. It seems from some of Hornby's diesel releases (Class 50 in particular), appropriate preservation groups have not been consulted about forthcoming models of their prototypes of interest. Will they have spoken to the Terrier Trust?

 

I have noticed that many are calling for Stepney in A1x IEG across social media. It still makes sense to me as a sure-fire seller. I really can't understand why either terrier-producer has shied away from this for so long. Perhaps there are concerns about TTTE copywright, but Hornby's Lion announcement today makes me think that they feel confident they can get around this kind of thing. I have so far backed the Rails terrier, but whoever produces this first will get my money. Same for 672, though Dapol having produced this in O gives me hope that we may see it in OO in the not too distant future. I just hope that Rails saw sufficient return from their first batch to give them confidence to run another.

 

2022 looks to be the best year for Terriers since the galas of 2006, in which there were 2 galas featuring differing combinations of 5 of the 6 then operational terriers. (A set of these 6 in the conditions they operated in that year would be a real dream, come on Chris... be realistic...) I can't find a concrete date for the Barrow Hill event, but to see several in one place will be brilliant and the nature of the round house will still allow those not in steam to star.

Edited by Torn-on-the-platform
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16 minutes ago, Torn-on-the-platform said:

 It will be really interesting to see if the real Bodiam/Poplar returns from overhaul in Norfolk in the same condition as the model. For example, Bodiam's distinctive coal rails are not included in the render - a mistake by Hornby or will the real loco have them removed?

According to https://www.terriertrust.org.uk/news-and-events/234-bodiam-to-return-as-no-70-poplar-in-improved-engine-green the 'A1X smokebox and unique K&ESR bunker won’t be replaced'

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1 minute ago, Paul.Uni said:

According to https://www.terriertrust.org.uk/news-and-events/234-bodiam-to-return-as-no-70-poplar-in-improved-engine-green the 'A1X smokebox and unique K&ESR bunker won’t be replaced'

Thanks! Just the kind of article I was looking for. If the render is an accurate representation of the model that will be produced, there will be quite obvious differences. 

 

From the product page:

'The Kent & East Sussex Railway has been synonymous with 'Terriers' since purchasing the 1872 built No. 70 'Poplar' in 1901. Having spent most of its life on the K&ESR, to celebrate its 150th anniversary the Railway commissioned 'Poplar's overhaul, with the locomotive now resplendent in its original livery of Stroudley 'improved engine green''

 

Whilst this isn't specific, I read it as Hornby at least claiming the product to represent the loco as returning from overhaul.

 

To answer my own question in the previous post however:

'This Limited Edition of 500 has been produced with the full cooperation of The Kent & East Sussex Railway and loco owners, The Terrier Trust.'

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1 hour ago, Torn-on-the-platform said:

I have noticed that many are calling for Stepney in A1x IEG across social media. It still makes sense to me as a sure-fire seller. I really can't understand why either terrier-producer has shied away from this for so long. Perhaps there are concerns about TTTE copywright, but Hornby's Lion announcement today makes me think that they feel confident they can get around this kind of thing. I have so far backed the Rails terrier, but whoever produces this first will get my money. Same for 672, though Dapol having produced this in O gives me hope that we may see it in OO in the not too distant future. I just hope that Rails saw sufficient return from their first batch to give them confidence to run another.

Indeed, I doubt there's any worry about TTTE copyright, that was long settled since the time the franchise owners(Don't know who did it exactly) tried to sue the Bluebell over Stepney being IEG...said case was thrown out of court immediately cause the livery is of course, historical and the engine wore it well before it was featured in the original books, let alone the TVS.

 

Why Hornby stubbornly refuses to make any of the IEG livery variants Stepney has been in throughout preservation truly astounds me. Like there is no good reason I can think of, cause it is THE most demanded terrier as far as I can tell, they'll be able to tap into that TTTE market (in the sense of how it appeared in the books and the show), they have the livery drawn up already for the A1x and they'd just have to make a couple small changes cause we got Brighton Works a couple years ago, and lord knows many of those Brighton Works have been converted INTO Stepneys lol. 

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2 hours ago, Torn-on-the-platform said:

 

The club exclusive:

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/sr-terrier-0-6-0t-662-martello-era-3-club-exclusive-r30217

Martello as it has run since 2016. Martello was never, I understand, an IoW engine yet gained an extended bunker in BR days. Despite this product being marked as era 3, it seems to be more a preservation era model as it would not have had the extended bunker when it originally wore olive green. Please correct me if I'm wrong! If I manage to see the real Martello before the model comes out, it might be worth joining the collectors' club for.

 

Hello Torn-on-the-platform

 

You are correct in saying that Terrier 662 (Martello) did not carry an IOW extended bunker until BR days and was never an IOW loco. It acquired the extended bunker from 32677 (formally 77 Wonersh, a.k.a W3/W13 Carisbrooke) when that loco was withdrawn in 1959 or sometime soon after. Prior to this it had the smaller "as-built" bunker with coal rails. 

 

Cheers

 

Andy.

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