Recycling an old layout? - NOW FREE to a good home

[Jerry1975]

Hi Mark.

 

A good start, will be looking forward to this develop.

 

Jerry.

[NHY 581]

Resurrection Lane? 

 

Rob

[john new]

6 hours ago, marc smith said:

EDIT: Also, I earlier spotted, there is already another layout called "Phoenix Yard" on this forum, and in the Micro Layouts section too - so I had probably better change the name..... any further suggestions anyone? Wenlock?

I'm sure both can co-exist provided that yours doesn't clash by getting set in the York area where mine will definitely be (fictitiously)  located once it progresses further.

Edited February 11, 2019 by john new

[sb67]

Looks good Mark, be following this with interest. I like the pics of Ogmore road as well, that looked a fine layout.

Steve.

[south_tyne]

Marc,

 

Glad to see you're making progress. There is nothing better than some 1:1 planning to start being things to life and test your initial ideas. Shuffling wagons on paper and trying out locations for buildings is undoubtedly best achieved in this manner.  

 

Will the sector plate simply be a piece of ply that slides on the existing baseboard? 

 

Looking forward to following where you go with this one.

 

David

Edited February 12, 2019 by south_tyne
Spelling

[marc smith]

7 hours ago, south_tyne said:

Marc,

 

Glad to see you're making progress. There is nothing better than some 1:1 planning to start being things to life and test your initial ideas. Shuffling wagons on paper and trying out locations for buildings is undoubtedly best achieved in this manner.  

 

Will the sector plate simply be a piece of ply that slides on the existing baseboard? 

 

Looking forward to following where you go with this one.

 

David

Hi David, yes I always draw a plan up at 1:1 size, on wallpaper before committing to gluing anything down.
Even though I think I can visualise my 2D sketches and plans into 3 dimensions - there's always at least some "tweaking" to do.
That might just be re-positioning a building or two, or perhaps removing a structure completely.
But it's also very handy for making sure sidings are long enough to accommodate sufficient wagons, and the envisaged manouvres can be undertaken

Yes, my sector plate will be a simple sliding version, attached to the far end of the baseboard. I may need to help ease friction of the sector plate - perhaps lining the baseboard surface with very thin plastic card, or creating some sort of runner. I've got a couple of bearings somewhere.... but I still can't find that offcut of thin ply - don't want to go out & buy a whole sheet, only to find my offcut later!  Actually, when shuffling some wagons around, I discovered the proportions of the layout looked better and "flowed" more when re-positioning the bridge from its' original location (making the scenic section a few inches longer). The result is, I will need to project the sector plate a bit beyond the end of the baseboard. 

Thanks for suggesting that we both use the name "Phoenix Yard" too, John new - yes, plenty of places were / are named the same as counterparts elsewhere in the country....
And I do like the name too. I may well change it yet - we'll see.... I promise it won't be set in Yorkshire though... honest

Glued the layouts only point into position last night (the rest of the tracks "hinge" on the position of that really) - partly ballasted it, and have finished building the new roof of the water tower - will paint that later
Now I really need that ply offcut before I can start tacking any more track into place..... hmmm

EDIT: I'm liking NHY581's suggestion "Resurrection Lane" too - cheers matey, but I thought you would be suggesting names that had something to do with sheep!

Edited February 12, 2019 by marc smith

[NHY 581]

I reserve the right to name layouts in an Ovine manner...............

 

 

Rob

[south_tyne]

15 hours ago, marc smith said:

Hi David, yes I always draw a plan up at 1:1 size, on wallpaper before committing to gluing anything down.
Even though I think I can visualise my 2D sketches and plans into 3 dimensions - there's always at least some "tweaking" to do.
That might just be re-positioning a building or two, or perhaps removing a structure completely.
But it's also very handy for making sure sidings are long enough to accommodate sufficient wagons, and the envisaged manouvres can be undertaken

Yes, my sector plate will be a simple sliding version, attached to the far end of the baseboard. I may need to help ease friction of the sector plate - perhaps lining the baseboard surface with very thin plastic card, or creating some sort of runner. I've got a couple of bearings somewhere.... but I still can't find that offcut of thin ply - don't want to go out & buy a whole sheet, only to find my offcut later!  Actually, when shuffling some wagons around, I discovered the proportions of the layout looked better and "flowed" more when re-positioning the bridge from its' original location (making the scenic section a few inches longer). The result is, I will need to project the sector plate a bit beyond the end of the baseboard. 

Thanks for suggesting that we both use the name "Phoenix Yard" too, John new - yes, plenty of places were / are named the same as counterparts elsewhere in the country....
And I do like the name too. I may well change it yet - we'll see.... I promise it won't be set in Yorkshire though... honest

Glued the layouts only point into position last night (the rest of the tracks "hinge" on the position of that really) - partly ballasted it, and have finished building the new roof of the water tower - will paint that later
Now I really need that ply offcut before I can start tacking any more track into place..... hmmm

EDIT: I'm liking NHY581's suggestion "Resurrection Lane" too - cheers matey, but I thought you would be suggesting names that had something to do with sheep!

 

Thanks very much Marc.

 

I completely agree about the 1:1 planning, it helps so much in seeing how the plan works in real life, particularly that 3d element. 

 

Thanks for the information regarding the sector plate. It is interesting to see how you will approach it. I have always struggled with sector plates in the past so was keen to understand and learn how you do it. Sometimes the simplest methods are the most effective!

[marc smith]

14 hours ago, south_tyne said:

 

Thanks very much Marc.

 

I completely agree about the 1:1 planning, it helps so much in seeing how the plan works in real life, particularly that 3d element. 

 

Thanks for the information regarding the sector plate. It is interesting to see how you will approach it. I have always struggled with sector plates in the past so was keen to understand and learn how you do it. Sometimes the simplest methods are the most effective!

I've used the same principles in the past. To create the "arc" shaped cutaway in the foamboard, I used a piece of string, pinned into place where the sector plate pivot will go.
And a pencil on the other end of the string - to draw the arc and check how it aligns with the position of the 3 tracks on the layout proper.
Of course, this is only cut roughly then (at least for the moment) Once I have found that elusive ply offcut and the fine rail joiners I also seem to have misplaced.... I can crack on with the next stage(s)

I will shape the end of the ply, to a suitable curve, attach my pivot point bearing, and more accurately plan the position of the tracks on the layout.

I can see what will happen - I'll have to visit B&Q and my local model shop on Saturday, for the ply and rail-joiners
..... and just after arriving back home - I will find both my own items, hidden in plain view

[Barry Ten]

I've been known to go all the way to Lord and Butler for a pack of rail joiners, but of course I have to have a look around at one or two other items while I'm in the shop, after all it'd be rude not to...

 

Good luck with this new project, Marc - it'll be good to see it develop.

[Turin 60]

Hi Marc, glad to see Mojo restored! 1:1 on paper is a good way to go as paper is cheaper than ply and easier to work. Still interested in Ruyton though.

 

Regards John Bruce.

[Barry Ten]

On 07/02/2019 at 12:22, TonyA said:

 

 It was the Borg, not Lieutenant Worf!

 

Tony

 

 

[south_tyne]

9 hours ago, marc smith said:

I've used the same principles in the past. To create the "arc" shaped cutaway in the foamboard, I used a piece of string, pinned into place where the sector plate pivot will go.
And a pencil on the other end of the string - to draw the arc and check how it aligns with the position of the 3 tracks on the layout proper.
Of course, this is only cut roughly then (at least for the moment) Once I have found that elusive ply offcut and the fine rail joiners I also seem to have misplaced.... I can crack on with the next stage(s)

I will shape the end of the ply, to a suitable curve, attach my pivot point bearing, and more accurately plan the position of the tracks on the layout.

I can see what will happen - I'll have to visit B&Q and my local model shop on Saturday, for the ply and rail-joiners
..... and just after arriving back home - I will find both my own items, hidden in plain view

 

Marc, thanks for that explanation. As I said, I have always struggled with how to go about it but that method using pencil and string makes perfect sense! I have a supply of foamboard so think i will gie it a go for a trial run. If it takes a few goes to get right then nothing is lost. 

 

Look forward to seeing progress when you acquire the necessary bits and pieces. 

 

Thanks again for taking the time to respond to my questions and for so willingly sharing your expertise. It is greatly appreciated 

 

David 

[marc smith]

11 hours ago, Barry Ten said:

I've been known to go all the way to Lord and Butler for a pack of rail joiners, but of course I have to have a look around at one or two other items while I'm in the shop, after all it'd be rude not to...

 

Good luck with this new project, Marc - it'll be good to see it develop.

 

All the way to Lord & Butler.... and you didn't pop in for a cuppa at my place en-route? Hmmm, must stop using that Splott market aftershave!
I was doing a bit of tweaking to the layout last night, and found that a suitable offcut of laminate flooring may well work, if I can't find that piece of ply.
The laminate flooring should make a decent sector plate. I will of course glue & pin something to the edges - so prevent any possibility of warping in future

Re the rail joiners - I'll have to pop in to L&B myself, as I can't find any in my workshop
Another downside of taking an extended break from modelling, is that all my paints seem to have dried up
Perhaps another excuse for a visit to some model shops?

[jamest]

Hi Marc,

 

Looking forward to seeing this develop as your work is right up my street.

 

I know we should always look forward and not back but do you have anything else on Ogmore road? I've had a quick search and have only found a few more pics on line. I'm interested in the layout as I like the hidden entrance at one end and the off-scene run around at the other. Its similar to an idea for something I'd like to develop.

 

Perhaps a simple track plan sketch?

 

all the best,

James

[marc smith]

Hello James,

Thanks for the kind words. Re Ogmore road, I'm afraid there are only a few photos of it, and I think I put them all in an old thread on here, about regretting scrapping your old layout.
Re the plan - I used to have a sketch of it somewhere.... But actually, it was an old Iain Rice plan, from his book on finescale layouts in small spaces
His plan was called "Llanastr Fawr" - or something similar. His inspiration for it being that seminal minumum space layout "Llanastr"

Ogmore Road was basically that plan - incorporating two points and a single slip. However, once I'd neared completion, I decided to extend the layout. I added just over a foot of real estate to the end of the plan, so that I could run through trains. The Dairy hid the exit, to a cassette at the far end of the layout - but it also gave me added operations, as a couple of milk tankers occasionally arrived and left. For this to happen - it meant I usually had to temporarily move some coal wagons out of the way. It was a nice "shunting problem" - which I liked at the time...

Re this current layout project, I have decided to add manouvres too. The plan is basically an inglenook (once again! lol) But it incorporates 4 sidings, instead of the usual 3.
The road at the back will give access to a cassette at the opposite end to the sector plate. The layout will be able to function as it stands, i.e. the one board - but for added interest and possibly exhibitions,
the cassette will allow me to increase operational interest and add manouvres....

I had wanted to include some disused track to the scene initially. I don't know what it is about rusting, half lifted rails - but as a kid, there was so much of it in evidence everywhere I traveled by train.
It just seemed to be a common, everyday sight to see a siding, rusting and overgrown - and we very rarely see that in model form. However, on this small footprint available, and in order to ensure I can add the additional cassette, I have decided not to model a disused siding..... Maybe on the next layout?

Edited February 14, 2019 by marc smith

[jamest]

Hi Marc,

 

Thanks for that I'll take a look along the Iain rice trail to see what I can find.

 

I remember seeing the pictures of Ogmore road you posted elsewhere - I'll keep them bookmarked for future reference!

 

And I will be following this with interest.

 

Cheers,

James

Edited February 14, 2019 by jamest

[sb67]

9 hours ago, jamest said:

Hi Marc,

 

Looking forward to seeing this develop as your work is right up my street.

 

I know we should always look forward and not back but do you have anything else on Ogmore road? I've had a quick search and have only found a few more pics on line. I'm interested in the layout as I like the hidden entrance at one end and the off-scene run around at the other. Its similar to an idea for something I'd like to develop.

 

Perhaps a simple track plan sketch?

 

all the best,

James

 

I like that idea too James, have you googled Hepton Wharf? That a small layout with a similar plan.

Steve.

[marc smith]

Just a little bit of progress on this new project. I didn't quite get the time I had anticipated to spend on it, over the weekend. Isn't that always the way?
With some jiggling about - I still don't think I can fit the old Dairy building into place. It's just a tad too big... but should I think about hacking the last inch or two off the far end (right hand side as you look at it?
Or will that spoil the lines / shape of the building? Plus, it may end up with the structure falling apart. That would be a waste, in itself - but of course it's sitting there, not being used anyway. Hmmm decisions

I've glued a couple of short lengths of the foreground sidings into position - just to check the "flow" and make sure I'm happy with how they look, and their final positions. My original intention, was to add on a bit of foreground to this layout. Barry Ten once said to me that "Poynton Sneer" had a typical "Smith look" to it - saying how I seem to like foregrounds that dip downwards in the centre. True, I do tend to favour this, as it helps get your camera into a position which helps with a lineside view. In my opinion, it can also help introduce another level into a scene - giving the eye somewhere else to pick out details and areas of interest. Introducing these different "levels" or even "mini-horizons" if you like - it can help an area appear to have more depth than it actually does. 

Tacking another bit on to a baseboard, is not my normal approach - indeed it's one of the reasons I normally avoid re-using basebaords. But with a bit of hidden bracing, and my confidence in the strength of modern adhesives like No More Nails etc, and the strength of my usual foam insulation board - I'm quite happy to do this, on this occasion.

Enough wittering on (Hmm, is "Enough Wittering" a good name for a layout? lol) I finished making the new roof for the water tower. The plastic card pieces of corrugations retained their curved shape well, and all seems secure. I painted it in one of the Games Workshop metallic colours (Gun metal, I think the colour is). It needs weathering and rusting, and I'm tempted to to go quite so overboard with it on this occasion - I will judge it as I go along. Re the rivets - I may well just draw these on, as tiny dots of paint..... I'm quite pleased with it so far, I must say. I just wish I hadn't already built it, full size "un kit-bashed" all those years ago. It would have been an easier task and a neater finished result, had I just modified it from a new kit

EDIT: I'll probably add some rust weathering powders to the main structure of the tank too - again, perhaps not too much though - just enough to cover up some modelling "sins"

Edited February 18, 2019 by marc smith

[Ramblin Rich]

Hi Marc. It's good to see you back and progressing with another layout.

Re: the Iain Rice plan, I think the one you refer to is 'Elan' in his book 'An approach to model railway layout design - finescale in small spaces'. I do remember seeing Ogmore Rd at an exhibition (Kidderminster?) not long after getting the book and realised that you had expanded on the plan. The arrangement of level crossings leading to the dairy reminded me of Hemyock. I've just realised I've been trying to incorporate a similar ungated crossing leading to a dairy on my plans. And before you ask, they are still only plans, still too much tumoil to get something set up for real!

 

[marc smith]

3 hours ago, Ramblin Rich said:

Hi Marc. It's good to see you back and progressing with another layout.

Re: the Iain Rice plan, I think the one you refer to is 'Elan' in his book 'An approach to model railway layout design - finescale in small spaces'. I do remember seeing Ogmore Rd at an exhibition (Kidderminster?) not long after getting the book and realised that you had expanded on the plan. The arrangement of level crossings leading to the dairy reminded me of Hemyock. I've just realised I've been trying to incorporate a similar ungated crossing leading to a dairy on my plans. And before you ask, they are still only plans, still too much tumoil to get something set up for real!

 

Hi Ramblin Rich,
Nice to hear from you again good sir
Yes, you're quite right, Iain Rice did call it "Elan aka Llanastr Fawr" (the latter meaning Big Llanastr - though the plan is hardly "big" lol)
I think we also chatted, sometime back, and you said you'd seen Ogmore Rd at Kidderminster. I never did many shows with Ogmore, sadly
EDIT: Oddly enough, Ogmaore was next door to a 4mm scale Hemyock layout at the Kidderminster show!

In fact, once I'd built Ogmore, I realised that I could extend it, and improve operating potential by including the extra footage. Funny you should mention the Dairy, reminding you of Hemyock.
Having then fairly recently acquired a copy of Paul Karau's book on Branchline Termini, I instantly became a fan of Hemyock. I looked such a quaint, atmospheric and odd little station, and I really liked the fact that the Dairy lay beyond the station. It spurned several ideas at the time... and continues to inspire me. The other day, I was looking at some pics of a class 25 shunting there in the 70's - after the station had closed, and obviously while the Dairy was still rail served. Great photos they are too I think they were in the book "Rail Blue" - is that Paul Shannon?

Hopefully, your plans will come to fruition one day Rich -  go on....  I've been nagging you now, for how long? 8, 9, 10 years?

Hmmm, now can I tear up what I've done so far, and build my own version of Hemyock?

Edited February 18, 2019 by marc smith

[johnsmithuk]

Lazarus Lane?

[marc smith]

3 hours ago, johnsmithuk said:

Lazarus Lane?

 

Oooo, nice suggestion John

[mervyn]

Morning Marc can I ask did you scratch-build the station building on Ogmore road ? it looks superb ! merv.....

[marc smith]

Morning Merv,

Thanks for your kind words re the station building on Ogmore Rd
Yes, I scratch built it. It was done from the drawings of Cowbridge (2nd) station building, from the book on that railway
Made from Slaters Plastic card. Absolute $0d to paint, with those red brick / yellow brick reveals and quoins / corners...
Actually, to do these features correctly, I should have cut the brickwork properly - in the end I just did it with paint, using masking tape cut to give me the edge pattern.... and several attempts
I still have it - though it's a little worse for wear and dusty now - I will re-use it though

Just 10 minutes or so of fiddling with the current layout project last night - bit if tweaking of positions etc
Can't do too much before I get that sector plate in position now - perhaps a bit of scenic contours in the background & foreground.....

Edited February 21, 2019 by marc smith