Pace Yourself - photos of the final(?) Pacer countdown

[pacerfan]

1 hour ago, Dave47549 said:

 

Noisy, yes, but this one at 1:56 is none too sluggish:

 

 

- But my person preference is for the original TL11/SCG combo at 0:42!

The Leyland TL11/SCG drivetrain was my favourite too. After March 1991 (when all later classes of Pacer had got Voith gearboxes), i used to go to West Yorkshire a lot to have rides on the Class 141s. Their early withdrawal in 1995-98 was a big disappointment to me.

Edited February 5, 2020 by pacerfan

[russ p]

Is there many TL11s available from road vehicles to fit on preserved ones? It would be quite involved to refit the original gearboxes as the wiring was considerably altered but not impossible if you could actually find one

[4630]

If anyone is interested, 142068 is in use today by Northern for route training between York and Scarborough. 

 

Timings can be found here

[eastwestdivide]

14 minutes ago, 4630 said:

If anyone is interested, 142068 is in use today by Northern for route training between York and Scarborough. 

 

Timings can be found here

Guess that would be for those York-Scarborough shuttles starting in the new timetable?

[4630]

4 minutes ago, eastwestdivide said:

Guess that would be for those York-Scarborough shuttles starting in the new timetable?

 

Yes, that's what I figured it was for.

 

One can but hope that when this service starts with the timetable change that TPE's time keeping and service reliability has improved.  Otherwise Northern Trains new service might suffer.

[Owd Bob]

I saw a 142/150 combo at approx' 2.28pm leaving Wigan Wallgate, i presumed it to be the 2N99 going to Blackburn. 

[Jack Mc]

A few photos from recently.

 

Doncaster, 01/02/2020 -

 

144017

 

144005

 

144023

 

144015

 

144023, with 801213 in the background

 

144010

 

Elsecar -

 

144001 'The Penistone Line Partnership' - 05/02/2020

 

144014 - 06/02/2020

 

Jack

[pacerfan]

On 05/02/2020 at 09:27, russ p said:

Is there many TL11s available from road vehicles to fit on preserved ones? It would be quite involved to refit the original gearboxes as the wiring was considerably altered but not impossible if you could actually find one

As Leyland ceased production of the TL11 engine in 1988 around the time of the Leyland Bus management buyout, there are not many TL11 engines around now. However, until more recently a Polish company, Jelcz did make copies of Leyland engines. One is shown here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=-C2fHDxZykc

 

It would be good to have one of the GMPTE orange livered 142s restored to original condition with Deans four leaf doors, TL11 engines and SCG R500 gearboxes. However, it probably would be difficult for a preserved railway to operate one as the gearboxes were so unreliable. Weardale Railway had a lot of trouble with their Class 141 and scrapped it. Also, the 142s have had their original final drives replaced by Voith units. Would this be a barrier to re-fitting an SCG gearbox?

[russ p]

1 hour ago, pacerfan said:

As Leyland ceased production of the TL11 engine in 1988 around the time of the Leyland Bus management buyout, there are not many TL11 engines around now. However, until more recently a Polish company, Jelcz did make copies of Leyland engines. One is shown here: www.youtube.com/watch?v=-C2fHDxZykc

 

It would be good to have one of the GMPTE orange livered 142s restored to original condition with Deans four leaf doors, TL11 engines and SCG R500 gearboxes. However, it probably would be difficult for a preserved railway to operate one as the gearboxes were so unreliable. Weardale Railway had a lot of trouble with their Class 141 and scrapped it. Also, the 142s have had their original final drives replaced by Voith units. Would this be a barrier to re-fitting an SCG gearbox?

I'm not sure about the final drives were these fitted the same time as the voith gearboxes. 

I used to drive them at the time they fitted the voith gearboxes.  I'd be happy to see one with TL11s and voith as at least it would be reliable 

[37038]

Following a rumour that Saturday 15th February would be the "last day", I have had the following from a manager within Northern:

 

142's will be running until "at least" the 6th March in the North West, there will still be 2 diagrams that will include a 142 on them. There is already a nominated pool of 4 that will work these, with the other 10 NH based units moving to HT from the 15th Feb onward for storage.

 

Hopefully it's of some use to people trying to get as much last-minute mileage as possible!

 

 

 

[Wheatley]

On ‎03‎/‎02‎/‎2020 at 10:11, russ p said:

 

Has anyone actually been killed in any pacer?  I wouldn't fancy hitting anything in one 

 

Not as a result of the construction of the vehicle. They are more substantial than you think, they were modified after the Winsford smash and there are some fairly substantial crash beams behind all that fibreglass. I've dealt with plenty of insurance claims against blind farmers driving in front of them on accommodation crossings and the Pacer won every time, even against some fairly meaty bits of farm machinery.

 

The accident at St Annes (and a similar one resulting in serious injury rather than death on Leeds North West around the same time, Burley in Wharfedale ?) was nothing to do with the design of the unit as such, the original working instructions for power door units only required the conductor to check once before closing the doors. The conductor in the Burley incident was prosecuted twice and eventually acquitted, the Judge gave BR a proper hairdrying in his summing up over inadequate training and risk recognition. The result was the still current "check once, close all doors except local; check twice, close local" system of work.  

 

On ‎04‎/‎02‎/‎2020 at 23:45, pacerfan said:

144017 hit 37681 head on at Skipton in January 1992. The Pacer's front end was rebuilt, but the 37 was scrapped.

Which is why you don't drive from the back cab :-) The two less-damaged bits of the 144 were hauled to Kilmarnock for repair behind a 156, it was signalled as an out of gauge load with a lot of ratchet straps around the bodies just in case, and two very nervous looking TRIs riding in it listening for clunks and creaks. The third vehicle went by road.  

Edited February 7, 2020 by Wheatley

[pacerfan]

11 hours ago, russ p said:

I'm not sure about the final drives were these fitted the same time as the voith gearboxes. 

I used to drive them at the time they fitted the voith gearboxes.  I'd be happy to see one with TL11s and voith as at least it would be reliable 

The Voith final drives were fitted in 2014: https://www.railwaygazette.com/traction-and-rolling-stock/voith-to-retrofit-pacer-dmu-final-drives-and-wheelsets/39344.article

 

Whilst pacers are withdrawn here, in Slovakia they are rebuilding their railbuses: https://www.railwaygazette.com/traction-and-rolling-stock/zos-zvolen-produces-demonstrator-dmu/38840.article

Edited February 7, 2020 by pacerfan

[Lord Flashheart]

142068 + 071 at York this morning,thanks to Tom Robson for the photo.

 

Rob

[JDW]

8 hours ago, pacerfan said:

The Voith final drives were fitted in 2014: https://www.railwaygazette.com/traction-and-rolling-stock/voith-to-retrofit-pacer-dmu-final-drives-and-wheelsets/39344.article

 

Whilst pacers are withdrawn here, in Slovakia they are rebuilding their railbuses: https://www.railwaygazette.com/traction-and-rolling-stock/zos-zvolen-produces-demonstrator-dmu/38840.article

 

Seems like a good idea (and quite common with trams in Eastern Europe, many have had low floor sections inserted and the outer sections modernised to match). Imagine if we ever did such a thing though, taking an old train, rebuilding it, making it more usable, more modern, there'd be uproar. Oh, wait, we did [Vivarail's D-stock]. And there was. 

[Davexoc]

According to this - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-51412945

they are almost 3 times more reliable than their replacements at the moment. Current casualty figures for the CAFs are not very good, teething troubles with the digital technology versus the old analogue system on the Pacer......

[Market65]

It’s interesting to note that 142068 has no handrail on the cab end. Here’s a photo of it which I took at York yesterday which I hope shows the lack of that handrail a bit more clearly. 
 

 

Best regards,

 

 Rob.

[Northmoor]

1 hour ago, Davexoc said:

According to this - https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-51412945

they are almost 3 times more reliable than their replacements at the moment. Current casualty figures for the CAFs are not very good, teething troubles with the digital technology versus the old analogue system on the Pacer......

ALL trains go through this.  A lot of it isn't the kit itself but crews haven't been trained or developed the experience to quickly resolve a fault.

 

Anyone enthusiastic about the reliability of Pacers clearly doesn't remember that it took the first 80% of their working lives to get reliability to an acceptable level.  They were truly dreadful for the first five years and it took a substantial redesign of their transmission to get to acceptable.

[Welly]

Well, it it easy to fix a Pacer fault with a piece of string and duct tape!

[4630]

A rail trip on 8th February 2020 from Huddersfield to Doncaster, via Leeds, to go the Doncaster Show provided an opportunity to photograph any Pacers that were about.

 

Just after 8am and 144014 is stabled in Huddersfield Sidings in the company of 195005 and 195107 which are being used for driver training.

 

At Doncaster and 144011 departs with 2R17, 09.25 Adwick to Sheffield.

 

 

After a very enjoyable time at the show first of the class 144001 stands at platform 0 waiting to depart with 2P17, 14.42 Doncaster to Scunthorpe.

 

Back at Huddersfield and 144016 ready to depart with 2B23, 16.12 Huddersfield to Sheffield.

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by 4630
To correct a typo.

[SHMD]

Here is the once common 150+142 on the 10:00am Stalybridge to Manchester Victoria service yesterday (Sat 08/02/2020).

A beautiful day before the storm that's here now.

 

As it left there was a 150 on Platform 2 waiting to form the 10:13 Stalybridge to Stockport "parliamentary". This used to be almost guaranteed to be a 142 when it departed at 09:46 in the previous timetable.

 

Also, you can see where they have improved Stalybridge with the recently applied "MIND THE GAP" decals!

(How many decades has it taken for these to reach here from London?)

 

 

Kev.

 

[Penmorfa]

142077 near Plenmeller, between Haltwhistle and Carlisle, 10-10-2000. Photo taken on a wild day!

[KeithMacdonald]

Cruel and Unusual Punishment in Hawick?
 

Quote

 

UK’s most hated trains to run on Waverley route

 

They are Britain’s most hated trains, condemned as “noisy, draughty, bouncy and outdated” by passengers, but largely spared from Scots – until now. The notorious Pacers are finally being phased out from routes in England and Wales, only for two to be given a new lease of life on a heritage line in the Borders. They are due to run on the Waverley Route Heritage Association’s (WRHA) track south of Hawick this summer – giving people north of the border the chance to judge the trains for themselves.

 

Yes, but ..

 

Quote

The WRHA said it bought the Class 142 Pacers because it already has a prototype, but agreed with their poor reputation. Chairman Chris Donnelly said: “The criticisms levelled against them by passengers are fair –they are noisy, drafty, bouncy and outdated.  “However, we also need to remember that were it not for them, many rail lines might well have closed.

“From a preservation point of view, you get quite attached to the trains you look after. I’m sure that it will be the same with them. “Although they are not historically associated with the Waverley Route, we are already the home of the Railbus demonstration unit, the forerunner of the class.

Ref:

https://www.scotsman.com/news/transport/uk-s-most-hated-trains-to-run-on-waverley-route-1-5087837

 

An example of Stockholm Syndrome?

[30851]

 

 

 

The view from the US - https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/pacer-trains-uk/index.html

 

 

Rob

[david.hill64]

6 hours ago, 30851 said:

 

 

 

The view from the US - https://www.cnn.com/travel/article/pacer-trains-uk/index.html

 

 

Rob

When I read an article that says that Pacers use the same chassis as a Leyland bus from the 70's I despair for the stupidity of journalists and realise that you cannot trust anything you read in a newspaper on any topic...............

[newbryford]

142s are eking out their days on Rochdale-Clitheroe services.

There's usually a couple of 150/142 combos on the daily diagrams.

 

Quite fitting that they should end their days on this line, as some of the original testing was carried out north of Blackburn on the line through Clitheroe to Hellifield.

 

Best Regards,

Mick