Pace Yourself - photos of the final(?) Pacer countdown

[black and decker boy]

This was posted on WNXX With regard to Northerns pacers

 

“looks like the last full week of operation will be w/c 29th Nov, with 142s starting to be removed from traffic w/c 6th Dec so by the 12th they are all out of service”

 

 

[kryten65]

https://flic.kr/p/2jYmwXy  the first half of 142045 being delivered to a school in County Durham, to be plinthed and converted in to a library for the school. we've never had such an enthusiastic audience when we've been offloading a trailer before!

Edited October 29, 2020 by kryten65

[eastwestdivide]

20 minutes ago, kryten65 said:

https://flic.kr/p/2jYmwXy  the first half of 142045 being delivered to a school in County Durham, to be plinthed and converted in to a library for the school. we've never had such an enthusiastic audience when we've been offloading a trailer before!

The puns are bound to follow...

"starts a new chapter"

"what's this service booked for?"

"BR Rolling Stock Library"

"living on borrowed time"

 

[4630]

5 minutes ago, eastwestdivide said:

The puns are bound to follow...

 

 

 

I couldn't decide between 'round of applause', 'groan' or 'funny', so settled on the relatively safe ground of 'like'.

[Derekstuart]

On 18/02/2019 at 22:03, Market65 said:

It can’t come soon enough, sadly. A bad train in all ways which will not be missed by me. I hope I never see another one.

They really should not have been put into service on anything of more than ten miles, Bridlington to Hull and Sheffield is totally unacceptable. Run a bus, it’s much more comfortable than a dreaded Pacer.

The seats in 144012 are worse than the original bus seats. I had the great misfortune to have to grin and bear them on a journey from Hull to York in early October of last year. I can see why they are commonly referred to as ‘ironing board seats’.

I have some photo’s of them, which I will dig out and post in due course and some videos.

But I’ll not miss them. 

 

Best regards,

 

Rob.

In an alternate reality:

BR North East Regional Manager: "Following the continual barrage of negativity towards the Pacer series of railbuses by those who think everything should be as it was in the 1930s, I have decided to recommend for closure all lines radiating East out of Darlington, make the York-Scarborough single line to save money in order to keep loco hauled trains there for the enthusiasts. I shall also be decimating much of the lines radiating out of Leeds and Tyneside too. I expect my fellow regional managers will do likewise, including much of Wales and the Cornish peninsula. "

That, Mr Market65, is the reality of it. Many routes were in the last chance saloon. At Whitby no less, when a chance encounter came with the Deputy Regional Manager BR(NE) he said as much. Were it not for the Pacers then his office were going to recommend the closure of several branch lines to the BR Board.
 

Running a bus depot you might expect me to agree with you that it's better to run buses than Pacers, but I don't. That they were used on long distance services was not a fault with the design. Imagine replacing a HST with a Met Cam 101 and sending it Kings Cross to York. A fault with Met Cam or a fault with BR planning?

 

[Northmoor]

5 minutes ago, Derekstuart said:

That they were used on long distance services was not a fault with the design. Imagine replacing a HST with a Met Cam 101 and sending it Kings Cross to York. A fault with Met Cam or a fault with BR planning?

 

I agree 100%, adding that they have also been in service longer then they were designed for.  The body is based on the contemporary Leyland National bus, of which I believe none have been in public service for at least a decade now.

[GordonC]

5 minutes ago, Derekstuart said:

In an alternate reality:

BR North East Regional Manager: "Following the continual barrage of negativity towards the Pacer series of railbuses by those who think everything should be as it was in the 1930s, I have decided to recommend for closure all lines radiating East out of Darlington, make the York-Scarborough single line to save money in order to keep loco hauled trains there for the enthusiasts. I shall also be decimating much of the lines radiating out of Leeds and Tyneside too. I expect my fellow regional managers will do likewise, including much of Wales and the Cornish peninsula. "

That, Mr Market65, is the reality of it. Many routes were in the last chance saloon. At Whitby no less, when a chance encounter came with the Deputy Regional Manager BR(NE) he said as much. Were it not for the Pacers then his office were going to recommend the closure of several branch lines to the BR Board.
 

Running a bus depot you might expect me to agree with you that it's better to run buses than Pacers, but I don't. That they were used on long distance services was not a fault with the design. Imagine replacing a HST with a Met Cam 101 and sending it Kings Cross to York. A fault with Met Cam or a fault with BR planning?

 

 

I agree and think there are probably another couple of factors to throw in too, if you subject an HST, widely accepted to be one of if not the best train in this country for decades to the same load factor as Pacers loaded with commuters in rush hours with standing room only - I dont think you'd have the same happy passengers. And the ride on pacers isn't actually all that bad on continuous welded rail, the fact they were used on lighter used and jointed rail track combined to give the nodding donkey effect. I think the Pacers have borne the brunt of passengers frustrations with services being provided on the cheap that is unfair on the train design itself. Fitting comfier than the original bus seats and doubling train lengths to reduce standing would have gone a long way to making them 'acceptable' for most passengers.

[Wheatley]

4 hours ago, Derekstuart said:

That, Mr Market65, is the reality of it. Many routes were in the last chance saloon. At Whitby no less, when a chance encounter came with the Deputy Regional Manager BR(NE) he said as much. Were it not for the Pacers then his office were going to recommend the closure of several branch lines

 

What he said. A lot of minor routes are only open because of Pacers and that the fact that they allowed a 2 for 3 replacement of the (by then utterly knackered) 1st gen units at a time when the Thatcher government didn't want to spend anything on rail.

 

A lot of the current network only exists because the much maligned and apparently hopeless/useless BR was quietly interpreting its brief in the loosest possible terms. Ron Cotton's creative interpretation of "close the S&C" being the best known. 

[Lord Flashheart]

5 hours ago, Derekstuart said:

In an alternate reality:

BR North East Regional Manager: "Following the continual barrage of negativity towards the Pacer series of railbuses by those who think everything should be as it was in the 1930s, I have decided to recommend for closure all lines radiating East out of Darlington, make the York-Scarborough single line to save money in order to keep loco hauled trains there for the enthusiasts. I shall also be decimating much of the lines radiating out of Leeds and Tyneside too. I expect my fellow regional managers will do likewise, including much of Wales and the Cornish peninsula. "

That, Mr Market65, is the reality of it. Many routes were in the last chance saloon. At Whitby no less, when a chance encounter came with the Deputy Regional Manager BR(NE) he said as much. Were it not for the Pacers then his office were going to recommend the closure of several branch lines to the BR Board.
 

Running a bus depot you might expect me to agree with you that it's better to run buses than Pacers, but I don't. That they were used on long distance services was not a fault with the design. Imagine replacing a HST with a Met Cam 101 and sending it Kings Cross to York. A fault with Met Cam or a fault with BR planning?

 

Well said that man,I couldn't agree more and judging by their popularity in preservation there about to do it all again. 

 

Rob

[Northmoor]

35 minutes ago, Lord Flashheart said:

Well said that man,I couldn't agree more and judging by their popularity in preservation there about to do it all again. 

 

Rob

I've said before on this thread, don't read too much into their sudden popularity with preservationists, that there will suddenly be hordes of the general public keen for a ride on one, or railways will start introducing public services.  It takes more - a lot more - than a cheap train to do that. 

 

There are precedents here; when the 1st Gen DMUs* were withdrawn, lots got preserved cheaply, plenty have since been scrapped and almost no-one uses them for regular services.  Then the DEMUs (Thumpers) were actually given away by Porterbrook, but a decade later and less than a quarter of them are in regular operation.  The public and to a great extent enthusiasts as well are simply not interested.  In fact the latter group tends to be uninterested in anything other than loco haulage by ex-BR locomotives.

 

Rob (Another one)

*I'm actually one of those weirdos who quite likes riding on 1st Gen DMUs, but know I'm in the minority.

[kryten65]

We went back this morning and delivered the other half, now all coupled up and ready for the next step

[Derekstuart]

21 hours ago, Lord Flashheart said:

Well said that man,I couldn't agree more and judging by their popularity in preservation there about to do it all again. 

 

Rob

 

20 hours ago, Northmoor said:

I've said before on this thread, don't read too much into their sudden popularity with preservationists, that there will suddenly be hordes of the general public keen for a ride on one, or railways will start introducing public services.  It takes more - a lot more - than a cheap train to do that. 

 

 

Both of these diametrically opposed viewpoints are valid and I agree with both without any hint of contradiction.

Northmoor is quite right- they aren't going to have masses of people coming to them in the way that an express Pacific or a Deltic would, that's very true.

 

But then, as Lord Flasheart points out- they might just do for preservation railways what they did for BR- allow trains to run cheap. In this case they might not see as many miles in use per year as a locomotive, but then their operating costs are so much lower. I'm a qualified PSV mechanic and aside from the electrics associated with TPWS, CSR etc (all of which are now irrelevant) I could maintain one. There's no 10 year boiler overhaul, nor 100 year old cracked cylinders and if the engines ever need overhaul- well, they are a hell of a lot easier to do than a Napier-Deltic engine.

So yes, they will see fairly limited use, mostly diesel galas I suspect, but their cost of operation will be very, very low. 

PS I seem to remember that once NYMR started using their Met Cam first thing and last thing for passengers who were travelling against the usual traffic patterns set up for the steam service.

[woodenhead]

They're gone (apparently)

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-england-manchester-55110222

[lmsforever]

This appeared on my screen  descibed unit as coach typical for the beeb now ,dont think users will miss them should  have gone years ago.

[Northmoor]

9 minutes ago, lmsforever said:

This appeared on my screen  descibed unit as coach typical for the beeb now ,dont think users will miss them should  have gone years ago.

Very much local reporting - they've only "all gone" on Northern; Wales and GWR in SW England are still operating them.

[woodenhead]

Just now, Northmoor said:

Very much local reporting - they've only "all gone" on Northern; Wales and GWR in SW England are still operating them.

I was wondering that myself, but of course with current restrictions us Northerners in Tier 3 land won't be going anywhere near the South West to see the 143s behind (or half the time at the front) of a 4 coach train.

 

How long left for the 143s?

[Mike_Walker]

GWR 143s should be retired at the December timetable change. Just four daily diagrams now, all working coupled to a 150 or 158. TfW 142s and 143s should be gone by the end of the year unless they get another extension.

[boxbrownie]

13 hours ago, woodenhead said:

I was wondering that myself, but of course with current restrictions us Northerners in Tier 3 land won't be going anywhere near the South West to see the 143s behind (or half the time at the front) of a 4 coach train.

 

How long left for the 143s?

This morning on the TV news they did interview a chap from Northern Rail and he did seem to emphasis it was the last trip on Northern Rail for the Pacer......but nothing was said about the rest of the country, typical North/South divide 

[boxbrownie]

13 hours ago, lmsforever said:

This appeared on my screen  descibed unit as coach typical for the beeb now ,dont think users will miss them should  have gone years ago.

I heard one report say they were made “out of bus parts”.......well OK......

Edited November 28, 2020 by boxbrownie

[Wheatley]

Given that the article starts "Northern bids a final farewell..." why is anyone expecting it to mention Cornwall ? It's based on a Northern press release, I dont expect Northern give a fig what happens to the GWR ones. As long as GWR dont try to send them back...

 

[boxbrownie]

1 hour ago, Wheatley said:

Given that the article starts "Northern bids a final farewell..." why is anyone expecting it to mention Cornwall ? It's based on a Northern press release, I dont expect Northern give a fig what happens to the GWR ones. As long as GWR dont try to send them back...

 

No one is “expecting it to mention Cornwall” what it said on the TV report was it was the last day of the Pacer.....it was only when interviewing the Northern Rail exec did a mention (from him not BBC) that it was the last run for Northern Rail, oh yes....and it was on the National BBC News, not just the northern part 

[Wheatley]

Apologies, I read things into the replies to Woodenhead's "They're gone..." post which weren't there. 

 

Northern's MD was on the last trip, he was an engineer at NH when they were introduced. 

Edited December 2, 2020 by Wheatley

[4630]

The first of several scheduled moves of Northern 142s away from Newton Heath TMD should take place on 3rd December 2020.

 

This move as 5E13 should include 142004 + 142018 + 142070 + 142090.

Timings for 5E12 are here.

 

[4630]

Further to my post yesterday, on checking the schedule this morning before heading out with my camera it looks as though 5E12, following cancellation, has now been reinstated and is running to revised timings. 
 

 5E12 revised timings.

 

 

Edited December 3, 2020 by 4630
To add revised timings.

[4630]

Through a combination of a technical glitch with my 'phone and incompetence on my part I managed to just miss photographing 5E12 yesterday.   For the record the Pacers on that working were, in the following order, 142018/090/004/070.

 

There was however a further movement from Newton Heath TMD on 4th December 2020, using the same headcode and timings.  So, braving the sleet which was just turning to heavy rain, here they are passing through Deighton.  The consist was 142068/078/065/087.      

 

 

 

Probably the last time that I will get to see them operating on Network Rail metals, unless the rumours of a pair being retained in the short term for driver training purposes proves to be accurate.

 

 

Edited December 5, 2020 by 4630