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N gauge layout suggestions - 48x72


Nova Scotian
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Looking for thoughts/input and assistance.

 

I've traditionally been an OO modeller, and my current (small) collection is OO.

 

However, I'm very limited for space, given that I want a "roundy" layout. For me there's something about watching a train click and clack it's way around the layout that's very soothing.

 

I'm looking at potentially building an N gauge layout. There's no specific era or geography in mind. I'm in Canada and I'd probably run both North American outline and British outline. I have a soft spot for Era 3, particularly GWR and SR, but my general approach will be "it's mine, I run what I want".

 

With limited space available my dimensions will be as follows:

- 36 to 48 inches wide. 36 is preferable, but I'll go as wide as 48. Somewhere in between may give me more room for sidings and operational fun, without going all the way to 48.

- 72 inches long, potentially pushing as long as 96 inches, but it's going to be extremely tight at that point.

- I can consider an L shaped layout, possibly. I figure this would be each board 36 inches wide, with a maximum length of 72-84 inches. 

 

Main requirements:

- Track radii that allow smooth medium speed running for "roundy", up to and including pacific class locos on the outer radius/edge

- Some form of gradient where a line can cross over another - I want to make the landscape interesting. With the limited space available I'm assuming this'll have to be an almost 4% gradient, but that's okay as I'll only be running something short (think pannier tank with two bogie coaches). Anything I can do to reduce the gradient is ideal, a with the track radius to try and reduce wheel flange friction

- I'd like a "main" station, a couple of platforms allowing me to run through or stop. This would likely be at the "front", on the long edge of the layout, but the plan is to be able to walk around the entire thing. I guess that's where I'd typically operate from

- Some operational interest on the mainline - a passing loop or something. I'm not sure if I want to run double track the entire way around or not

- Operational interest somewhere around the station - some sidings where I can do some shunting. I'm a real idiot when it comes to understanding how best to layout sidings and points for maximum combinations in limited space, so thoughts here are appreciated.

- Landscape - I plan to build up some hills/valleys etc. A tunnel probably, maybe two. Something that allows multiple viewing angles. It's probably too much to include a "dock/quay" scene at the main station given the space available, like, I can't do everything, but that type of thing appeals.

- If I don't do some sort of dock/quay I'll be dropping a river into the landscape somewhere - for this reason am I best to build the layout on a thin layer of foam over the baseboard, so I can cut down into it?

 

Other thoughts:

- I'd considered Kato unitrack, I know some sneer at it, but it's very robust and runs well. However, the thought of trying to figure out all the different pieces required and having them fit together makes me think I'll just run flexitrack. Possibly code 80 rather than 55 so I can run older trains easily.

- Almost certainly going to be DC, probably with the ability to control two tracks at a time. With some of the crossovers I'm considering this may be a problem? I'm not overly smart at the electrical side, though I can learn. Perhaps I need to use electric points to reduce the manual input and "set" the train's path. The only problem is that the cost begins to balloon for that stuff.

- My partner's going to help me build the scenery, she's a little more talented than I am when it comes to the fine arts. This provides a way for me to do the large landscape/gradient pieces, lay track, operate etc, while she works on different techniques for realism (she also loves the sound + sight of trains running). So it's going to be important for us to get a good mix of easy running, operational interest, and varied landscapes, a bit of a balanced approach.

- I don't see running anything longer than 5 bogie coaches given the space restraints.

- I *may* experiment with some canted/superelevated track on the outer ring for faster running, which I've always wanted to try, but getting the transition right in such a short space means I probably won't.

 

Initial plan:

- I think this is a good place to start from: https://www.katousa.com/track-plans/scenic-ridge.html

- It's 36x72 - so if I can have an extra few inches, especially in width, that gives me more space at the front (station) to add extra track for sidings etc. Get some interesting buildings in. 

- Is there any point trying to push from 72 inches longer for the gradient? Or to make it manageable to move in one piece, rather than two, should I stick to 72 inches?

- With more width, do I create a line that runs around the layout, through a tunnel, while that other line climbs the gradients and loops around? The single track seems a bit too simplistic, though I like what it does for scenery options.

 

It's been a very long time since I track planned - is there easy to use software, or should I just work to lay things out?

 

Layout will be built on plywood baseboard, supported by lumber underneath. It'll be only inside, so won't have to deal with wild swings in temperature, but does have to deal with some nasty summer humidity. Open to building onto a foam base, but I've not done that before, so would have to learn new techniques for the track work, glueing etc.


Any thoughts/advice is gratefully appreciated. Open to questions.

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13 hours ago, Fluo66 said:

These are a lot of wishes for a small layout even in N gauge. Maybe something like that may fullfil your needs: https://www.thegoodsyard.co.uk/twinlevel.html (just for inspiration). It measures 28x72 inches. With a few extra inches you could add a dock scene at the front that is served by the branch line.

I'm aware I was being pretty demanding! 

 

Thanks for sharing that link - that's a really good trackplan. Because I can push wider than 28 inch I can ease the curves a bit, and as you state make room for that dock scene.

 

Very much appreciated - going to take this under advisement. I do really like the elevated section, but may need to rearrange slightly (helped by the wider board) for scenery purposes.

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If you want a "roundy-roundy", it's much better visually to have an operating well in the middle. But that does mean pushing out to the full 48" width.

 

There are some good plans, originally intended for OO in 12' x 8', which have a high-level terminus, a mid-level continuous run and a return loop. Gradients are not excessive.

 

What era of American stock are you wanting to run? You may need to be very careful about clearances if it is modern, long vehicles.

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3 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

If you want a "roundy-roundy", it's much better visually to have an operating well in the middle. But that does mean pushing out to the full 48" width.

 

There are some good plans, originally intended for OO in 12' x 8', which have a high-level terminus, a mid-level continuous run and a return loop. Gradients are not excessive.

 

What era of American stock are you wanting to run? You may need to be very careful about clearances if it is modern, long vehicles.

This is a good point I'd not considered - I'd already thought to myself "I have no plans to run a big-boy" and therefore I should be okay aiming for reasonable clearances to run anything.

 

I'm drawn to the 50s/60s - EMD F9s and the like. I'm also in Canada and tend to like CP/CN (that's what most of my OO is). These, and the rolling stock of the time, should be okay clearance wise. However if I were to look toward some of the new amtrack stuff (bilevel coaches etc) I can imagine this would be a problem.

 

I was thinking of a roundy-round where the scenery in the middle is built up - forcing you to walk around to get the different views. I realise this would make operating more of a challenge. Having not built anything in a long time... is that a good plan or doomed from the start?


Appreciate your helpfulness.

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4 hours ago, mdvle said:

Part of the answer will depend on circumstances - is this going to be in a dedicated railway room or is it sharing the room with other uses?  What is the size of the room?

It will be "dedicated" while the layout is in use/building. The space available is 12' x 14', ish, so easy to walk around it. However, I will carry/wheel it away for storage. So I'm more limited by my storage. Otherwise I'd just build it the whole size of the room because who needs a living room!

 

Currently planning to put it on castors to move as one block, but could feasibly use folding legs and practice lifting weights... (also splitting in two would help, especially if 4'x8')

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So then what are the storage limitations?  Does it have to fit through a doorway? And how would you rate your building skills (thinking of making the layout fold, much like the minories was designed to fold, for storage)?

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11 minutes ago, mdvle said:

So then what are the storage limitations?  Does it have to fit through a doorway? And how would you rate your building skills (thinking of making the layout fold, much like the minories was designed to fold, for storage)?

Making a layout fold, or split in two, or folding legs for upright storage, doesn't particularly concern me. I'm good at the big lumber and hinge skills, I'm poor at fine landscape detail, paint etc.

 

It does have to fit through a door, so I can't go too "tall". I'd keep it to 30" tall, which on its side would fit through a narrow door. If I go the easy route of storage I have an easy 72" of length, and stored on its side the width isn't an issue. If I go a harder route for storage (twisting around various ways) I can push beyond that 72", but it'd have to be important for me.

 

I think my preference through is a hinged swing on legs with castors, so I can just roll it.

 

Does this make sense?

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15 hours ago, Nova Scotian said:

This is a good point I'd not considered - I'd already thought to myself "I have no plans to run a big-boy" and therefore I should be okay aiming for reasonable clearances to run anything.

 

I'm drawn to the 50s/60s - EMD F9s and the like. I'm also in Canada and tend to like CP/CN (that's what most of my OO is). These, and the rolling stock of the time, should be okay clearance wise. However if I were to look toward some of the new amtrack stuff (bilevel coaches etc) I can imagine this would be a problem.

 

I was thinking of a roundy-round where the scenery in the middle is built up - forcing you to walk around to get the different views. I realise this would make operating more of a challenge. Having not built anything in a long time... is that a good plan or doomed from the start?


Appreciate your helpfulness.

 

Wot 'e said.

 

If you have to leave clear space to walk round a 6' x 4' layout, that needs a space of at least 10' x 8', more likely 11' x 9'. That is OK if that access space is also useful for something else e.g. access to other hobby activities in a shared space. But, if not, rather better to build an 11' x 9' layout.

 

Edit: Sorry, just seen subsequent replies. Do you have a free wall in this room? May be easier to build it to fold against the wall (like a bed in a studio appartment) than on a trolley.

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5 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

If you have to leave clear space to walk round a 6' x 4' layout, that needs a space of at least 10' x 8', more likely 11' x 9'. That is OK if that access space is also useful for something else e.g. access to other hobby activities in a shared space. But, if not, rather better to build an 11' x 9' layout.

 

So the above brings up another point, that you appear to have contradicted yourself.

 

You say the room will be dedicated to the layout when it is being built / in use, but then give a throwaway line about who needs a living room.

 

So which is it?  If this is used as a living room (or anything else), where does that furniture etc. go when the layout is out and being used?

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2 hours ago, mdvle said:

 

So the above brings up another point, that you appear to have contradicted yourself.

 

You say the room will be dedicated to the layout when it is being built / in use, but then give a throwaway line about who needs a living room.

 

So which is it?  If this is used as a living room (or anything else), where does that furniture etc. go when the layout is out and being used?

By moving my coffee table, I create a large space around which I could walk easily around a layout that's 48x72. However, I can't store the layout in this room - it would need to be moved in for me to work on it, and out to storage when I'm finished.

 

I likely do not have a free wall to keep it more permanently there, but folded against the wall as an example. The size and location of the entry way and other furniture (that would be too heavy to move regularly) preclude that.

 

Make sense?

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31 minutes ago, Nova Scotian said:

By moving my coffee table, I create a large space around which I could walk easily around a layout that's 48x72. However, I can't store the layout in this room - it would need to be moved in for me to work on it, and out to storage when I'm finished.

 

I likely do not have a free wall to keep it more permanently there, but folded against the wall as an example. The size and location of the entry way and other furniture (that would be too heavy to move regularly) preclude that.

 

Make sense?

 

Perhaps you could post a plan of the room? Folded against the wall would normally be a good option with the layout, when deployed, higher than the furniture.

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What about a solution along these lines:

https://www.officefurnitureonline.co.uk/office-desks/exclusive-triumph-office-desks/triumph-metrix-office-desks/metrix-tilt-top-tables/triumph-metrix-tilt-top-tables.html?gclid=CjwKCAiA2fjjBRAjEiwAuewS_RMWeR0VkMSw_d5c_Aect_nTzweEi1V3rPAq1eg8JuyFJVI8NND4_xoCskMQAvD_BwE

 

It would need all the track and scenery to be fixed securely and you'd have to be careful to lift off all rolling stock before you tilted it!

 

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6 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

 

Perhaps you could post a plan of the room? Folded against the wall would normally be a good option with the layout, when deployed, higher than the furniture.

Will do - travelling right now, but will post some dimensions and room plan Friday.

 

Maybe there's an option to move around some furniture and attach it, but I'm not visualising it well.

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There was a superb N gauge layout in this space which featured in the Railway Modeller in early (January?) 1999. It was based on the LNER/LMS in West Yorkshire and shoehorned an awful lot into a fairly small space without appearing at all cluttered or unrealistic.

 

It featured a mainline station, MPD and a really impressive townscape sitting above part of the station and concealing the curve at one and. It showed you could do an awful lot in this kind of space though, without too much compression or need to look unrealistic, with scale length trains and mainline atmosphere. 

 

I may be mistaken but think it may have been called Springfield (or Springburn?). I will see if I can dig out the said article but perhaps someone else also remembers it from my vague (and not very helpful) description?

 

Cheers,

David

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14 minutes ago, south_tyne said:

There was a superb N gauge layout in this space which featured in the Railway Modeller in early (January?) 1999. It was based on the LNER/LMS in West Yorkshire and shoehorned an awful lot into a fairly small space without appearing at all cluttered or unrealistic.

 

It featured a mainline station, MPD and a really impressive townscape sitting above part of the station and concealing the curve at one and. It showed you could do an awful lot in this kind of space though, without too much compression or need to look unrealistic, with scale length trains and mainline atmosphere. 

 

I may be mistaken but think it may have been called Springfield (or Springburn?). I will see if I can dig out the said article but perhaps someone else also remembers it from my vague (and not very helpful) description?

 

Cheers,

David

This sounds brilliant. Thank you so much.

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On 06/03/2019 at 01:42, south_tyne said:

There was a superb N gauge layout in this space which featured in the Railway Modeller in early (January?) 1999. It was based on the LNER/LMS in West Yorkshire and shoehorned an awful lot into a fairly small space without appearing at all cluttered or unrealistic.

 

It featured a mainline station, MPD and a really impressive townscape sitting above part of the station and concealing the curve at one and. It showed you could do an awful lot in this kind of space though, without too much compression or need to look unrealistic, with scale length trains and mainline atmosphere. 

 

I may be mistaken but think it may have been called Springfield (or Springburn?). I will see if I can dig out the said article but perhaps someone else also remembers it from my vague (and not very helpful) description?

 

Cheers,

David

 

The layout you are thining of is 'Springdale' by Roy Scholfield. The schmatic track plan is below, but it was apparently constructed on a 6' x 3'9" baseboard.

Springdale Plan.jpg

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3 hours ago, NWJ said:

 

The layout you are thining of is 'Springdale' by Roy Scholfield. The schmatic track plan is below, but it was apparently constructed on a 6' x 3'9" baseboard.

Springdale Plan.jpg

 

Thanks very much NWJ, that is indeed the layout I was thinking of. I always thought it was highly effective and well thought out and, importantly, in no way looked crowded or unprototypical. 

 

Thanks again and hopefully it is useful to the OP :good_mini:

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Excuse the awful drawing, I was travelling, then deleted where I stored the file, and now it's late and I had a long day...

 

It's an odd situation - I have no "permanent" room that I could designate. My apartment is 60 sqm, two bedrooms - one for me, one for kids. I would use an area by my bed for storage of the layout when not under construction and in use (which is where my space restraint comes from for something that folds/wheels/breaksdown).

 

In the living room I have a large entry way (on the right as you look at it), even with my storage furniture overhanging I have about 105cm through the entry way. Directly opposite that is a window with an electric radiator beneath (high temperature - you can't put anything above or next to it).

 

On the wall at the top of my diagram are a tall filing cabinet (180cm tall), and then storage furniture including bookcases, tv stand, toy storage etc. This is all the same depth, and the height varies. I see this wall as "done" though, I can't move the furniture elsewhere as most of it is fixed together, the TV has to go there because of where the connections are etc.

 

Down the right wall as you look at it, another bookcase (slim, 140cm tall), a wardrobe (two girls, only room in their bedroom for one wardrobe, so the second is in my living room!) that's 180cm tall. The corner space is inefficient - I have a chair diagonally that fills the gap between the wardrobe and the sofa, currently a rocking chair. I rarely use this (as my kids are now older), and there's a potential to use that corner, but it's only 80cm by 80cm approx. It would be hard up against two walls and the wardrobe, and then against the sofa (but higher) if I were to try and fix something to the wall here.

 

Back wall is a large 3 seat sofa. Gap between it and the outside wall for cables, speakers, various reasons (15cm gap).

 

Therefore I believed my best option is something I can drop into the middle of the room. The coffee table is light and easily moved. If I can move the layout to storage, and I believe I'm competent enough to create a folding/wheeled solution, then this seemed best.

 

I COULD push an absolute maximum of 300cm by 180cm if taking up the entire empty floorspace, but then I couldn't store it, or get around it. To leave reasonable working room on all sides and be able to store it, I settled on roughly 183cm by 130cm - or 4x6, 48x72. 


Red box is rough (not to scale) placement and dimension of layout if I were to take this approach. You'll see why I feel as though 36 inches (91cm) would be preferable, or even somewhere inbetween, as pushing the full 130cm will make it slightly tight. (45cm on each side - whereas 60cm would be much more comfortable!)

 

Thoughts? Questions? Concerns?

 

My understanding from this is I'd want something that's "scenic" all around - I could put scenic breaks in to split into two, but there'd be no storage area or fiddle yard that's not devoted to being scenic. With the ability to walk around etc this is why I was thinking some gradients would add interest and chop the scene up a bit.

 

image.png.9d6ea4e404454d95278031f16459a961.png

 

 

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