BBC Four - James May's Big Trouble in Model Britain

[CME and Bottlewasher]

4 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

 

There's quite a difference in the two statements and if it had been made in the latter form it may not have been picked up upon. As referenced by others there have been exceptional events which have exceeded that figure on occasions but the statement indicated a steady rate of closure which has been contested. I am sure you are passing on the information quoted in good faith but, despite you saying it's empirical, it hasn't been verified and it may be worth asking the person who related this for further data.

 

 

I am comfortable that both parties have a sound level of knowledge in this respect, I know what they do and what their background is. Similarly observations over a lengthy period on commentary here indicate that the figure isn't a steady rate, certainly if applied to model shops or stockists of model railway items.

 

 

I was hoping that by challenging the initial statement (lest it get repeated by others) would iron out any incorrect information so it's unfortunate that there's now an accusation of unfair practices. There's many things I know but cannot say on a public forum so I don't (but rest assured none of them have anything to do with such practices).

Andy,

 

Please feel free to PM me if you need to know more detail in private.

 

I stand by what I said as such came from those imbedded within the industry. I recently met with a local model shop at a show and with him was the buyer for a local group of model shops. Neither contribute to this forum. They outlined what they're suffering at the hands of certain OEMs and certain 'box shifters'. I can't and won't comment further in open forum as such is commercially sensitive.

 

I did write a considered reply on here to you and the others, prior to this one. The server timed out, the post was duplicated, I requested that one be hidden and now they're both deleted AFAICT.

 

Life is too short. I have been factual and honest out of my concern for the industry and love of and for the hobby.

 

Sadly my integrity seems to be being called into question and as the messenger I appear to be being shot at. I'm very disappointed by it all.

 

In few hours I shall - in case you wish to reply further - stop alerts from this thread and stop following the thread accordingly. Then that will leave you all in peace.

 

Kind regards,

 

CME.

[Guest Locomotion No. 3]

Quote

Dennis,

 

whether all those companies you list are manufacturers in the generally accepted sense is open to discussion. The facility to have a model manufactured on a sub-contract basis in China provides the opportunity for large retailers with sufficient funding to commission products, which may be welcome by many. Having the sole rights to retail that model also provides them with a competitive advantage in the marketplace. However, if that it puts at risk those businesses such as Hornby and Bachmann, who "manufacture" and distribute a far wider range of products to the retail outlets, then the hobby as followed by the majority will be much worse off.

 

Jol

 

I get plenty of emails from factories in China all wanting to do direct business with Locomotion Models. The point I was making was that rather than extract revenue from the companies I listed and putting them at risk, we are in fact supporting them by commissioning models through them. Some of these involve new tooling (DP1 Deltic, Stirling Single etc.) whilst others utilise existing tooling from those suppliers catalogue ranges ('Mallard', 'Flying Scotsman' etc.). 

 

Companies serving the British (not all are British based) ready-to-run market all have very experienced research, development and design capabilities. Having worked for one of them, I am very aware of the many challenges it takes to get a model from the concept stage and into the shops. The experience, knowledge and professionalism each of them bring to the table is invaluable to a small operation such as Locomotion Models.

 

 

Dennis Lovett

Exclusive Models Marketing Executive

Locomotionmodels.com

 

 

 

[AY Mod]

57 minutes ago, CME and Bottlewasher said:

 

I'm disappointed that you don't believe me

 

Oh give over, I had the good grace to question your source rather than you.

[Steamport Southport]

Not so much model shops as buying paint. 

 

When I was growing up nearly every shop sold Humbrol enamel or an equivalent such as Airfix. Woolworths, WHSmith, toy shops, model shops, department stores, newsagents, post offices, etc. Physically hundreds of shops. Now I can't find a single supplier in Liverpool, one of the biggest cities in Europe. It's the same for Airfix kits, not a sausage. It's the lack of high street sellers rather than dedicated model shops that's the problem IMO.

 

Hobbycraft only sell acrylic and a tiny selection of kits, usually the starter packs. If I want anything then it's online I'm afraid. Then you need it sent by courier as Royal Mail refuse to carry liquids/hazardous materials.

 

I did ask in an artists shop and the snotty girl rudely said "We don't sell hardware". Yeah. Like I'm using a tiny 14ml tin to paint a fence. 

 

 

Jason

[railroadbill]

3 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

Not so much model shops as buying paint. 

 

When I was growing up nearly every shop sold Humbrol enamel or an equivalent such as Airfix. Woolworths, WHSmith, toy shops, model shops, department stores, newsagents, post offices, etc. Physically hundreds of shops. Now I can't find a single supplier in Liverpool, one of the biggest cities in Europe. It's the same for Airfix kits, not a sausage. It's the lack of high street sellers rather than dedicated model shops that's the problem IMO.

 

Hobbycraft only sell acrylic and a tiny selection of kits, usually the starter packs. If I want anything then it's online I'm afraid. Then you need it sent by courier as Royal Mail refuse to carry liquids/hazardous materials.

 

I did ask in an artists shop and the snotty girl rudely said "We don't sell hardware". Yeah. Like I'm using a tiny 14ml tin to paint a fence. 

 

 

Jason

Fortunately I've got a very good model shop locally (sells mostly trains) which carries a large number of paint ranges, humbrol revell railmatch tamiya precision vallejo etc. loads of glues, fillers etc. all stuff royal mail won't send. Local Hobbycraft isn't too bad (only humbrol and tamiya) but does have a lot of artists colours plus cheap poster paint etc great for scenery.

However some years ago I used a local art shop to buy oil and acrylic paints to use in weathering and the guy who ran the shop was very interested and helpful.

Unfortunately the shop closed.

[Phil Parker]

1 hour ago, CME and Bottlewasher said:

I did write a considered reply on here to you and the others, prior to this one. The server timed out, the post was duplicated, I requested that one be hidden and now they're both deleted AFAICT.

 

No, I hid one (didn't see the request, sorry, I'm working not sitting on RMweb all day), other is still in this thread.

 

[Hroth]

4 hours ago, SVRlad said:

 

Same with Hattons and the class 66s - they’re available on the website for pre-order, and not at a bad price too.

 

Incidentally, has anyone got any idea why for some smaller retailers the price of ‘Evening Star’ and 66789 are more than the others? I’m really tempted by 66789, to the extent where I’m considering adapting my diesel depot plans accordingly, but some places charge £90 for those two while the others (including the Flying Dustman) are priced at £75. 

 

 

 

As far as I remember, when the Hornby 2019 listings were first published, some 66s were priced at about £20 more than the rest of them, and came into line a week or so later.  No idea why, unless the original price point for the Class 66s was to be in the £90 bracket, then got reduced and someone forgot to make the changes for ‘Evening Star’ and 66789.  (I thought that the initial higher price was to cover some horrid livery licencing fee!)

 

Its possible that the retailers you've seen are not "aware" that the price was reduced?

 

 

[Barry Ten]

6 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

 

... which brings the thread round to something I've been thinking about for the last few days.

 

Model shops based at heritage railways have to my mind a great potential for the future of the model railway trade. They have big advantages over the traditional town centre shops of not having to pay rent and have volunteer staff, so no wages to pay. They also get plenty of families visiting - who are important both for the future of heritage railways and the hobby.

 

 

 

 

 

I'd have thought so - I always end up spending a bit of money in any well-stocked heritage railway shop, either on books or models - but there's a remark in one of the newsletters I get from a heritage organisation that the stuff aimed at enthusiasts doesn't sell as well as it used to, and it's more the family-orientated stuff like local produce (fridge magnets, marmalades, jars of  fudge, etc I presume) that they see as the future. 

[Workbench52]

1 hour ago, wainwright1 said:

Hi Workbench52.

 

This looks very nice. Its a pity that Hornby don't upgrade some of their older fairly accurate wagons to more modern standard. The L.N.E.R. bogie brick wagon and Southern bogie utility van also spring to mind.

I seem to remember an article in a magazine some years ago where a similar upgrade was carried out on this van.

In that case, the whole chassis was replaced with a Peco one, as used in their Wonderful wagons. Basically they had to plot the position of the prongs for the chassis components onto the underside of the van and then drill holes for them. This obviously gave them the bonus of a wagon with working buffers and suspension, but I cannot remember if they cut off the mounts for the Peco couplings. Then the steps were added.

I think that the Peco chassis components may still be available.

I hope that this is of interest.

Ray

 

.

 

Yes, the Peco wagon kit system was quite canny. As a small firm they couldn't afford expensive tooling so the key part was the diecast 'box'. That could be used for lots of different models. It kept everything square and rigid and also gave some much needed weight to the vehicle. The plastic used for the frames etc. was a funny soft flexible type (some type of vinyl perhaps?) which didn't matter as the diecast box provided the strength and rigidity. It also had the benefit that the leaf springs did actually give a little springing. If I remember rightly soft plastic arms also gave springing to the buffers too.

 

The W irons were a metal sheet stamping. The printed and embossed card sides were cheap to produce in small runs, and enabled lots of different private owner liveries to be produced. As well as open wagons they also produced low sided wagons, 'roofed' wagons (for salt, lime etc.) and vans. They used the Hornby Dublo type of 'clasp' coupling which was popular at the time but by the '70's the Triang 'Hook and Bar' type had become more dominant.

 

I made loads of these at the time . . . . which I guess was the 1960's. Compared to the ready to run stuff of the time it was quite good although I seem to remember they weren't cheap. Once Airfix started reissuing the Kitmaster models and then went on at quite a rate to produce new models from their own tooling they seem to be eclipsed as they were less than half the price. I think they were still available through the 70's though and had a small but dedicated following . . . just like the soon to disappear Hornby Dublo!  (Just remembered that they also produced some of them in TT during the brief 7 years that Triang produced that scale and for some years after). Here are a few pictures that I've found on the net just now . . . .

 

[Deltic]

4 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

Hornby must have stuck their partly developed model into the pending cupboard at least three quarters done in order to be able to get it on sale so quickly, and they clearly wouldn't have left it in limbo indefinitely. Possibly until sales of their old one started to flag and/or the tooling began to show signs of wear.

 

My gut feeling is that the difference the Rails announcement made to Hornby's strategy probably amounted to three or four years.

 

John

 

 

As far as I can tell the Terrier was around 95% complete when shelved.  So why would you wait a whole year (it would I understand been in their 2020 Release programme) when it was that close.  A similar theme to the Hellcat, which was well down the list as it got put in a cupboard.

 

You need to bear what was stated, Hornby Hobbies would like to reduce their time to market to closer to 18 months in future.  But it does depend on the R & D effort, some take longer than others to get all the material together + variations over a locomotive or rolling stocks life.

 

As been stated both Hornby and Bachmann have items which go through updates, but others come along seeking a road to market which can result in duplication.  But their products have a greater number of outlets to service potential customers. The choice is up to the customer - who will also need to look at after sales service.

[Workbench52]

4 hours ago, wainwright1 said:

Hi Workbench52.

 

This looks very nice. Its a pity that Hornby don't upgrade some of their older fairly accurate wagons to more modern standard. The L.N.E.R. bogie brick wagon and Southern bogie utility van also spring to mind.

I seem to remember an article in a magazine some years ago where a similar upgrade was carried out on this van.

In that case, the whole chassis was replaced with a Peco one, as used in their Wonderful wagons. Basically they had to plot the position of the prongs for the chassis components onto the underside of the van and then drill holes for them. This obviously gave them the bonus of a wagon with working buffers and suspension, but I cannot remember if they cut off the mounts for the Peco couplings. Then the steps were added.

I think that the Peco chassis components may still be available.

I hope that this is of interest.

Ray

 

.

Thanks. Watching the TV documentary on Hornby I did wonder if it was the moulds for older models like these that had been capriciously scrapped though?

[jjb1970]

A large number of the classic Airfix and Hornby tooling is still in use. In recent years I have bought a lot of of their WW1 military figures the tooling for which must be over 40 years old. The Airfix catalogue is awash with classic old kits. The Hornby range has made heavy use of classic pre-China Hornby and Lima tooling, some of which is older than me. Which indicates that either the tooling disposed of was either unfit for use or the dregs (let's be honest, some of the old classic models they are still selling probably have an emotional appeal to people who remember them from childhood but are woeful by modern standards). I think the Station Master raised a good point about record keeping and assets but I really don't think that dreaming about old tools is the way forward for Hornby when the better and/or usable stuff is still being used in China and India. Look on the bright side though, some clever individuals obviously figured out a solution to the insurmountable problem of how to get it all out of the storage racks without killing everyone. 

[Robin Brasher]

1 hour ago, Barry Ten said:

 

 it's more the family-orientated stuff like local produce (fridge magnets, marmalades, jars of  fudge, etc I presume) that they see as the future. 

The Swanage Railway shop did stop selling model railway items for about a year but they are selling both Hornby and Bachmann now.  The main reason they stopped selling Hornby was due to supply problems. Most people buy from Hattons, Rails or Kernow as the shops on preserved railways charge the full recommended retail price but they get enough customers to keep going. I think the manager of the Swanage Railway shop gets paid which I think is a good thing as she is knowledgeable about what to order and what the customer wants.

[Widnes Model Centre]

3 hours ago, Hroth said:

 

As far as I remember, when the Hornby 2019 listings were first published, some 66s were priced at about £20 more than the rest of them, and came into line a week or so later.  No idea why, unless the original price point for the Class 66s was to be in the £90 bracket, then got reduced and someone forgot to make the changes for ‘Evening Star’ and 66789.  (I thought that the initial higher price was to cover some horrid livery licencing fee!)

 

Its possible that the retailers you've seen are not "aware" that the price was reduced?

 

 

 

Well done Hroth,

 

As a result of this post, I have just checked my 2019 initial Hornby Order. R3747 Evening Star and R3748 66789 are both showing an RRP of £99.99. Both now showing as £74.99.

I believe the retailers charging £90 are unaware of the price reduction. I was unaware that the price was £99.99 until you pointed it out!

[Edwardian]

54 minutes ago, Robin Brasher said:

 ....  they stopped selling Hornby ... due to supply problems. 

 

Thank goodness they did not have recourse to commission their own models to fill the gap, otherwise they'd be hunted down by the Kohlenator.

 

"I want your Prairie, your Class 66 and your Terrier" 

 

Edited March 18, 2019 by Edwardian

[Workbench52]

Model Shops Closing

 

It is very sad to see Model Shops closing. I worked in one in the 60's and early '70's on the outskirts of Birmingham. Even then though it was something of a 'labour of love'. The boss was a very skilled model maker and could have made much more from that or other engineering work. When my Dad retired he started to do the books for some of the local shopkeepers. My boss was only too keen to take up the offer, especially as V.A.T. was coming in to add to the complications. In the shop we had some beautiful sets of tiny draws that the boss had made. These contained all the myriad of small parts, detailing items and spares that we carried. However, he was strongly criticised by his accountant who told him that the return on the items sold from them was so low that he could make 5 times the money by selling them and putting the money in a building society!! He explained that it was something of a 'sprat to catch a mackerel' since it brought people into the shop who later came in to buy boxed items (locos, rolling stock, track etc.) which we did make money on. So far so good.

 

Getting stuff from Triang . . . . . later 'Triang Hornby' . . . . in Margate was always a bit of a nightmare in those days. You had to put your order in for what you wanted for Christmas in the Summer. Then when it arrived in November you opened the cartons to see what you had actually received. It was never everything that you'd asked for and sometimes little more than half. As it wasn't consistent you couldn't simply order twice as much as you wanted, for fear of getting stuck with stock in the late spring that you hadn't sold over Christmas/New Year.

 

At that time there were only two model shops in Birmingham City Centre. Both were quite small though, and only one was exclusively model railway. They were no threat as competitors and the boss knew the woman who ran one of the shops quite well. If she needed something in a hurry we'd often send it to her and occasionally she could return the favour.

 

Then one year Beatties opened a big shop in the newly opened shopping centre built over New Street Station. We started to notice that we were losing a few boxed sales to them, even in the summer. Then one day near Christmas the boss had to go into town for something and when he came back he was fuming. Apparently he'd decided to check out Beatties while he was there. He was amazed at the retail shelf prices . . . . they were SO low that they were less then the wholesale price Triang Hornby at Margate were charging us.

 

Just to rub salt into the wound . . . . . we always had a lot of returns after the Christmas/New Year period. No problem as we were an approved repairer. We were quite good at fixing  locos and other equipment. (I must say that they seem so simple compared to today's offerings from Hornby, Bachmann et. al.!!).

But this year the Boss asked each customer where they had bought the item and time and again it was Beatties and sometimes one of the mail order firms that were getting started then. These were nearly all faces that we didn't know and so the boss told them in no uncertain terms to take it back to the place that they'd purchased from!

 

I didn't realise it at the time but it was the beginning of a slow decline that would take quite a few, increasingly difficult years, before the boss finally 'threw in the towel'. (I think it would have been sooner but he built commercial models, town centre plans, new machines, factories etc. which paid well while the work was available). By then I'd decided to do a bit more with my education and, having a clearer idea about what I wanted to do, gone off to college as a a 'mature student'. (so easy then with a grant for support and no college fees to build up a huge debt). None-the-less I remember that time in my life with great affection and modelling has stayed with me as a hobby all my life.

 

So model shops closing isn't a new phenomena. I think the ever rising costs of retail . . . . rents, business rates, wages for staff etc. coupled to changing shopping habits such as on line purchasing is going to continue the trend for the foreseeable future. A few big traders will do very well but your friendly local shop will increasingly be a thing of the past. I think small business owners expect more  from running a shop these days too. The difficulties and risks must weigh heavily upon you and if you are getting less than the average wage from it you can't help wonder if it is really worth it.

 

Addendum . . . . . . . . . . . .

 

There was a time  a few decades ago when a lot of people in quite well paid jobs were being offered early retirement with a generous lump sum or golden handshake. With a good lump of money behind you many were tempted to change their hobby into a business. Some brought model shops and many set up little 'cottage industry' manufacturing concerns. These retirement deals are now very much a thing of the past and most of these people are well past retirement age. Much as they love the business, when the income gets below a certain level they are deciding that enough is enough and it is time to hand over to someone else. But who is out there with the available cash today?

 

It is noticeable that many small manufacturing firms are being sold to existing business for whom that firm now becomes just another line of theirs. The reduction in overheads works sometimes . . . but not always. If you had a shop it is probably difficult to find someone to take it on. So if you get a good offer for the premises and a reasonable deal for the stock . . . why wouldn't you realise your assets and go off and enjoy your retirement . . . even if the shop will now be yet another take away food outlet!!!

 

(The shop below isn't actually Beatties in Birmingham but this is pretty much how it looked inside)

Edited March 18, 2019 by Workbench52
Corrections

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, Deltic said:

As far as I can tell the Terrier was around 95% complete when shelved.  So why would you wait a whole year (it would I understand been in their 2020 Release programme) when it was that close.  A similar theme to the Hellcat, which was well down the list as it got put in a cupboard.

 

You need to bear what was stated, Hornby Hobbies would like to reduce their time to market to closer to 18 months in future.  But it does depend on the R & D effort, some take longer than others to get all the material together + variations over a locomotive or rolling stocks life.

 

As been stated both Hornby and Bachmann have items which go through updates, but others come along seeking a road to market which can result in duplication.  But their products have a greater number of outlets to service potential customers. The choice is up to the customer - who will also need to look at after sales service.

'95% complete' sounds to me like an awful lot of invested time & money to throw away even if it had only been spent on research and drawings.  One wonders how it might have got that far if it hadn't been approved for full development and production or were Hornby's financial controls that lax back in those days? 

[truffy]

10 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

Model shops based at heritage railways have to my mind a great potential for the future of the model railway trade. They have big advantages over the traditional town centre shops of not having to pay rent and have volunteer staff, so no wages to pay. They also get plenty of families visiting - who are important both for the future of heritage railways and the hobby.

 

The only two that I've visited (K&ESR@Tenterden, RH&DLR@Hythe), neither in the last 3 years, were pretty woeful in the stock that they carried. And are not going to get any better if they're mainly catering to families. Sure, they may play a role in bringing new enthusiasts to the hobby, and that's not to be sniffed at, but as far as being useful for more serious hobbyists forget it.

[RJS1977]

3 hours ago, Barry Ten said:

 

I'd have thought so - I always end up spending a bit of money in any well-stocked heritage railway shop, either on books or models - but there's a remark in one of the newsletters I get from a heritage organisation that the stuff aimed at enthusiasts doesn't sell as well as it used to, and it's more the family-orientated stuff like local produce (fridge magnets, marmalades, jars of  fudge, etc I presume) that they see as the future. 

 

I guess a lot will depend on location - there's now such a paucity of model shops in my area that I think if we could find sufficient volunteers for the shop to be opened on a regular basis (i.e. every weekend, whether the railway is running or not) and be able to advertise the fact, we could do quite well. The tricky bit is getting started in the first place....

[Jeff Smith]

11 hours ago, MarkSG said:

This is also where railway modelling parts company with the market supplied by, for example, Airfix. With a plastic aircraft kit, the whole point of buying it is for the pleasure of constructing it. And, having built it, all you do with it is put it on display on a shelf so that you can admire your handiwork. Railway modellers, by contrast, buy models mostly to run, rather than look at. Why spend six months building a kit when you can take it out of the box and have it running on the layout in minutes? For most of us, that's a no-brainer. 

 

Well, maybe a no-brainer if your main interest is operating but a significant number are I suppose you could describe as 'Airfix' minded, ie building supplies the pleasure....I just acquired an unassembled K's 63xx, which once I add a new chassis, motor, gearbox and wheels will cost £200 or so but will give me several months of entertainment!.......

 

I don't keep up with RTR offerings but I believe locos in the 43xx extended family have been produced in the past and a new production is imminent. 

['CHARD]

On 14/03/2019 at 23:03, The Stationmaster said:

Not appearing at Chard I hope 

 

Eh?   No modern chaff here!

[Coryton]

6 hours ago, Hroth said:

 

As far as I remember, when the Hornby 2019 listings were first published, some 66s were priced at about £20 more than the rest of them, and came into line a week or so later.  No idea why, unless the original price point for the Class 66s was to be in the £90 bracket, then got reduced and someone forgot to make the changes for ‘Evening Star’ and 66789.  (I thought that the initial higher price was to cover some horrid livery licencing fee!)

 

Its possible that the retailers you've seen are not "aware" that the price was reduced?

 

 

Yes - I was afraid it was a licencing fee too...

 

I have placed a pre-order at a shop that originally had the large logo one at the higher price - but when I queried it, the price came down.

 

There still seem to be a few that have them at the higher price - I'm sure it's an error.

 

I have just contacted two to point it out - a bit unreasonable for them to be losing out on orders because of a mistake by Hornby.

[JSpencer]

2 hours ago, Workbench52 said:

 

 

Addendum . . . . . . . . . . . .

 

There was a time  a few decades ago when a lot of people in quite well paid jobs were being offered early retirement with a generous lump sum or golden handshake. With a good lump of money behind you many were tempted to change their hobby into a business. Some brought model shops and many set up little 'cottage industry' manufacturing concerns. These retirement deals are now very much a thing of the past and most of these people are well past retirement age. Much as they love the business, when the income gets below a certain level they are deciding that enough is enough and it is time to hand over to someone else. But who is out there with the available cash today?

 

It is noticeable that many small manufacturing firms are being sold to existing business for whom that firm now becomes just another line of theirs. The reduction in overheads works sometimes . . . but not always. If you had a shop it is probably difficult to find someone to take it on. So if you get a good offer for the premises and a reasonable deal for the stock . . . why wouldn't you realise your assets and go off and enjoy your retirement . . . even if the shop will now be yet another take away food outlet!!!

 

(The shop below isn't actually Beatties in Birmingham but this is pretty much how it looked inside)

 

 

 

 

 

At the signal box, 1990s We fought off Toys'R'Us and indeed through building up the mail order trade became a big fish. We were not alone in the Medway towns. The oldest best known shop was Bakers model shop in Gillingham. I was about 15 when that closed down. The owner retiring. Nearby was Blundell's toy shop also stocking Hornby, sold at RRP, I brought half their stock when they closed down. In Rochester high street, there was another shop mainly specialised in continental and another shop off city way avenue targeting the kit building brigade.

Serious modelers saw Hornby as toy trains and the Signal Box with as the main focus was RTR. But we survived until sold to Modelzone (I had long since left by then).

 

20 plus years on, my job has nothing to do with model trains. But my salary is far better than what it could have provided. Kids have all but grown up, no real mortgage left, savings in the bank. Very nearly made redundant, which would have been a hefty cheque but found another position internally (18 years in one international company, you get to know everyone, my new boss is based in Atlanta, the old in the same office in Paris) with a decent pay raise plus the possibility to change my mind until December.  Now with just my savings, I could open a model shop, or set up a cottage industry. But the calculations really showed how pointless the exercise is compared with doing some certifications (training) to move into another domain that pays more and is an evolution of my position today.

The only business plan which worked (savings plus redundancy pay) that could eventually provide a decent wage, was doing a start up manufacturing RTR. I would need to spend nearly 2 years getting the product developed (no crowd funding here - that was worthless too), so would need to finance my life until the product was delivered and ready for sale. All of this of course is more risky (Brexit, someone else doing the same etc, etc) for a gain about equal to the secure salary I get now. I,m seriously tempted but, this exercise really did show what must go through people's minds when starting up a small business and I can quickly see why people of my generation, reaching their late 40s, with resources, decide it is not the most lucrative avenue to follow up. My business idea not scrapped, far from it. We will probably start it part time.

Edited March 18, 2019 by JSpencer

[Jeff Smith]

It may be tempting to turn a hobby into a business, and some people have been very successful, but especially in retirement, it requires careful thought.  My other hobby is art and I have funded some of my railway modelling with commissions and sales, but I avoid working to tight timescales.

[Matt C]

On 13/03/2019 at 22:29, 37114 said:

 

 

- The so called Professional layout builders - really???? Who the f*** applies glue with an 8" screw driver????

Ahh but that is the sign of a TRUE professional !  Mere mortals go off and hunt for 8 hours for that special 'must have' glue applicator they bought at last years show for a small fortune. . . The true professional grabs the nearest 8" screwdriver, kitchen spatula (don't tell the wife)  Cat (no idea why he's got leaves and twigs stuck all over him love, must have rolled in something)  and cracks on with the job 

 

Good light hearted but insightfull program,  Good luck and fair weather for the future Hornby

On 13/03/2019 at 22:29, 37114 said: