Rail-Online Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 (edited) Hi, Aplogies for the poor quality of this transparancy but it shws an unusual signal box on what I think to be MR metals (the mileage marker is pure MR) . May well be around the Chesterfield area as other (distant) views confirm a 4 track main line with slag heaps and substantual sidings. Can anyone help with the location please? Thanks in advance, Tony Edited March 8, 2019 by Rail-Online Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastwestdivide Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 Can you see any more of the telegraph pole on the extreme left? i.e. was it a typical Midland two-pole type? Certainly the milepost looks like a standard Midland one. Could it be on the Cudworth route through Yorkshire? Plenty of coal/spoil heaps... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail-Online Posted March 8, 2019 Author Share Posted March 8, 2019 Yes they are typical MR twin post jobbies. Here is a view in the opposite direction, you can JUST make out the signal box in the distance https://www.rail-online.co.uk/p265322570/hc3e44b15#hc3e44b15 Cheers Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted March 8, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2019 The LNWR had quite a few signalboxes of that design, Mostyn for example, could the photograph be a joint MR/LNWR line, somewhere around the Liverpool area maybe? Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastwestdivide Posted March 8, 2019 Share Posted March 8, 2019 If it's any help, the Midland mileposts were normally on the Up side of the line. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold 30851 Posted March 8, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2019 From looking at the diagrams the top one could be Carlton North Sidings looking North. The train would be on Up Slow. The companion picture matches the next box to the north - Royston Station looking south. Both on the Cudworth route. Cannot find any pictures of the box to confirm - maybe someone else will have more luck! Rob 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 8, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2019 8 hours ago, Enterprisingwestern said: The LNWR had quite a few signalboxes of that design, Mostyn for example, could the photograph be a joint MR/LNWR line, somewhere around the Liverpool area maybe? Mike. Mike - It's a Midland box with an extension piece, probably for observing shunting moves. The look of the houses fits in with those in the Cudworth area as suggested 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 9, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 9, 2019 10 hours ago, 30851 said: From looking at the diagrams the top one could be Carlton North Sidings looking North. The train would be on Up Slow. The companion picture matches the next box to the north - Royston Station looking south. Both on the Cudworth route. Cannot find any pictures of the box to confirm - maybe someone else will have more luck! Rob I'e found a photo in Railway Memories No.8 (page 26) which confirms the location as Carlton North Sidings as Rob says 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastwestdivide Posted March 9, 2019 Share Posted March 9, 2019 (edited) Google streetview showing the houses in both photos: https://goo.gl/maps/ZQRenADVtjm I can't find any photos of the box either. Pretty sure the box is in the background here (google books link to Rails through Barnsley: A Photographic History, by Alan Whitehouse - p20 lower) Edited March 9, 2019 by eastwestdivide another photo 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold beast66606 Posted March 11, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 11, 2019 Looks like our help in identifying the location isn't appreciated ... I've watched the OP come and go several times and no comment. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail-Online Posted March 12, 2019 Author Share Posted March 12, 2019 Brilliant! Thanks guys Cheers Tony Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rail-Online Posted March 12, 2019 Author Share Posted March 12, 2019 On 11/03/2019 at 16:22, beast66606 said: Looks like our help in identifying the location isn't appreciated ... I've watched the OP come and go several times and no comment. That is wierd, I wrote a thanks note but for some reason it did not 'go live' and appear. Just 'released' it now, I suppose I am just getting used to the new system............. Yes it really is appreciated and I did add a thanks note on my other site Cheers Tony 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 It is Carlton North Sidings Box. I have 4 booking on books 3 from 1962 and 1 from 1966. It is in its rebuilt form and had a German signal frame in. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 21, 2020 1 hour ago, enginelane said: It is in its rebuilt form and had a German signal frame in. That requires a little more explanation! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovenor Posted July 21, 2020 Share Posted July 21, 2020 On 08/03/2019 at 23:43, beast66606 said: Mike - It's a Midland box with an extension piece, probably for observing shunting moves. The look of the houses fits in with those in the Cudworth area as suggested I think that is a Midland box with a narrow base rather than an extension, there were quite a lot similar. 6 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: That requires a little more explanation! The Midland/LMS did install some double wire operated points and these used a frame with turnover levers, ie the levers rotate through 180 degrees. The frames were homemade, not imported from Germany but followed a design concept pretty well standard for mechanical signalling in Germany. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 21, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 21, 2020 1 minute ago, Grovenor said: The Midland/LMS did install some double wire operated points and these used a frame with turnover levers, ie the levers rotate through 180 degrees. The frames were homemade, not imported from Germany but followed a design concept pretty well standard for mechanical signalling in Germany. Aha. I had come across pictures of Midland boxes with such frames but did not know their origin. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 Yes I did have at one time an article that the NRM archive section sourced -it was in German so kind of stopped then 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted July 24, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 24, 2020 On 21/07/2020 at 22:08, Compound2632 said: Aha. I had come across pictures of Midland boxes with such frames but did not know their origin. They didn't all come from Germany - one on the GWR was manufactured by Westinghouse and was tappet interlocked, using standard GWR locking, with the ordinary lever frame it stood at the end of. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 24, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 24, 2020 47 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said: They didn't all come from Germany - one on the GWR was manufactured by Westinghouse and was tappet interlocked, using standard GWR locking, with the ordinary lever frame it stood at the end of. I think @enginelane meant it was German in concept, not by manufacture. The whole topic of Midland signalling equipment (as distinct from signal boxes) seems to be crying out for more research. It seem clear that the Midland was manufacturing quite a bit of equipment for itself but I wouldn't be surprised if less exclusively so than, say, the LNWR. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grovenor Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 (edited) The Midland built their own boxes and built their wn frames which were developed into the standard LMS frame. Very little was bought in. Crewe was still building Midland style LMS frames into the 60s.If not later. And when I was there still had a section of double wire frame available in the shop in case of urgent need. Edited July 24, 2020 by Grovenor 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 24, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 24, 2020 1 hour ago, Grovenor said: The Midland built their own boxes and built their wn frames which were developed into the standard LMS frame. Very little was bought in. Crewe was still building Midland style LMS frames into the 60s.If not later. And when I was there still had a section of double wire frame available in the shop in case of urgent need. The definitive book on Midland signalling has yet to be written, allegedly for lack of anyone with both the time and knowledge to take on the task... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold chris p bacon Posted July 24, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 24, 2020 Sandy had a set of wire operated points (1920's) The gear for them is now in the NRM as I understand they were the longest (distance) wire operated in the country. A couple of signal men said that if it didn't work first time you would have to have the points checked due to stretching of the wire. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted July 25, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 25, 2020 The LMS also had a double wire frame at Rowsley at one time. This was stated by one source to be the earliest LMS attempt at such a frame and didn't have any interlocking! Photo here - http://dominic-beglin.magix.net/website/before_closure_1.10.html#BEFORE CLOSURE 1 You'll find more about LMS double wire frames etc here - http://www.derby-signalling.org.uk/CottageLane.htm And here (hopefully) is something a bit more up-to-date - http://dominic-beglin.magix.net/website/#LATEST PROJECTS NEWS Double wire in Aus - http://www.vrhistory.com/Articles/DoubleWire/DoubleWire.htm I can't find any photos of the 1935 GWR installation at Johnston but it, unusually, had a Westinghouse A2 frame with, oroiginally 6 working double wire levers (later increased to 8. leaving one spare) within the length of the normal style frame and fully interlocked with it. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 On 24/07/2020 at 16:21, Compound2632 said: I think @enginelane meant it was German in concept, not by manufacture. The whole topic of Midland signalling equipment (as distinct from signal boxes) seems to be crying out for more research. It seem clear that the Midland was manufacturing quite a bit of equipment for itself but I wouldn't be surprised if less exclusively so than, say, the LNWR. i had another look for the article but it’s gone. If I remember it was from a technical paper and no idea what it said! Never found out what happened to the first box Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now