Fitting Kadee coupling to Bachmann Class 04

[Tony Davis]

I am going to fit kadee couplings to my british outline rolling stock and have worked out how to do that. I have hit a snag though with the Bachmann 04 shunter as there is precious little room to mount the kadee box (please see photo). 

 

Has anybody any experience with fitting a kadee in this sort of limited space?

 

Thanks

[shortliner]

Without having one actually in front of me, I can only offer the following - is it possible to remove some of the lower plate with" Bachmann" on it and possibly some of the material behind the coupling so that the  kadee box will mount using the screw that holds the coupling currently The front of the box may well protrude forward into the space between the buffers - it will also depend on whether you are trying to fit a Kadee NEM coupling or something like a  #5 - experimentation might be required

 

 

[melmerby]

You might be able to mount a #17 or #18 (NEM mount coupling by drilling through it's shaft and using the original screw.

I have done this on a number of locos/wagons (but unfortunately not an 04)

[Tony Davis]

Thanks for the suggestions. I reluctant to start carving stuff away, and I did wonder if I could buy an NEM pocket, but I also thought that might cause the coupling to stick out too far. 

 

I think I will try drilling out the #17, as I have a spare one.

 

 

[BR60103]

I like to drill a hole in the recess in the Kadee NEM mounting plate, then trim off the tails.

 

 

[Butler Henderson]

20 hours ago, Tony Davis said:

I think I will try drilling out the #17, as I have a spare one.

Would think that will be too short - measure the distance of the centre of the coupling fixing screw to a line across the face of the buffers and you need a NEM Kadee whose shank (the bit between the coupling itself and the NEM prongs) is at least a bit longer.

Edited March 17, 2019 by Butler Henderson

[Dunsignalling]

I fitted Kadees to one of the old Bachmann 03s (same chassis block as the current 04) some years ago and I have an 04 on the "to do" list though it's nowhere near the top. IIRC, it was very fiddly and time-consuming, involving mods to both body and chassis.

 

It's therefore probably not a good subject for anyone new to installing Kadees. Upon inspecting the loco, I also notice that it has a type of Kadee (#7) that is no longer produced, so I can't directly recommend which current type might be best. Closest to what I used is probably a #37 but, as I say, some alteration to both body and chassis was needed and success will hinge on ones bodging ability. 

 

The short answer is that whatever type one picks, it is almost certainly not "doable" without some carving about of the model.

 

John

Edited March 17, 2019 by Dunsignalling

[Tony Davis]

Maybe I'll leave it for a while then, I have an 08 already fitted so that will do for shunting duties.

 

Thanks for all the input,

 

Tony

[melmerby]

4 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

I fitted Kadees to one of the old Bachmann 03s (same chassis block as the current 04) some years ago and I have an 04 on the "to do" list though it's nowhere near the top. IIRC, it was very fiddly and time-consuming, involving mods to both body and chassis.

 

It's therefore probably not a good subject for anyone new to installing Kadees. Upon inspecting the loco, I also notice that it has a type of Kadee (#7) that is no longer produced, so I can't directly recommend which current type might be best. Closest to what I used is probably a #37 but, as I say, some alteration to both body and chassis was needed and success will hinge on ones bodging ability. 

 

The short answer is that whatever type one picks, it is almost certainly not "doable" without some carving about of the model.

 

John

That's a drastic conclusion.

As has been suggested a NEM decoder #17 - #20 depending on length required can be fitted to most things using the hole and screw method, as I suggested and as David (BR 60103) illustrated with some photos as long as the original coupling isn't cranked.

[Butler Henderson]

1 hour ago, melmerby said:

As has been suggested a NEM decoder #17 - #20 depending on length required can be fitted to most things using the hole and screw method, as I suggested and as David (BR 60103) illustrated with some photos as long as the original coupling isn't cranked.

Can be modified to fit where the original coupling was cranked in the case of Bachmann models or the NEM mount height is wrong even though the supplied coupling is  not cranked (some Heljan models) - a NEM Kadee has a plastic shank and hence can easily be cut/drilled/added to as appropriate.

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, melmerby said:

That's a drastic conclusion.

As has been suggested a NEM decoder #17 - #20 depending on length required can be fitted to most things using the hole and screw method, as I suggested and as David (BR 60103) illustrated with some photos as long as the original coupling isn't cranked.

 

Possibly, I think my (mid-1990s) conversion possibly predated the introduction of the NEM Kadees anyway and was done to eradicate the cut-out in the buffer beams as well. Hasn't been touched since so it does work, though.

 

I'm not a lover of NEM mounts except where incorporated in CCUs - inconsistent alignment, prone to drooping and bulky.  I generally look for ways to replace them with "proper" Kadees (#146 etc.) unless it's too much like hard work.

 

John 

Edited March 17, 2019 by Dunsignalling

[melmerby]

36 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

 

 

 

I'm not a lover of NEM mounts except where incorporated in CCUs - inconsistent alignment, prone to drooping and bulky.  I generally look for ways to replace them with "proper" Kadees (#146 etc.) unless it's too much like hard work.

 

John 

I have found from experience that CCUs and Kadees do not go well together.

After equipping some of my coaching stock with (usually) #18s I experienced a lot of derailments, especially when coming from a curve to a straight. This seems to b a fairly common problem.

I now use a mixture of Roco & Hornby close couplers in a rake with just Kadees on the outer ends.

 

I have quite a lot of Early Bachmann (ex Mainline) wagons and they all get the #146 treatment apart from the bogie wagons where a screwed in #18 does the job

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, melmerby said:

I have found from experience that CCUs and Kadees do not go well together.

After equipping some of my coaching stock with (usually) #18s I experienced a lot of derailments, especially when coming from a curve to a straight. This seems to b a fairly common problem.

I now use a mixture of Roco & Hornby close couplers in a rake with just Kadees on the outer ends.

 

I have quite a lot of Early Bachmann (ex Mainline) wagons and they all get the #146 treatment apart from the bogie wagons where a screwed in #18 does the job

Been doing that for about ten years.....

[BR60103]

So far, I haven't found any screwed-on couplings that are cranked.

 

I do have an Emily where the screw is mounted slightly to the side in order to miss something or other.

 

[Dunsignalling]

11 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

 

Possibly, I think my (mid-1990s) conversion possibly predated the introduction of the NEM Kadees anyway and was done to eradicate the cut-out in the buffer beams as well. Hasn't been touched since so it does work, though.

 

John 

I've just come across a note that I did a Bachmann 04 for a pal some years back - just lists "Modified #20" with no other remarks.

 

As I don't actually remember doing it, there couldn't have been any problems, so presumably just drilled and mounted using the existing screws as others have suggested.

 

John

[melmerby]

7 hours ago, BR60103 said:

So far, I haven't found any screwed-on couplings that are cranked.

 

 

Never say never!

I've never seen any either but........

Anything goes with Bachmann as regards couplings.

 

NEM pockets at the wrong height (at least two differing wrong heights) as well as more or less correct ones.

Different approaches to replacing large T/Ls on older models. The replacements consist of: some moulded on, some screwed (two sizes), some in pockets (see above) etc.

 

Edited March 18, 2019 by melmerby

[ISW]

On 17/03/2019 at 15:43, melmerby said:

That's a drastic conclusion.

As has been suggested a NEM decoder #17 - #20 depending on length required can be fitted to most things using the hole and screw method, as I suggested and as David (BR 60103) illustrated with some photos as long as the original coupling isn't cranked.

Gents,

 

Having just bought a (secondhand ) Mainline Class 03, I was reading the above with interest. I took the majority opinion into account and duly modified it with Kadee #17 couplers. As suggested, it is a reasonably easy installation involving no cutting of the Class 03 (although it appears that there is scope to cut some plastic away to make a little more room - but why bother? ).

 

The Kadee #17 was modified as below:

 

Only 1 leg needed to be cut as the other one fits into the space formerly occupied by the extension on the tension lock coupler.

 

Installed it looks like this. The original screws were reused:

 

To verify the height I checked it against a Kadee coupler guide, and this confirmed the height to be correct :

 

However, on the other end the coupler is slightly too low . I think this can be easily fixed with a little filing of the topside of the coupler body. I'm not doing that yet as I will have to take the body off again to install a DCC chip. Now that will be another story ... 

 

 

[Signaller69]

As with Ian's post above, I use short Kadee no.17s on my 04s, but used a round needle file to introduce a round hole in the tail, but the end result is much the same (I had no problems with different heights front and rear though). The flat mounting plate on stock fitted with screw on tension lock couplings is usually spot on height wise for mounting Kadees in this manner.

 

I will fit a blanking plate to fill in the cut out in the bufferbeam in due course.

 

Edited June 3, 2019 by Signaller69
Add to info.

[brian777999]

I did not have any problem either. I fitted a #20 to both ends which were the same height. Looks so much better. It is a pity the loco is a typical class 03 and runs badly even after disconnecting the fly cranks !