Calling exhibition mangers! What layout types do you want?

[muddy water]

Just been to Ally Pally and seen a nice selection of layouts. Some have been on the circuit for a number of years. It was also mentioned that they had all been seen up north as well.

So my question is what do exhibition managers want for the next generation of layouts? 

We have had GWR BLTs, countless companies TMDs, boxfiles and now cakeboxes!

 

[Enterprisingwestern]

 

A pre grouping modern image roundy round branch line terminus with out of the box stock detailed and weathered .

 

Mike.

[ELTEL]

Spot on....

[Gilbert]

33 minutes ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

A pre grouping modern image roundy round branch line terminus with out of the box stock detailed and weathered .

 

Mike.

 

with radio control....

[Gilbert]

38 minutes ago, muddy water said:

Just been to Ally Pally and seen a nice selection of layouts. Some have been on the circuit for a number of years. It was also mentioned that they had all been seen up north as well.

So my question is what do exhibition managers want for the next generation of layouts? 

We have had GWR BLTs, countless companies TMDs, boxfiles and now cakeboxes!

 

But seriously its a good question...I've recently been to Doncaster and AP and its starting to feel very samey - not a comment on the quality but I'd seen most layouts before...

[David Bigcheeseplant]

I like to see good modelling nicely presented. A few pet hates of mine: roundy roundys with the track parallel to the front of the baseboard, backscenes that are only a few inches tall with a dark blue sky and white splodges as clouds, busses on bridges! 

 

Maybe I am a bit tongue in check but well modelled, runs well and presented nicely it does not matter if it is pre grouping or current scene, 2mm or gauge 1.

 

David

[JDW]

I know what you mean, "very samey" is often the case.  For me, I'd say more realistic modern image layouts (or rather, D&E era layouts), as I often find myself walking past many no doubt good but to me uninteresting steam era BLTs.  Of course others will see what I see as "steam layouts" as GWR layouts, pre-grouping layouts, etc and say there's not enough of each of those sub-categories.  I do wonder, though, if having things like web forums, on which many of the well known layouts have a presence, makes it a bit less exciting to go and see them when we've seen all the stock, know what's coming, and the fiddle yard no longer holds the same mystique of "what else unusual is there".  Especially when "unusual" on modern layouts often just means more yellow test trains, which themselves get a bit samey after a while. 

 

Overall, though, the quality of layouts always seems high, and most of them always have a crowd around, so something must be right, and we have to be thankful to those who give up their time to take their layouts to entertain us with.  

 

As David says, well presented layouts always have the edge too, framing the modelling and helping to control the scene the viewer sees.  

 

...

...

I'd better not say "but please, no more diesel depots full of awful "noise" - probably the one thing guaranteed not to make me linger at any layout!

[298]

1 hour ago, Enterprisingwestern said:

 

A pre grouping modern image roundy round branch line terminus with out of the box stock detailed and weathered .

 

Mike.

 

 CHEAP...!

 

...which won't necessarily mean small, but something that has to be accepted is nobody seems to be getting any younger, and the days of clubs providing large layouts that already require a van means that you can't afford a large team to support it to share the burden. Venues also seem to be watching the clock regarding hall hire times, so layouts have less time to be packed away. I used to help with a large layout before the pressures of modern life gave me less leisure time, and we'd be on the road 90 minutes after the show finished, whilst others of a similar size were still packing stock away.

 

 

20 minutes ago, David Bigcheeseplant said:

I like to see good modelling nicely presented. A few pet hates of mine: roundy roundys with the track parallel to the front of the baseboard, backscenes that are only a few inches tall with a dark blue sky and white splodges as clouds,

 

David

 

And with the space above occupied by elbows..... 

Edited March 25, 2019 by 298

[Andymsa]

48 minutes ago, JDW said:

 

 

...

...

I'd better not say "but please, no more diesel depots full of awful "noise" - probably the one thing guaranteed not to make me linger at any layout!

 

Not only diesel but steam as well. There was one layout with steam that was totally over the top, but in contrast can't remember the name of the layout but had dmu running up and down showed how sound should be done. Well done to that layout.

 

there did seem to be an unbalance to the types of layouts at AP. Although those that were there were good I like to see more modern image 

Edited March 25, 2019 by Andymsa

[RedgateModels]

Layouts with their own transport..... 

[Steamport Southport]

Is that what the Three Kings went to visit? 

 

 

 

Jason

[Jol Wilkinson]

1 hour ago, RedgateModels said:

Layouts with their own transport..... 

That's me out, then. Buying a SWB Transit for a couple of outings a year is outside my budget.

[RedgateModels]

1 minute ago, Jol Wilkinson said:

That's me out, then. Buying a SWB Transit for a couple of outings a year is outside my budget.

 

That's fair enough. We are a charity show and every penny spent comes off the final donation figure. We can run to one van hire per year which is normally used for the big main layout.

[spikey]

Dunno about managers, but as a potential punter I'd like to see ...

 

Layouts on which at least one train is usually running, preferably at something like scale speed.

 

Layouts on which The Hand Of God is not needed to get locomotives over points.

 

Layouts of which the operators are not too busy chatting to each other or eating to run trains.

 

A mix of eras and scales.

 

And a fair few trade stands.

 

That's all I ask

Edited March 26, 2019 by spikey

[Joseph_Pestell]

17 hours ago, muddy water said:

Just been to Ally Pally and seen a nice selection of layouts. Some have been on the circuit for a number of years. It was also mentioned that they had all been seen up north as well.

So my question is what do exhibition managers want for the next generation of layouts? 

We have had GWR BLTs, countless companies TMDs, boxfiles and now cakeboxes!

 

 

Well, it depends on what type of exhibition. Some exhibitions are for a wider audience, some more specialist.

 

But when looking for layouts for the wider audience, I used to try for a variety of layouts that would show the public as many aspects of the hobby as possible.

Roundy-roundies and BLTs, UK, US, European, Standard & Narrow Gauge, all popular scales, rural and urban. With a bit of thought, one can get all these variables covered with about 20 layouts. Much more than 20 layouts is counterproductive. Costs are increased but the visitors don't really get any more out of it.

 

And while I want all the layouts to be of a decent exhibition quality, it is important to have some layouts that are of a standard that the average visitor feels could be within their abilities. We don't want to discourage them from getting started.

 

Edit: I forgot to mention eras and mix of pre-nationalisation companies.

Of course, the available venue may be a limitation. Some simply can not accommodate a large O gauge layout.

Edited March 26, 2019 by Joseph_Pestell
Omission

[TheQ]

I'm not a show manager But know our show committee tries to get a range of layouts, in size and style. We, like someone mentioned before, tend to have only only one large imported layout at each show. As the costs get too high. Being out near the coast of Norfolk 2/3rds of our nearby area is sea, so layout recruitment is restricted, think yourself lucky if you live in the middle of the country.

 

We try to have:

 One or two large layouts,

A childrens play-with layout,

One or two Finescale layouts,

A couple of single board layouts,

And the rest somewhere between,

The layouts should also cover a variety of scales..

 One or two different club / club members layouts each year, it is our club show!!

 

 We do like the layout to leave in a reasonable time, however we don't like layouts that "obviously" rundown an hour before show closure, Especially we don't like layouts stopping running before Show closure.

 

The club members help layouts and traders in and out of the hall. Bearing in mind we have to clear the hall before the show of stage and chairs, mark out the position of every layout with masking tape, then layout the power cables. After the show, clean the floors, reset up a stage and about 100 individual seats in a specified pattern ready for church services in the morning. (Hand of God has a different meaning there!!)

 

I must admit I've spent some time looking at layouts arriving and leaving shows.

From one that needed 6 people to lift each board in and out  from a large van.

To someone who rolled in a hour before the show with two boards standing vertically in the trolley, after a couple of pulls and pushes lit hinged out and pushed together in minutes.. 

 

So my own, when finished, will roll off a trailer on 3 "carriages" roll into the hall, be linked up, feet dropped and adjusted, prescenium arch installed, stock put on and then should be ready to go. (with blue curtains at the back to hide operators and mugs of coffee from the public above the backscene). Just heads should poke over the top..

 

This has just given me another Idea about my layout assembly, sketches must be drawn, bye for now..

Edited March 26, 2019 by TheQ

[Andymsa]

1 hour ago, Joseph_Pestell said:

And while I want all the layouts to be of a decent exhibition quality, it is important to have some layouts that are of a standard that the average visitor feels could be within their abilities. We don't want to discourage them from getting started.

 

 

 

This is something I never thought about and is a good point.

[deltic9014]

As a young modeller on a (very) limited budget, I would love to see more low budget layouts. I enjoy watching finescale layouts with accurate trains running on them but when you realise that many of these layouts (not all of them big ones) are running £1000+ of rolling stock it doesn't make it seem like something achievable. Low budget modelling with older models doesn't have to look toylike - show us what you talented modellers can do with not much outlay.

[johnb]

6 hours ago, Andymsa said:

 

This is something I never thought about and is a good point.

 

It is more important than many think.  I have personal experience of holding club open days and people saying, "Oh I won't join I could never model like that. You'd never accept me."

 

All abilities need to be considered.

 

John

[RedgateModels]

On 26/03/2019 at 11:03, deltic9014 said:

As a young modeller on a (very) limited budget, I would love to see more low budget layouts. I enjoy watching finescale layouts with accurate trains running on them but when you realise that many of these layouts (not all of them big ones) are running £1000+ of rolling stock it doesn't make it seem like something achievable. Low budget modelling with older models doesn't have to look toylike - show us what you talented modellers can do with not much outlay.

 

Well we do have George's layout at Mansfield 🙂

 

 

As seen also in April's BRM "Inbox"

Edited July 29, 2022 by RedgateModels

[woodenhead]

I don't understand why DEMU has no steam layouts or Scalefour North has no N gauge layouts attending.

[woodenhead]

5 hours ago, deltic9014 said:

As a young modeller on a (very) limited budget, I would love to see more low budget layouts. I enjoy watching finescale layouts with accurate trains running on them but when you realise that many of these layouts (not all of them big ones) are running £1000+ of rolling stock it doesn't make it seem like something achievable. Low budget modelling with older models doesn't have to look toylike - show us what you talented modellers can do with not much outlay.

I am quite pleased to see more of the old Triang and HornbyDublo layouts appearing at shows, this takes us back to where a lot of people began with trains.

 

So why not something similar using Hornby or Peco set track and out of the box standard Hornby/Lima/Bachmann stock - more pertinent to people born a little bit later - I began with Mainline Railways - the J72 and a Peak.

[peach james]

18 hours ago, RedgateModels said:

Layouts with their own transport..... 

 

That's me out, then. Buying a SWB Transit for a couple of outings a year is outside my budget.

 

That's fair enough. We are a charity show and every penny spent comes off the final donation figure. We can run to one van hire per year which is normally used for the big main layout.

 

(Cut and pasted to get both sides of this in)

 

OK, so buying a Transit for a couple of shows/year is out.  And I understand for some it clearly is. 

 

While picking a transit van as your 2nd vehicle may not be the most economic choice, if it is a 2nd vehicle, then I don't see it as being quite as crazy as some make it out to be.  If you do 4 shows/year, that's 8 to 12 days away from home per year.  Away from work.  So, you are into the scene for 1/2 month salary/year already, as a minimum.  If all my van did was be transport for a club layout, that would still be _only_ about 1/4th the price of what I am already spending to take the layout to 2-3 shows/year.  My reality is much higher, with about 10 shows/year on average...  and all of a sudden, owning a full sized NA van to transport layouts makes total rational sense...  it's not a cube van, but rather a passenger van, but still.    I suspect I am far from the only one on the forum whose choice of 2nd vehicle on the driveway was in part directed by what is needed for ones hobby interests (and one's spouse's interests...I had to be able to move a horse box) .

 

If the layout is a club of you (even if an informal club) then figuring out transport early on is important, because the how the layout gets to/from the show clearly will directly affect the show(s) which the layout can travel to.  

 

Perhaps it is because I am still young(ish) at 42, and with lots of experience doing this (since I was 9-10 or so), large layouts are still in my manageable pile.  (large in my case being up to about 240 sq ft of display area- the one for BrickCan will be 288 sq ft of surface, limited by the organizers, not by what I can bring, or reasonably setup over 2 days & take apart in an evening...).    My original version of Long Marton was 8x24, the present club layout is 2x16, and the Lego is up to 240+ sq ft of surface.  The previous club layout was 12x24...and was JUST possible to get into the van with a 2nd row of seats, though the only time it traveled like that was for a show that is 4000 km from here.

 

(of course, sanity would suggest that I not attend 10 shows/year...but that would be no fun !)

 

James

[CloggyDog]

I've run shows for 3 separate and rather different organisations (DEMU, the German Railway Society and my local Maidenhead club) with quite differing requirements. A good exhibition manager needs to look beyond their own preferences/specialisms (be it scale/gauge, era, prototype, etc) to get a good balance of visiting layouts.

 

DEMU was relatively easy - a selection of D&E (nee Modern Image) covering across the scales, eras* and prototype

 

GRS is similar, but non-UK layouts, wider variety of scales, eras, prototypes, continents... Though I do like to have a 'token' UK layout in the mix!

 

And the local club show was perhaps the easiest, covering as wide a scale selection as possible, and across the eras, with at least 1 non-UK layout and at least 1 D&E layout. Ideally I'd find a couple of each of the latter and if they tick a 'scale' box, so much the better. A good variety of layout styles is also good - end-to-ends, roundy-roundy, beginner or 'average' modeller modelling right up to finescale. There are plenty of layouts out there, its just a case of balancing the space, budget and availability!

 

I also think that 'approachability' of the layout crew can be important - people who can happily  interact with visitors, share ideas, techniques, tips, info and encouragement.

 

*yes, even back 15 years ago there were multiple 'eras' within D&E/MI covering the early transition late-50/60s, end of steam, corporate blue, sectorisation and privatisation - there were a few moans if I didn't get the balance right and booked either too many or too few EWS-era layouts!

[CloggyDog]

14 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

I don't understand why DEMU has no steam layouts or Scalefour North has no N gauge layouts attending.

 

I think I'm right in saying that there has been at least 1 steam loco legitimately running on a layout at every DEMU showcase.