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Hull & Barnsley Railway - Layout Potential?

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I've been intrigued by the humble Hull & Barnsley Railway for a while now, and I wondered if this held any potential for a layout. As the H&BR had running powers over the Midland to Sheffield, this could put an interesting spin on an otherwise orthodox Midland layout. Maybe a "might-have-been" concept where the H&BR got running powers to Manchester over the GCR?

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The Hull & Barnsley also had running powers over sections of the Lancashire & Yorkshire via Methley Junction - regular excursion trains were run to Leeds Wellington. Hull & Barnsley football (rugby league) specials also ran to L&Y stations throughout the West Riding, also excursions to Aintree for the Grand National, if I recall correctly. So there's scope for a layout not necessarily on H&B territory but featuring H&B trains alongside L&Y and Midland, with the possibility of the North Eastern thrown in for good measure.

 

To prove the point, here's a H&B 2-4-0 sandwiched between a Midland and a L&Y carriage, at Leeds I believe:

 

image.png.c52c4d48353708f111d8f196538e998e.png

 

Taken from this thread.

 

There was discussion of these through workings in the Journal of the Midland Railway Society a couple of years ago.

 

Edited by Compound2632
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It will be a labour of love though, with virtually nothing available in the market except perhaps the Hornby van in 00.  Even that needs quite a bit of work - ventilators, brake gear and of course a re-paint and no commercial transfers.

 

But potential a-plenty if you have the skills to overcome that disadvantage.

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1 hour ago, Andy Hayter said:

 

But potential a-plenty if you have the skills to overcome that disadvantage.

Or the desire and determination to acquire the skills.

Since other than a basic van body, there appears to be nothing available, such an oddball subject would suit an oddball scale, such as S. 

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Correction: the junction of the Hull & Barnsley and Lancashire & Yorkshire was at Hensall - Methley was the junction of the latter with the Midland.

 

The MS&L is one railway I don't think the H&B would have had anything to do with. The H&B was largely the creation of James Staats Forbes, chairman of the LC&D - hence William Kirtley's involvement in specifying the locomotives and rolling stock for the opening of the H&B. Forbes was the great rival of Sir Edward Watkin, chairman of the South Eastern as well as of the MS&L. Once their rivalry had gone to the grave, the MS&L-turned-Great Central was very much interested in developing its own East Coast port at Immingham, so probably wasn't too keen on encouraging the Hull line. 

 

The irony of Kirtley's involvement with the H&B is that once the company turned to the question of appointing a full-time locomotive superintendent, they picked Matthew Stirling, nephew of the SER's locomotive superintendent (as well as son of Patrick, of course).

Edited by Compound2632
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1 hour ago, Regularity said:

Or the desire and determination to acquire the skills.

Since other than a basic van body, there appears to be nothing available, such an oddball subject would suit an oddball scale, such as S. 

 

In 4 mm/ft scale, there's a whitemetal kit for Kirtley's design of van, along with a few wagon components, from 51L. I've been part-way through building one for some time:

 

922465159_HBWRJRDCoD13basicassembled.JPG.758824e104435ce211e1fc29f9c57348.JPG

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The MSLR did try to build a tunnel under the Humber as a joint venture with the North Eastern. The NE pulled out. After that Hull and Grimsby competed, then Hull and Immingham. If you want H&B/ GC joint the best bet would be one of the odd corners of the GC around Yorkshire with a H&B spur. But then the H&B was I believe fiercely independent until 1922?

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There was a H&B and GC joint line, which, with a further bit that was also joint with the Midland, formed a N-S link from the H&B main line to the GC Sheffield-Retford line. Opened in 1916 and running via the outskirts of Doncaster, this tapped into an area that was hoped to become a major new coalfield - though this did not happen during the line's lifetime. It had several white elephants - five passenger stations that never saw a passenger train and a bascule bridge that never opened to canal traffic.

Edited by Compound2632
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2 minutes ago, corneliuslundie said:

 

Also, second hand: M.A. Barker, An Illustrated History of Hull & Barnsley Railway Locomotives (Challenger Publications, 1996); R. Prattley, chapters in North Eastern Record Vols. 1 & 2 (HMRS/NERA); and K. Hoole (ed), The Hull & Barnsley Railway (2 Vols., David & Charles, 1972).

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Pedant alert; The Hull & Barnsley Railway Volume 2 was published by Turntable Publications of Sheffield, after issues between David & Charles and the authors. I managed to obtain (finally) a copy last week, and it along with Volume 1 are most interesting - I too find the H&BR fascinating, perhaps due to its David status surrounded by Goliaths ? I would also recommend Railway Memories No 12; The Hull & Barnsley Railway (compiled by Stephen Chapman, Bellcode Books 1999).

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I've long liked the idea of a 'watching the trains go by' layout of Heck-Hensall Junc.

 

NER, L&Y and H&B!

 

DSCN8741.JPG.2d781f0e7dd2a116a6d29a4f6e39e1f7.JPG

Edited by Edwardian
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