PetersSpares Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 (edited) Dear RMweb readers, As well as our other wheels we are planning on making some more scale and traction tyre free Lima Diesel Replacement Wheelsets. We have been doing some work already but wondered if anyone has done any conversions with other makers wheels (we are hoping to have a much more cost effective alternative) and how they got around the lack of traction. (I know you can just shove loads of weight in it.) But I'm looking to find out anyones experience and what they pull. Thanks Peter, Peters Spares Model Railways Ltd Edited April 12, 2021 by PetersSpares wrong picture 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium CloggyDog Posted April 24, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 24, 2019 Back when the only (easy) way to do EM gauge diesels was to use the Ultrascale conversions, I used those to convert most of my Hornby and Lima fleet - Lima 20/26/31/37/40/47/50 and Hornby 25/58, plus DMUs from both. Personally, I found the Ringfield-motored locos much less affected in terms of tractive effort - possibly because I tended to opt for steel-tyred wheelsets and I used steel rail. The NS-tyred wheels did seem 'slippier' than the steel, but as I was only running shortish trains, not an issue. A solution I did see (and tried once) was to bodge a double-motored chassis (cut & shut 2 chassis together) which would certainly solve the problem! I did a double-motored Lima 47 which even today would give a Bachmann 47 a run for it's money! The Hornby diesels were much easier to double-motor, only requiring a cross-member to be cut away and a 2nd ringfield dropped in. The re-wheeled Lima 20 did have serious traction problems, though this was tracked down to the friction of the pick-ups on the trailing/unpowered wheels. I replaced the Lima stamped metal pick-ups with 0.45mm brass wire, much freer running and that solved the problem. 3 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Bob on reply from Cloggy Dog. Cheap and dirty test. Tell your potential customers to remove the traction tyres on their model prior to purchase, and assess for themselves what the effect on traction will be. Don't offer wheels for the class 20 for the reason given, you will only win bad press for your business. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted April 24, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 24, 2019 34 minutes ago, PetersSpares said: Dear RMweb readers, As well as our other wheels we are planning on making some more scale and traction tyre free Lima Diesel Replacement Wheelsets. We have been doing some work already but wondered if anyone has done any conversions with other makers wheels (we are hoping to have a much more cost effective alternative) and how they got around the lack of traction. (I know you can just shove loads of weight in it.) But I'm looking to find out anyones experience and what they pull. Thanks Peter, Peters Spares Model Railways Ltd This looks like a really useful product. What sizes will you be doing and what rail profile will they run on? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Sounds good. I am and always have been a Lima fan,with a bit of tweaking they can be made to run exceptionally well. However , if you are going to go with this project you might want to offer a axle puller tool ,lima wheels are extremely difficult to remove from there axles. I fitted some ultrascale wheels to a class 31,my fingers still hurt now several weeks after. As far as performance goes , noticed no difference in pulling power. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sb67 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 (edited) Sounds good, never replaced any but I've a few Lima loco's that could do with new wheels. Will you be doing the same with replacements for Hornby wheels? Steve. Edited April 24, 2019 by sb67 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 I've used Ultrascales......but have also turned down Lima. Your wheels look very 'shiny'..which may well affect the pulling power. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Barry O Posted April 24, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 24, 2019 By removing the Lima pick ups you can get impreskive pulling power with Ultrascale. How do I p reorder a set of wheels for a 40, 47 and a proper sized set for a Deltic please? Baz Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5Bel Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 Hi Peter, I will be following this topic closely. I have just rewheeled a Lima 73 using your replacement wagon wheels by bushing the lima bogies and adding extra pickups. There seems to be no loss in traction, I have reused the original weight. These wheels could be a real boon to modellers with Lima models that don't have the money to afford modern alternatives. I will post some pictures of my conversion at the weekend if they would of be any use. Could we have some on 2mm axles to upgrade Hornby models as well please. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave47549 Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 (edited) . Edited October 1, 2021 by Dave47549 Removed pointless guff Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wasdavetheroad Posted April 24, 2019 Share Posted April 24, 2019 I find bullfrog snot cures Lima diesel traction problems. My Class 20 pulls 20 coaches no problem. The single bogie diesels have good haulage power with snot over the traction tyres so it should work with replacement wheelsets 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium kevinlms Posted April 25, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted April 25, 2019 3 hours ago, Mersey507003 said: As far as I remember the class 20 was the only lima loco with a can motor connecting to the bogie via a drive shaft. Its a pity that kind of drive was not adapted for the 3 axle bogies instead of the pancake type motor and the 87s. Didn't Lima make some similar ones for the US market? I suspect they didn't continue that path, as they were going broke. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frobisher Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 7 hours ago, Mersey507003 said: As far as I remember the class 20 was thd only lima loco with a can motor connecting to the bogie via a drive shaft. The 67 also had a central can motor but driving both bogies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 22 hours ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said: Bob on reply from Cloggy Dog. Cheap and dirty test. Tell your potential customers to remove the traction tyres on their model prior to purchase, and assess for themselves what the effect on traction will be. Don't offer wheels for the class 20 for the reason given, you will only win bad press for your business. Thanks for that, we are not going to do the 20's. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 15 hours ago, wasdavetheroad said: I find bullfrog snot cures Lima diesel traction problems. My Class 20 pulls 20 coaches no problem. The single bogie diesels have good haulage power with snot over the traction tyres so it should work with replacement wheelsets H there, we are trying to not have tyres or snot so there are more pickups for DCC modellers. Thanks Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 16 hours ago, Dave47549 said: Unscrew & remove bogie frame Insert flat bladed screwdriver between wheel & motor bogie Twist screwdriver Job done! I'll be following this thread as I've got some DMU's that may be being treated to this product. We are doing the two standard sizes and selling all axles in singles so customers can buy however many they need for four or six axle locos. The Smaller wheel will be fore the DMU's Dummy coaches can use our lima wagon / coach wheel already produced. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 18 hours ago, 5Bel said: Hi Peter, I will be following this topic closely. I have just rewheeled a Lima 73 using your replacement wagon wheels by bushing the lima bogies and adding extra pickups. There seems to be no loss in traction, I have reused the original weight. These wheels could be a real boon to modellers with Lima models that don't have the money to afford modern alternatives. I will post some pictures of my conversion at the weekend if they would of be any use. Could we have some on 2mm axles to upgrade Hornby models as well please. We are doing the two standard sizes and selling all axles in singles so customers can buy however many they need for four or six axle locos. The Smaller wheel will be fore the Class 73. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 18 hours ago, Barry O said: By removing the Lima pick ups you can get impreskive pulling power with Ultrascale. How do I p reorder a set of wheels for a 40, 47 and a proper sized set for a Deltic please? Baz Hi there, thanks for the info. We are not taking pre orders as until they land here made we don't have costings as yet. Just keep an eye on here or view our website in the Lima spares and Peters Spares, Spares section and they will be listed once they arrive. We are doing both the original sizes so the Deltic will still have a small wheel. This is to not change the ride height of the locos. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 20 hours ago, sb67 said: Sounds good, never replaced any but I've a few Lima loco's that could do with new wheels. Will you be doing the same with replacements for Hornby wheels? Steve. Hi there, we will have to see how well they sell before paying out more tooling for Hornby but you never know! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PetersSpares Posted April 25, 2019 Author Share Posted April 25, 2019 22 hours ago, Joseph_Pestell said: This looks like a really useful product. What sizes will you be doing and what rail profile will they run on? Hi there, we are doing both Lima standard sizes and will run on 100 or 75 track. For now we are just doing OO and not EM. However you never know what could come next. Thanks Peter Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Geep7 Posted April 25, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 25, 2019 I've got a few Lima 73's and a similar amount of DMU's that need doing, so i'm in the market for some. The coach wheels you already do are fantastic. I've even used them to do the motor bogie on one of my DMU's. Will the axle diameter be the same size as the Lima originals? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Tomlinson Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 My experience of wheel changes has been using Ultrascales. Having a sizeable layout with gradients did cause a problem, and I adopted a plan of dual motoring as the only solution. I might say this has proved very effective indeed, and locos so treated will pull the house down! For those with smaller operations on the flat it is quite likely that one power bogie without traction tyres will be sufficient, as 34B-D says folk can do tests for themselves. The great benefit of your replacement wheels will be in appearance, as well as the electrical pick-up improvement which will help DC users like me as well as those on DCC. Given the relative cheapness of Hornby Ringfield and Lima power bogies, the wheels will be a very welcome enhancement for those of us who rather like older mouldings. John. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest teacupteacup Posted April 25, 2019 Share Posted April 25, 2019 1 hour ago, Mersey507003 said: Has there been any news on the prices of these wheels because aswell as the 73 which I would just do a complete rewheel on I have a 37 which will need all 6 axles doing and a set of gear cogs between the wheels and the cd/dvd motor when its fitted. Any information on these will be highly welcome. The OP stated earlier today that they havent done their costings yet Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray M Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 (edited) Looks like they all have differant inside faces ? IE not all smooth (For pick ups). Edited April 26, 2019 by Ray M Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete the Elaner Posted April 26, 2019 Share Posted April 26, 2019 There are also some models which could see new life as dummys for double heading. I have a few which fall into this category. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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