Lifting bridge

[SteveyDee68]

As a long discontinued kit, I wonder if there would be a market for a similar, non-working version cast in, say, resin? Or perhaps in card? Or laser-cut card, even?

 

Seems to me that there are lots of folks who like to build harbours - plus look at all the suitable motive power now available for dockside layouts!

 

Or would there be issues of copyright and/or intellectual property rights?

 

Steve S

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, SteveyDee68 said:

As a long discontinued kit, I wonder if there would be a market for a similar, non-working version cast in, say, resin? Or perhaps in card? Or laser-cut card, even?

 

Seems to me that there are lots of folks who like to build harbours - plus look at all the suitable motive power now available for dockside layouts!

 

Or would there be issues of copyright and/or intellectual property rights?

 

Steve S

As long as you don't copy the kit directly there should be no problem as it is based on a real thing.

[TheQ]

On ‎23‎/‎05‎/‎2019 at 09:36, Fat Controller said:

There is an electrified railway bridge at Trowse, Norfolk. Although it is a swing bridge, rather than a lifting one, the issue of maintaining the continuity of power supply still arises:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trowse_Bridge

There is a poster on RMWeb who can probably provide much more detail about the bridge, as it was part of his fiefdom before he retired.

Which spends most of each summer illegally blocking the river as they daren't open it as the track jams. Local rumour is that to save money  / disruption to the railways, they stopped putting in the summer shorter rails that that allow for heat expansion.

[SteveyDee68]

On 29/07/2019 at 11:47, melmerby said:

As long as you don't copy the kit directly there should be no problem as it is based on a real thing.

 

Hmmm - good to know! Wonder if I can persuade ModelRailwayScenery to produce a laser cut kit then?!

 

In the meantime, the "bit of bridge" that Paul let me have has been split apart so I can make a drawing of the bridge. The rest will be created 'by eye' using those dimensions as a guide plus the photos I have access to. It may well end up as a double track bridge ... that would make it different from the Pola kit, at least!  What I won't replicate is the baseplate connecting the two sides of the bridge.

 

Edited July 30, 2019 by SteveyDee68
Correcting typos

[melmerby]

Is that steel billet the counterbalance weight?

 

This might provide some more side pieces:

https://www.hattons.co.uk/40397/wills_kits_ss57_vari_girder_plate_girder_panels/stockdetail.aspx

[SteveyDee68]

5 hours ago, melmerby said:

Is that steel billet the counterbalance weight?

 

Hi Keith

 

Paul passed me the remains of the bridge in one piece. In order to start measuring the side pieces, I cut the top off the counterbalance box to discover the weight inside. It was - I think - part of the original kit, as there's is a moulding on the inside of the counterweight box that it sits inside, to hold it on place.  I won't need suchlike for my model, as I do not plan on making it work.

 

I appreciate your suggestion of the Wills girder kit; Paul had cut away the end of the lift bridge section to make a girder bridge for himself (if he had only known the eBay value, eh?). From what he's said, I don't think he ever had the rest of the bridge, and had picked up the lifting section at a swap meet in a bag of bits!

 

Given that I have the panels up to the centre point, and photos to be able to gauge what size and how many panels are missing, building the girder from scratch from card or styrene might be easier than modifying other items.  Certainly when I have completed the drawing, I will make it available here for anyone who might want to make use of it.  I may even post pictures of my own build, if I think my efforts are up to scrutiny!

 

Cheers

 

Steve

[SteveyDee68]

So, here's a mock up of the bridge side made by a combination of drawing around the original part and a bit of measuring together with counting the panels on pictures. Hopefully this looks about the right length.

 

Looking at the cross section, the centre panel (marked X on a couple on the mock up) is the centre of the beam, with a second overlay (shown shaded) to make the "flanges" and then a third overlay to create the vertical edges of each panel plus the top rail. This is repeated on the opposite side, except that the vertical dividers do not go all the way to the bottom - I assume they line up with the base of the bridge, allowing depth for the bridge deck.

 

I apologise for any incorrect terminology of the different parts - if anyone wants to correct me, I'm here to learn! Anyway, that's enough for now.  From this, I can quickly create a second cut out side, and use the existing weight container to calculate the width of the bridge. After that, it is back to studying the dozen photographs and packaging artwork images I have saved to put together the rest!

 

 

[SteveyDee68]

So, I couldn't stop! Having quickly measured the cross pieces on the tank, I determined this was the bridge deck too. Cut out card as necessary, replicated the side and used Deluxe Materials Rocket Card Glue to quickly assemble the mock up. There appears to be a cross girder in photos, so that was quickly added too. Couple of items of stock posed to get a feel of the general proportions...

 

Feels like a step forward!

 

 

[PatB]

On 20/05/2019 at 06:56, SteveyDee68 said:

... the Faller one needs a lot of modification (note the ultra modern screams "German" control cabin!). 

 

 

Might be able to do something with a cut'n'shut of the Peco Modern Signal box. That "Modernisation Plan" flat-roofed greenhouse would make a pretty good representation of all sorts of control cabin type structures for layouts set from the mid-50s onwards.

[Guest JiLo]

On 31/07/2019 at 02:29, SteveyDee68 said:

So, I couldn't stop! Having quickly measured the cross pieces on the tank, I determined this was the bridge deck too. Cut out card as necessary, replicated the side and used Deluxe Materials Rocket Card Glue to quickly assemble the mock up. There appears to be a cross girder in photos, so that was quickly added too. Couple of items of stock posed to get a feel of the general proportions...

 

Feels like a step forward!

 

 

I would buy one of these if it was on the market!  Been searching for the old Triang/Pola one for a very long time

[SteveyDee68]

On 01/08/2019 at 19:00, JiLo said:

I would buy one of these if it was on the market!  Been searching for the old Triang/Pola one for a very long time

 

Exactly why I ended up trying to replicate the bridge, JiLo, as I have been doing likewise!

 

Couple of days away from modelling (including watching the hilarious Book of Mormon as a birthday gift from a friend) and returning to the project have immediately thought to move the side struts so they intersect higher, to allow a strengthening girder beam to be slung between them and clear stock.

 

 

That may not be prototypical or even needed, but it is another step away from the Pola original!

 

Also, measuring along the arc of the curved section will tell me how long the sections upon which the bascule rolls need to be!

 

As a regular contributor to the Gnatterbox forum says in his signature, "hours of fun!"

 

Steve

Edited August 4, 2019 by SteveyDee68
Photo in more appropriate place in text

[SteveyDee68]

Well, a great day for bridge research! After someone mentioning Pegasus Bridge, I did a Google search and lots of photos later I tried the Google lens search thing... lo and behold, a bridge from New Jersey that looks almost exactly like the Pola kit, down to the circular pylons holding the bridge deck at the ends!

 

So, I can now claim that I am working from prototypes and not copying the Pola kit! LOL 

 

Very satisfying to discover there is a cross beam where I thought one should be, on the Pegasus Bridge. [smug face]

 

[Armchair Modeller]

These drawings on eBay may be of interest - though maybe not to buy! Scroll down to see all three drawings

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1905-3x-Antique-Engineering-Prints-Scherzer-Rolling-Lift-Bridge-Over-River-Swale-/181707634031

 

the Kingsferry Bridge to the Isle of Sheppey, replaced in the 1960s by the current structure

[melmerby]

3 hours ago, Armchair Modeller said:

These drawings on eBay may be of interest - though maybe not to buy! Scroll down to see all three drawings

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/1905-3x-Antique-Engineering-Prints-Scherzer-Rolling-Lift-Bridge-Over-River-Swale-/181707634031

 

the Kingsferry Bridge to the Isle of Sheppey, replaced in the 1960s by the current structure

Here is the real thing:

 

Old & new together:

[jonhall]

Google streetview gave me this pair in Dublin that are about the right size

 

https://goo.gl/maps/DpWzkUfkVxcP3fEG9

 

and another pair a bit further down the same road

 

https://goo.gl/maps/XsmsSMswDZHjXjFZ7

 

and this much bigger example in Birkenhead

 

https://goo.gl/maps/zYyFf3zTcGy37d3d9

 

Jon

[melmerby]

None of them look like they get much use these days.

[jonhall]

the second pair in Dublin have been wedged closed, but I doubt any of those are still usable.

 

Jon

[SteveyDee68]

On 05/08/2019 at 08:14, jonhall said:

Google streetview gave me this pair in Dublin that are about the right size

 

https://goo.gl/maps/DpWzkUfkVxcP3fEG9

 

and another pair a bit further down the same road

 

https://goo.gl/maps/XsmsSMswDZHjXjFZ7

 

and this much bigger example in Birkenhead

 

https://goo.gl/maps/zYyFf3zTcGy37d3d9

 

Jon

Hi Jon

Thanks - I also saved lots of photos of all of those bridges in my search for a "generic not POLA" design to work from. The Birkenhead version may inspire a double track version yet!

Steve

[SteveyDee68]

On 04/08/2019 at 23:20, melmerby said:

Here is the real thing:

 

Old & new together:

Thanks - wasn't aware of this one!

Steve

[melmerby]

In one of the heritage railway mags there is a description and photos of one of the Scherzer rolling Bascule bridges which although fully assembled and used by the railway (H&B?) to cross a canal  never had any lifting mechanism fitted!