RMweb Premium younGGuns7 Posted June 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 8, 2021 28 minutes ago, 61661 said: We are promised new samples soon. Unfortunately the factory handling this project has been badly affected by Coronavirus, not just with lockdowns but also with subsequent staff shortages. Apologies for the delay - we are extremely frustrated by the situation but there's very little we can do at the moment. Once we have the next set of samples we'll have a better idea of the timescales. Unfortunately you are not the only business effected, the situation globally for both raw materials and shipping will effect all our lives over the next few months/years. We just have to grin and bear it currently 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkersson Posted June 8, 2021 Share Posted June 8, 2021 4 hours ago, Crisis Rail said: So easy to say but we really have to stop relying on China. Yes it all boils down to business and corporate profit even in Toy Train Land. I would be prepared (and am) to pay extra for something UK produced. Just to mention nothing Sinophobic in any way including the events of the last 15 months. As regards the 45 - no real rush Ben. To get a model produced in the UK, to the specification expected these days, we would be paying close to 6 or 7 times what we are paying at the moment. Possibly more. I work for a company who produce (amongst many other things) cheap injection moulded toys for babies. All our tooling/moulding/assembly/packaging is done in China. When the reality of the pandemic took hold, we looked at getting the same toys tooled and moulded in the UK. For very basic 2/3 final-colour moulded toys we were looking at a minimum 3-fold increase in cost, so a £3 toy would then be selling for £9 minimum. That's before we added on costs for assembly and packaging, plus the cost of getting the packaging printed and assembled. These extra costs came from, in the main, the factories who would do the tooling and manufacturing (and costs remained the same as pre-pandemic). Another factor in the uplift of costs was transportation from said factories to our distribution centre. More expensive for a 250 mile journey in the UK than a 13,000 mile journey from China. If we were to bring manufacturing (back) in house, we would have to increase costs to cover factory space, machine costs for tooling/moulding (of multiple designs), purchase and transportation of raw materials (metals, plastics, solvents), source a packaging supplier and of course staffing costs. That £3 toy would be selling for £25 just to cover our costs. This example above is for one of our toys which has 8 parts (if I can remember there are 6 moulds), 4 of those the same and is extremely basic, with no painting or printing. These sell by the hundreds of thousands so I would hate to see the costs of a relatively low-volume UK produced item of stock with the variations and standard of printing which we demand these days. Of course I would love to see models made in the UK, however is its just not feasible now for larger/established manufacturers to bring production back from the far east. 4 8 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hal Nail Posted June 8, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 8, 2021 Just now, Monkersson said: Of course I would love to see models made in the UK, however is its just not feasible now for larger/established manufacturers to bring production back from the far east. There are now several people with their fingers in their ears chanting fake news 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkersson Posted June 8, 2021 Share Posted June 8, 2021 11 minutes ago, Hal Nail said: There are now several people with their fingers in their ears chanting fake news You are most probably correct, I would have been one of them before I was involved with costings in my company, and my eyes were well and truly opened!!! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdvle Posted June 8, 2021 Share Posted June 8, 2021 7 hours ago, Crisis Rail said: So easy to say but we really have to stop relying on China. Yes it all boils down to business and corporate profit even in Toy Train Land. I would be prepared (and am) to pay extra for something UK produced. Just to mention nothing Sinophobic in any way including the events of the last 15 months. As regards the 45 - no real rush Ben. Except it isn't really a China issue - lots of companies around the world are experiencing production issues, whether because demand has exceeded their ability to make product or because production volume has decreased due to Covid prevention measures. Example, look at the chip shortages causing troubles for so many like the auto industry, and the chips aren't made in China. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisis Rail Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 9 hours ago, Monkersson said: To get a model produced in the UK, to the specification expected these days, we would be paying close to 6 or 7 times what we are paying at the moment. Possibly more. I work for a company who produce (amongst many other things) cheap injection moulded toys for babies. All our tooling/moulding/assembly/packaging is done in China. When the reality of the pandemic took hold, we looked at getting the same toys tooled and moulded in the UK. For very basic 2/3 final-colour moulded toys we were looking at a minimum 3-fold increase in cost, so a £3 toy would then be selling for £9 minimum. That's before we added on costs for assembly and packaging, plus the cost of getting the packaging printed and assembled. These extra costs came from, in the main, the factories who would do the tooling and manufacturing (and costs remained the same as pre-pandemic). Another factor in the uplift of costs was transportation from said factories to our distribution centre. More expensive for a 250 mile journey in the UK than a 13,000 mile journey from China. If we were to bring manufacturing (back) in house, we would have to increase costs to cover factory space, machine costs for tooling/moulding (of multiple designs), purchase and transportation of raw materials (metals, plastics, solvents), source a packaging supplier and of course staffing costs. That £3 toy would be selling for £25 just to cover our costs. This example above is for one of our toys which has 8 parts (if I can remember there are 6 moulds), 4 of those the same and is extremely basic, with no painting or printing. These sell by the hundreds of thousands so I would hate to see the costs of a relatively low-volume UK produced item of stock with the variations and standard of printing which we demand these days. Of course I would love to see models made in the UK, however is its just not feasible now for larger/established manufacturers to bring production back from the far east. From an ethical point of view it’s not just China with all its tat. You said it with a “cheap plastic toys” point of view. Do we really need it? As for Primark and it’s questionable supply chain sources...... Maybe we are due a “reset”. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monkersson Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 1 hour ago, Crisis Rail said: From an ethical point of view it’s not just China with all its tat. You said it with a “cheap plastic toys” point of view. Do we really need it? As for Primark and it’s questionable supply chain sources...... Maybe we are due a “reset”. Its not just China, nor is it China's fault, and nor is it China's tat - a vast majority of the goods that China produce are commissioned by companies around the world. They are cheap plastic toys, which serve no real purpose to adults, but get the attention of babies, and those of us who have raised children would have used these toys. But it isn't just toys for babies we produce, we also make highly complex aids for those with severe learning difficulties, who's basic costs, made in China, are horrendous. Maybe we do need a reset, but if you view 'tat' for babies as superfluous, then model railways are far more of a luxury At the end of the day, its us consumers that demand low costs Back to the HJ 45 before my thread drift, Im looking forward to see how it turns out 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted June 9, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, Monkersson said: Its not just China, nor is it China's fault, and nor is it China's tat - a vast majority of the goods that China produce are commissioned by companies around the world. They are cheap plastic toys, which serve no real purpose to adults, but get the attention of babies, and those of us who have raised children would have used these toys. With everything we know about plastics and their effect on the environment, perhaps we really should be questioning the continued production of cheap "tat" that gets used for a very short period and then gets thrown away as it can't be recycled. We still need plastics in many areas, such as keeping items sterile, but the rest...? If prices went up a bit and the items were made to last longer, people might be more inclined to look after them and then hand then on when no longer needed. But more handing things down means less "made new", which is not really interesting to companies that need to make new sales to stay in business and keep people employed. Edited June 9, 2021 by brushman47544 autocorrect 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted June 9, 2021 Share Posted June 9, 2021 Are we saying that the 45 is cheap tat? 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crisis Rail Posted June 15, 2021 Share Posted June 15, 2021 On 09/06/2021 at 10:44, Michael Hodgson said: Are we saying that the 45 is cheap tat? All will be revealed....! Hopefully not as i've preordered - but tune in on here for the long awaited scything analytical dissertations. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdvle Posted June 15, 2021 Share Posted June 15, 2021 On 09/06/2021 at 04:02, brushman47544 said: With everything we know about plastics and their effect on the environment, perhaps we really should be questioning the continued production of cheap "tat" that gets used for a very short period and then gets thrown away as it can't be recycled. We still need plastics in many areas, such as keeping items sterile, but the rest...? Well, only plastic water bottles at the moment, but scientists have apparently found a way to convert plastic into artificial vanilla flavouring. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2021/06/15/scientists-convert-plastic-waste-into-vanilla-flavoring-using-bacteria/7705000002/ 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class 158 productions Posted June 16, 2021 Share Posted June 16, 2021 9 hours ago, mdvle said: Well, only plastic water bottles at the moment, but scientists have apparently found a way to convert plastic into artificial vanilla flavouring. https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2021/06/15/scientists-convert-plastic-waste-into-vanilla-flavoring-using-bacteria/7705000002/ How long before we have a range of ‘taste the difference model’s’ instead of superdetail ones? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PMP Posted June 16, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 16, 2021 8 hours ago, Class 158 productions said: How long before we have a range of ‘taste the difference model’s’ instead of superdetail ones? Plenty of window lickers around the hobby already, probably just a matter of time. 1 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
w124bob Posted June 18, 2021 Share Posted June 18, 2021 On 16/06/2021 at 10:02, Class 158 productions said: How long before we have a range of ‘taste the difference model’s’ instead of superdetail ones? Well Heljan already do the "ice cream van" 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzy Sulzer Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 On 03/05/2021 at 22:24, pheaton said: The timken axle box with its 4 studs The SKF box with its 5 small bolts. The SKF cover is a much much lighter construction, whereas the timken cover is a very heavy casting, also note the different shaped axle box on the SKF bearing. Those engraved instruction plates look nice ! Hopefully Heljan will replicate them ? As they did on the Hymeck in 00.in tampo form Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Suzy Sulzer Posted July 1, 2021 Share Posted July 1, 2021 Who remembers this, Peaks hauling MK 3s on a summer Saturday? Now there's a modelling challenge! 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveC46026 Posted August 5, 2021 Share Posted August 5, 2021 It's all gone very quiet on the Peak front! Can we expect any updates soon? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted August 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 7, 2021 On 05/08/2021 at 18:24, DaveC46026 said: It's all gone very quiet on the Peak front! Can we expect any updates soon? Update expected soon, see last paragraph. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveC46026 Posted August 7, 2021 Share Posted August 7, 2021 5 hours ago, stovepipe said: Update expected soon, see last paragraph. Hope to have news to me doesn't say update expected soon! Plus if your not following that thread you wouldn't know! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted August 7, 2021 RMweb Gold Share Posted August 7, 2021 Uhm, that’s why I referenced it here…. So no, you can’t expect an update soon. Better? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lincolnshiremodeller Posted August 13, 2021 Share Posted August 13, 2021 So there is no update then? All quiet on the Eastern front? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mdvle Posted August 14, 2021 Share Posted August 14, 2021 Based on experience, when a model train manufacturer says an update is hopefully soon (or shortly as Ben stated) I translate that into sometime in the next 4 to 8 weeks if it happens with a chance that it doesn't happen. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
61661 Posted August 16, 2021 Share Posted August 16, 2021 On 14/08/2021 at 00:19, lincolnshiremodeller said: So there is no update then? All quiet on the Eastern front? I've been promised an update from the factory 'shortly'. Unfortunately I can't quantify the exact timescale of that, but as soon as I have any new information or new samples we'll update everyone via www.Heljan.co.uk and our Facebook page. 7 3 2 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Class 158 productions Posted September 25, 2021 Share Posted September 25, 2021 Latest update from Heljan showing that pre production samples should be seen by late September. Very excited to see them. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Hilux5972 Posted September 27, 2021 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 27, 2021 On 26/09/2021 at 04:23, Class 158 productions said: Latest update from Heljan showing that pre production samples should be seen by late September. Very excited to see them. Well they have 3 days left then 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now