Tom F Posted July 5, 2019 Author Share Posted July 5, 2019 The NWR's resident Class 28 is now finished. BoCo has always been a favourite. 16 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin S-C Posted July 5, 2019 Share Posted July 5, 2019 I always like an early British diesel with scale couplings and all those nice dangly hoses on the ends. They add real character. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
south_tyne Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 9 hours ago, 9793 said: The NWR's resident Class 28 is now finished. BoCo has always been a favourite. Very smart! BoCo was always my favourite of the diesels. My brother on the otherhand prefered Bear! Similarly my overall favourites were Toby and Edward whereas he like James and Percy. Thinking about it, there might be somehing in the fact that the latter two were more cheeky and less well behaved than my favourites........ My 10-month old nephew has now been started on the stories of the Rev Awdry..... best to get them started on the right foot early! 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 6, 2019 Author Share Posted July 6, 2019 3 hours ago, south_tyne said: Very smart! BoCo was always my favourite of the diesels. My brother on the otherhand prefered Bear! Ah well, Bear is up next! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
south_tyne Posted July 6, 2019 Share Posted July 6, 2019 2 hours ago, 9793 said: Ah well, Bear is up next! Good, I'll tip wor kid* off so he can have a look! * Sorry, for those in the south (i.e. beyond Darlington) that translates as 'my brother' 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Tom F Posted July 7, 2019 Author Popular Post Share Posted July 7, 2019 5.10am this morning I left North Yorkshire, for the Welsh Coast and the Talyllyn Railway and arrived home an hour ago.....it was worth it though! A lovely day was had all round, and Lass even wanted to say hello to Wilbert Awdry in his study! The highlight has to be Luke @ExplosiveCookie diorama of Tidmouth! Thanks for letting me pose BoCo on there! Railway Series Gordon, Henry, James and Percy rest on Shed before another days work begins! Feel free to post further information on your shed build if you like. Finally, I was able to sort of recreate the cover of Gallant Old Engine with No 2. It was a lot of travelling to do in one day, but throughly enjoyable! Thanks Luke, and the Talyllyn Railway....it was great to be back! 21 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 17, 2019 Author Share Posted July 17, 2019 (edited) Lack of updates recently as I've worked on clients models. I have spent some time recently reading the book 'Railways of Carnforth', which has given me ideas on the loco workings onto Sodor from the North West. I was particularly taken with a couple oil trains depicted, which reminded me of the story 'Super Rescue'. D199 is heading East towards Barrow with a train of Oil Tankers. There is no indication by Awdry that Sodor had a refinery, so logic would suggest these are empty. After wondering about the interesting tanker liveries, I quickly discovered they are based on the Trix models, so I don't take them as being prototypically accurate. With this aside, I looked into what would be a logical working. There were a number of Oil trains passing through Carnforth, from Heysham, in particularly the Heysham-Glaxo (Ulverston) and the Heysham-Neville Hill (Leeds) workings, as can be seen below. The Heysham-Neville Hill working was usually double headed, and I can't help but think what an amazing sight like this would be with possibly Henry and BoCo/Bear piloting from Barrow through to Tidmouth, or perhaps with Henry/James and a BR Diesel. I'm no expert on the wagons of the late 1960's (usually my attention has been on those of the 1950s) but the tank wagons I presume are TTAs, which again would look rather interesting! Edited July 17, 2019 by 9793 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted July 17, 2019 Share Posted July 17, 2019 Hi Tom, Some of the early diagrams TTA tanks were vacuum braked with most of the later ones being air braked. The man to ask about wagons is Fat Controller for he is very knowledgeable. Gibbo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold john new Posted July 17, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 17, 2019 20 minutes ago, 9793 said: Lack of updates recently as I've worked on clients models. I have spent some time recently reading the book 'Railways of Carnforth', which has given me ideas on the loco workings onto Sodor from the North West. I was particularly taken with a couple oil trains depicted, which reminded me of the story 'Super Rescue'. D199 is heading East towards Barrow with a train of Oil Tankers. There is no indication by Awdry that Sodor had a refinery, so logic would suggest these are empty. After wondering about the interesting tanker liveries, I quickly discovered they are based on the Trix models, so I don't take them as being prototypically accurate. With this aside, I looked into what would be a logical working. There were a number of Oil trains passing through Carnforth, from Heysham, in particularly the Heysham-Glaxo (Ulverston) and the Heysham-Neville Hill (Leeds) workings, as can be seen below. The Heysham-Neville Hill working was usually double headed, and I can't help but think what an amazing sight like this would be with possibly Henry and BoCo/Bear piloting from Barrow through to Tidmouth, or perhaps with Henry/James and a BR Diesel. I'm no expert on the wagons of the late 1960's (usually my attention has been on those of the 1950s) but the tank wagons I presume are TTAs, which again would look rather interesting! What would be in those tanks? I ask as no barrier wagon behind the steam loco. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin S-C Posted July 17, 2019 Share Posted July 17, 2019 Only Class A tanks require a barrier wagon, these are probably Class B carrying more stable heavier oils. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 17, 2019 Author Share Posted July 17, 2019 3 hours ago, Gibbo675 said: Hi Tom, Some of the early diagrams TTA tanks were vacuum braked with most of the later ones being air braked. The man to ask about wagons is Fat Controller for he is very knowledgeable. Gibbo. I'd be very interested to hear @Fat Controller views on these. Granted I know this is fictional what I'm doing, but I want to try and keep it within the factual railways of the 1960s. My operating period is 1957-1969 as that covers Awdry's Books 12-24 which is the era that interests me. I appreciate the TTA's didn't appear until 1966ish, but visually they would look rather nice on a block train (which I think Awdry was depicting in Book 23s 'Super Rescue'). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted July 17, 2019 Share Posted July 17, 2019 3 hours ago, 9793 said: I'm no expert on the wagons of the late 1960's (usually my attention has been on those of the 1950s) but the tank wagons I presume are TTAs, which again would look rather interesting! 3 hours ago, Gibbo675 said: Some of the early diagrams TTA tanks were vacuum braked with most of the later ones being air braked. The man to ask about wagons is Fat Controller for he is very knowledgeable. TTA is a TOPS code which didn't even exist on BR when the first of the 45 ton 'monobloc' tanks were built in 1964, the A standing for air-braked. Early ones were vacuum braked so would only become TTAs if they were later updated with air brakes. There were two types of vaccum brakes; normal vacuum brakes would get a V as the third letter under TOPS, those with the more advanced Accelerated Freight Inshot vacuum brakes (like these tanks) would get the third letter F. TOPS codes were not actually painted onto wagons before the 1970s. There are pictures of 9Fs hauling the early 45t monobloc tanks and they make for an impressive train. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 17, 2019 Author Share Posted July 17, 2019 (edited) 22 minutes ago, BernardTPM said: TTA is a TOPS code which didn't even exist on BR when the first of the 45 ton 'monobloc' tanks were built in 1964, the A standing for air-braked. Early ones were vacuum braked so would only become TTAs if they were later updated with air brakes. There were two types of vaccum brakes; normal vacuum brakes would get a V as the third letter under TOPS, those with the more advanced Accelerated Freight Inshot vacuum brakes (like these tanks) would get the third letter F. TOPS codes were not actually painted onto wagons before the 1970s. There are pictures of 9Fs hauling the early 45t monobloc tanks and they make for an impressive train. Much appreciated @BernardTPM So with that in mind, would this be ok for post 1964 steam operation. Edited July 17, 2019 by 9793 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 8 hours ago, 9793 said: Much appreciated @BernardTPM So with that in mind, would this be ok for post 1964 steam operation. Just looked at 'Non-Pool Wagons Vol 2' by David Larkin, and discovered a 1966 photo of Shell-BP Tank 3433 at Millerhill, with vacuum bag very evident. As Bernard pointed out, such tanks appeared in quantity from 1964; their first work was to oil distribution depots, the unfitted 14t and 20t ones continuing in use for deliveries to steelworks and similar until the end of the decade. There is a lovely photo, possibly on 'Irish-Swiss Ernies' site, of a Pannier Tank shunting a brand-new LPG tank at Gloucester. This was taken in either 1964 or '65. BTW, I'm flattered to be referred to in the terms above, but would say I'm no expert, just someone who remembers having read or seen something somewhere, then struggles to find the relevant photo/written comment/web-site. It only works on certain 'prompts', alas, and I'm useless at putting names to faces.... 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 On 17/07/2019 at 23:51, 9793 said: Much appreciated @BernardTPM So with that in mind, would this be ok for post 1964 steam operation. That's certainly the early 'as built' livery, though it's hard to make out from the photo whether vacuum or air brakes are modelled (in which case in a whole train few people will notice). This is the Class B livery. There should be a similar version in pale grey with red solebar for Class A. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 18, 2019 Author Share Posted July 18, 2019 Just now, BernardTPM said: That's certainly the early 'as built' livery, though it's hard to make out from the photo whether vacuum or air brakes are modelled (in which case in a whole train few people will notice). This is the Class B livery. There should be a similar version in pale grey with red solebar for Class A. Thanks for that! @BernardTPM I'm planning to depict it as a Class B, as Awdry refers to it as a 'Train of Oil Tankers'. I read that as being Class B rather than A. Am I right with these block workings, that small unfitted Tank wagons could be added at the rear? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 As shown in the photo, brake vans were still in use on fitted trains at that date (indeed up to rule changes in late 1968) so it should be possible to have an unbraked wagon between the main, fitted train and the brake van. I don't know how often it happened. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin S-C Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 Not wanting to sound negative but simply curious - what would a train of these be doing on Sodor, given that there doesn't seem to be a refinery on the island as far as I can recall. I would expect such block trains to be filled at specialist oil terminals/docks. Will you assume one such facility is off-stage? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 18, 2019 Author Share Posted July 18, 2019 1 minute ago, Martin S-C said: Not wanting to sound negative but simply curious - what would a train of these be doing on Sodor, given that there doesn't seem to be a refinery on the island as far as I can recall. I would expect such block trains to be filled at specialist oil terminals/docks. Will you assume one such facility is off-stage? Heysham being the refinery, to Tidmouth for industry (like the Heysham-Neville Hill working I referenced earlier). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 18, 2019 Author Share Posted July 18, 2019 Some more interesting photos of the Block Oil trains from Heysham. Something I am wondering about. The Headcodes. The train looks to be fitted, yet the loco is showing a Class F 'Express Unfitted' (I've seen others like this). However I have also seen these trains showing a Class C head code. Any idea on the reason for difference in what looks to be a fitted train. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nearholmer Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 (edited) These pictures, and earlier comments, caused me to check the tractive effort delivered by a 9F and a Sulzer 2: the same. its notoriously difficult to calculate meaningful power figures for steam locos, butvmy gut feel is that the boiler and cylinders of a 9F ought to beat the diesel, but possibly only on good coal, with a good fireman, until he got tired. For all the spectacular display (of wasted energy), steam locos were actually quite feeble! PS: data in here suggests that the 9F power output was similar to that of a Sulzer 2 as well! Edited July 18, 2019 by Nearholmer 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted July 18, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 18, 2019 In that second photo at Hest Bank, the three carriages on the right appear to be in blue/grey livery. They have wood-and-canvas roofs with long rainstrips and appear to have raised panelling so are clearly of some antiquity. The one nearest has a bit of a LNWR look to it. Is that possible? Camping coaches? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted July 18, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 18, 2019 13 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: In that second photo at Hest Bank, the three carriages on the right appear to be in blue/grey livery. They have wood-and-canvas roofs with long rainstrips and appear to have raised panelling so are clearly of some antiquity. The one nearest has a bit of a LNWR look to it. Is that possible? Camping coaches? There certainly were camping coaches at Hest Bank, so I think you are very likely to be right. Some LNW design sleepers (but LMS built, I think) did survive long enough to carry blue/grey. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted July 18, 2019 Share Posted July 18, 2019 20 minutes ago, Compound2632 said: In that second photo at Hest Bank, the three carriages on the right appear to be in blue/grey livery. They have wood-and-canvas roofs with long rainstrips and appear to have raised panelling so are clearly of some antiquity. The one nearest has a bit of a LNWR look to it. Is that possible? Camping coaches? Hi Compound, The largest of the house's roofs, the one that is partially obscured by smoke, is that of Dr Peter Beet, one of the founders of Steamtown Carnforth. Gibbo. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom F Posted July 18, 2019 Author Share Posted July 18, 2019 22 minutes ago, Gibbo675 said: one of the founders of Steamtown Carnforth. Ah Steamtown.... I have very fond memories of that place! Yours truly circa 1989 with Furness 25 masquerading as Sodor's No 6! 8 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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