P2 Cock O The North - Matt vs Gloss?

[Gerrard]

So I'm thinking of buying the Hornby 'Cock O The North' but I'm not sure which is better, the Matt (R3207), or Gloss (R3440).

I believe they are the same level of detail?

 

I must admit to tending toward the matt version.

What do people think? Any recommendations or is it just down to personal preference?

 

Thanks.

 

[Black 5 Bear]

Both versions are essentially the same model, it's only the paintwork/lining and picked out detail that really differs.

One recent improvement that Hornby did make on the Railroad version, was to replace the plastic buffers on the loco with turned, non sprung metal variants.

IMHO, these improve the look of the model and in the process make it  far less fragile to handling.

The main range version for some reason continued to be produced  with the original plastic type buffers.

Hope this assists you.

 

 

Edited July 9, 2019 by Black 5 Bear
Mistakes

[atom3624]

I like the sound of the turned metal buffers.

 

Most prefer the satin-matte look.

I don't see the point in having the satin-matte look on a 'pristine' model - it should have some soot on it, and perhaps some wheel dirt - nothing exceptional - then it'll be perfect.

 

I love to see glossy locos, but accept it doesn't QUITE work in the smallish scales we have here.

Let's face it, the only time it would be pristine and shiny would be straight out of the shops, after a good scrub-down. Once it gets hammering up and down the rails, the high-gloss sheen will diminish.

 

For a 'high-end' locomotive which this would have been in it's era in real life, I would go for 'a good sheen' - Bachmann seem to get it better than Hornby - too 'clean yet dull' for me.

 

My £0.03.

 

Al.

[DonnyRailMan]

I have both and I like them both . The gloss coat dose look good though. Apart from gloss paint job they are same under the body she'll.  Both have rubbish 3 pole motor . See my thread Glossy P2 on here.

Edited July 9, 2019 by DonnyRailMan

[The Black Hat]

11 hours ago, Gerrard said:

So I'm thinking of buying the Hornby 'Cock O The North' but I'm not sure which is better, the Matt (R3207), or Gloss (R3440).

I believe they are the same level of detail?

 

I must admit to tending toward the matt version.

What do people think? Any recommendations or is it just down to personal preference?

 

Thanks.

 

 

My advice would be to buy the Matt version of the model if your thinking about the finish. Then you can paint the model with varnish and have the desired finish that you would like... be that Matt, Satin or Gloss.

[robmcg]

I'd go for the satin finish myself, but it really is personal preference as you hinted.

 

Here are some comparative advertisers' pics and one of my edited pics to help you make your mind up, I hope my picture editing doesn't offend, will remove if asked.

 

 

 

 

here below a Railroad version photo-edited to a detailed lined version.

 

 

 

and the gloss version below, which actually looks better in real life.  in my opinion

 

 

an just an excuse to show of this amazing engine, and model!

 

edited pics...

 

 

 

 

cheers to finish...

 

 

 

[The Johnster]

It comes down to personal preference.  I don't like gloss finishes on small scale models, and I include 4mm in that.  When one looks at a model, mostly one is looking at it from at least a scale 60 or so feet away, and not close up.  If you go out into the street and look at a 2 reasonably clean cars with high gloss finish, one 60 feet away and one 6, you will see that the gloss finish is far more apparent on the closer vehicle unless the sun is reflecting off it.  So, to my viewpoint, even a model representing a highly polished ex works loco looks wrong in a high gloss finish in 4mm scale.

[Steamport Southport]

It probably depends on what you are trying to portray.

 

Virtually every photograph I've seen of it in original form, it's immaculate. I don't think I've seen one where it's dirty. It's only when they had the Bugatti front that they seem to have been used to pull trains on a regular basis. Otherwise it seems to have been mainly used for exhibitions and experiments/testing.

 

 

 

Jason

[robmcg]

10 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

It probably depends on what you are trying to portray.

 

Virtually every photograph I've seen of it in original form, it's immaculate. I don't think I've seen one where it's dirty. It's only when they had the Bugatti front that they seem to have been used to pull trains on a regular basis. Otherwise it seems to have been mainly used for exhibitions and experiments/testing.

 

 

 

Jason

 

It's quite probable that 2001 got quite dirty in Scotland in the years when it was in 'normal service'.

 

I bought a Rails-weathered version with this in mind, and of course there weren't all that many photographers hanging around sheds or by the Scottish lineside when the P2s were actually working in foul weather.

 

Thus I make excuses for my purchase!

 

 

picture edited, will remove if requested.

Edited July 10, 2019 by robmcg
more detail

[DCB]

The P2s did precious little work, Dundee Aberdeen and back or Dundee Edinburgh and back was an average days work so the didn't really have time to get dirty unlike the Silver A4s which always look filthy in pictures.

I would go for the gloss one and have a dusting of grime over the top where cleaners couldn't easily reach.  I'm not sure the LNER ever painted anything Hornby LNER green let alone Matt Hornby LNER green.

[robmcg]

yes and they wouldn't have blown-off on shed, either.    

 

cheers

[John Tomlinson]

I don't know if you are thinking of buying new, or indeed if this is available for any of the variants now.

 

FWIW a few weeks ago I picked up a mint, fully lined, matt version on Ebay for under £80, which in fact was chipped. I still need to swop out the c--p 3 pole motor for a 5 pole version however!

 

John.

[Steamport Southport]

They used football teams to keep them clean.  I can count at least eleven cleaners in the photo here.

 

https://www.railwaywondersoftheworld.com/driving-locomotive.html

 

 

 

 

Jason

[gc4946]

It looks like the gloss versions have full lining and shaded numerals and lettering but the matt versions have simplified lining and plain unshaded numerals and lettering.

I don't own one of these but I'd prefer the gloss version because it has the more authentic finish especially when outshopped.

[gc4946]

On 09/07/2019 at 10:59, DonnyRailMan said:

I have both and I like them both . The gloss coat dose look good though. Apart from gloss paint job they are same under the body she'll.  Both have rubbish 3 pole motor . See my thread Glossy P2 on here.

 

 

I'm aware Pacifics post-nationalisation worked the Corstophine branch in Edinburgh at peak times https://www.railscot.co.uk/img/25/493/

... would a P2 have done the same thing pre-war?? It would be great licence to model one on a three-coach rake of Hornby's Gresley non-corridors.

 

Edited July 11, 2019 by gc4946
Added web link

[robmcg]

9 hours ago, gc4946 said:

It looks like the gloss versions have full lining and shaded numerals and lettering but the matt versions have simplified lining and plain unshaded numerals and lettering.

I don't own one of these but I'd prefer the gloss version because it has the more authentic finish especially when outshopped.

 

There is a 'normal' satin-finish P2 version with full lining, not quite so common.  Not gloss.  R3207 I think   (R3171 for the more plain version)...very good value!)   Also a TTS sound version with full lining R3246TTS I think.   The gloss one is R3440.  these off the top of my head.

Edited July 12, 2019 by robmcg
correction

[DonnyRailMan]

7 hours ago, robmcg said:

 

There is a 'normal' satin-finish P2 version with full lining, not quite so common.  Not gloss.  R3207 I think   (R3171 for the more plain version)...very good value!)   Also a TTS sound version with full lining R3246TTS I think.   The gloss one is R3440.  these off the top of my head.

 

Two of my P2s are the 3207 looks just like TTS version. But as the DCC decoder in loco . The two on the right of photo are the R3207 version.

Edited July 12, 2019 by DonnyRailMan

[DonnyRailMan]

On 09/07/2019 at 06:34, Gerrard said:

So I'm thinking of buying the Hornby 'Cock O The North' but I'm not sure which is better, the Matt (R3207), or Gloss (R3440).

I believe they are the same level of detail?

 

I must admit to tending toward the matt version.

What do people think? Any recommendations or is it just down to personal preference?

 

Thanks.

 

Hi Gerrard.

Have you decided which version of the P2 you are going to get  .

[atom3624]

This photo appeared on the 2007 PoW FaceAche site - looking rathy grimy I think!!

 

 

Al.

[DonnyRailMan]

Al, it Looks like it needs a Kercher pressure power jet wash.

 

Edited July 19, 2019 by DonnyRailMan

[atom3624]

A railway drive-through more like it!!

 

You could have fun with a Kercher doubtless!

 

Al.

[Gerrard]

On 13/07/2019 at 19:49, DonnyRailMan said:

Hi Gerrard.

Have you decided which version of the P2 you are going to get  .

 

Hi Donny - Sorry I've only just responded, I didn't realise that I had notifications turned off.

 

I decided to go for the matt finish in the end (R3207), the gloss just didn't look right and made it look too toy like for me.

Thanks for everybody's contribution to the discussion.

[atom3624]

Good choice.

 

I've ended up selling my Railroad, then getting the TTS version, changing the motor (of course, for those who know!), and giving a light spattering of 'soot' over the top.

 

Can't wait until the W1 finally comes out, then having the 2 alongside each other .... !!

 

Al.

[DonnyRailMan]

2 hours ago, Gerrard said:

 

Hi Donny - Sorry I've only just responded, I didn't realise that I had notifications turned off.

 

I decided to go for the matt finish in the end (R3207), the gloss just didn't look right and made it look too toy like for me.

Thanks for everybody's contribution to the discussion.

No problem Gerrard .

[Hal Nail]

An alternative to gloss varnish is to use very very fine wet and dry to flatten the paint finish and then polish which kitchen towel. Gives a realistic sheen rather than full gloss, with a duller appearance in crevices and corners which attracted dirt in real life.

Edited January 16, 2020 by Hal Nail