Kings Cross Outer Suburban MK 1 Coach Formations

[les101975jud]

I wonder if someone could help me with the MK1 coach formations used on the Kings Cross Outer Suburban services around 1960.  I understand these were usually made up of perhaps seven coaches and would have included an open second with lavatory for longer distance travellers.  However, I would like to know what the complete formation would look like.  Was there a composite coach with some 1st Class seating for example?  I understand the ER did not have any composite lavatory coaches.  I have looked at my copy of Parkin but could not find any further information.  Any help would be gratefully received.  Regards Les

[Nimbus]

Au contraire; the CL compo lavatory was as characteristically KX as were the Baby Deltics ! LNER vehicles were still in evidence in some numbers too, into 1963 according to my daily travels at the time.

 

The Nim.

[31A]

Typically six coaches formed BS-SLO-CL-CL-BS-SLO, with additional coaches added at busy times.

[robertcwp]

There were also some gangwayed sets used on outer-suburban services (not just the Cambridge Buffet Express). These sets typically had a Gresley brake second at each end, a Thompson corridor first and three Mark I open seconds around 1960 time:

 

D5906_KX_APR-60 by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

[Clive Mortimore]

1 hour ago, robertcwp said:

There were also some gangwayed sets used on outer-suburban services (not just the Cambridge Buffet Express). These sets typically had a Gresley brake second at each end, a Thompson corridor first and three Mark I open seconds around 1960 time:

 

D5906_KX_APR-60 by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

To add to Robert's post, they carried on with the same formation when the Thompson and Gresleys were replaced by Mk1s in the mid 60s. I am sure Robert knows this.

[robertcwp]

21 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

To add to Robert's post, they carried on with the same formation when the Thompson and Gresleys were replaced by Mk1s in the mid 60s. I am sure Robert knows this.

Although by 1969 they had changed to having one brake in the middle of the set and an additional TSO. Some sets had a BSO rather than a BSK by then.

 

I believe the early appearance of Mark I open seconds (thirds until 1956) in the trains was because the early Mark I opens delivered to the Eastern had narrower seats than later ones and were not popular on main line services. Hence, they ended up in outer suburban sets.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

And you can hang a gangwayed coach on the front or rear of a KX suburban set, usually a Gresley or Thompson vehicle, or even an LMS type. You can put a WD austerity 2-8-0 on the front too - very occasionally.

2 hours ago, robertcwp said:

There were also some gangwayed sets used on outer-suburban services (not just the Cambridge Buffet Express). These sets typically had a Gresley brake second at each end, a Thompson corridor first and three Mark I open seconds around 1960 time:

 

D5906_KX_APR-60 by Robert Carroll, on Flickr

How I would like once more to be bouncing across the KX throat in that gently creaking Gresley coach after the run behind the madly wailing Baby Deltic.

[les101975jud]

Many thanks for the informative replies to my original question.  My spotting days at KX covered 1965 - 1968.  I copped all the Deltics and Baby Deltics but took little, if any, notice of coaching stock.  I can vaguely remember some old LNER carriages with oval windows on some trains, some in the new corporate blue and white livery.  Presumably these would have been BGs or Restaurant carriages?

 

I am intrigued about LNER vehicles being used on inner and outer suburban trains.  What types would these have been around 1960?  Once again thank you all for your help so far.

 

Regards Les

[robertcwp]

5 hours ago, les101975jud said:

Many thanks for the informative replies to my original question.  My spotting days at KX covered 1965 - 1968.  I copped all the Deltics and Baby Deltics but took little, if any, notice of coaching stock.  I can vaguely remember some old LNER carriages with oval windows on some trains, some in the new corporate blue and white livery.  Presumably these would have been BGs or Restaurant carriages?

 

I am intrigued about LNER vehicles being used on inner and outer suburban trains.  What types would these have been around 1960?  Once again thank you all for your help so far.

 

Regards Les

The oval windows would have been on Thompson stock. The only blue/grey ones apart from sleeping cars would have been the two buffet cars, which did appear at King's Cross in the late 1960s. Gresley buffets continued to feature in the Cambridge Buffet Express until the early 1970s. As for other LNER types, Thompson corridor firsts were in some of the outer-suburban sets into the 1960s, as were some Gresley brake seconds, both of which can be seen in the photo I posted in an earlier reply.