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Model Rail / Heljan Class 11 0-6-0DE

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With 12052 & 12093 preserved and operational at the Caledonian Railway it'll be hard not to buy one black (early emblem) and green (late crest)!

 

12052

 

12093

 

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If these are up to the standard of the recent 05 and 07 they should be great. Heljan seem to be good at small shunters, l hope they might do the Scottish 06 one day or maybe one for Model rail in the future.

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Was there ever an 11 in black with wasp stripes?

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Posted (edited)

As much I am a Big Four modeller who is certainly going to slam down a pre-order for both LMS examples, I'm going to have to get one of the BR examples renumbered as SVR resident 12099. 12099 has always been my favourite SVR diesel shunter since I first saw her. This may however open the door to me getting other SVR residents now...!! :lol:

 

20759312266_f7b1a8389f_b.jpg

 

20925865490_8494e1b88d_b.jpg

Edited by Garethp8873
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I started my preservation volunteering life in 1988 on 12099, needle gunning the orange off her. One of those is a definite must! I even researched her life and provided the material for the SVR stock book entry on it. Nice one.

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Would loved to have read about it but my copy of MR hasn’t arrived, even more annoying is I drive past the offices every day lol.

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49 minutes ago, russ p said:

Was there ever an 11 in black with wasp stripes?

Hi Russ

 

There are black and white photos of class 11s with the Lion on the Unicycle totem with wasp ends. Very few locos carried the totem in green livery so the photos where a loco has the totem not the emblem could well be black. Todate I am unaware of a colour photo of a black class 11 with wasp ends.

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49 minutes ago, Clive Mortimore said:

Hi Russ

 

There are black and white photos of class 11s with the Lion on the Unicycle totem with wasp ends. Very few locos carried the totem in green livery so the photos where a loco has the totem not the emblem could well be black. Todate I am unaware of a colour photo of a black class 11 with wasp ends.

There's a photo  on Colour Rail reputed to be 1966, it has a blue FYE Class 40 in the background so looks correct cate.

12051 at Warrington Arpley with early emblem, wasp stripes and 'British Railways' showing through the worn paintwork.

 

Other pictures on the site have 12055 with wasp stripes and early emblem in 1970, allegedly in green but not really clear enough to tell for certain and 12054 still carrying 'British Railways' in 1957

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Beware of some class 11's in preservation, as they have had exhauster boxes added, look at the above photos of 12099, and so look more like 08's. The class 11's and 12's in BR use never had vacuum brakes fitted, although some Class 12's did have air brake capability fitted towards the end of thier lives.

 

Paul J.

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24 minutes ago, Swindon 123 said:

Beware of some class 11's in preservation, as they have had exhauster boxes added, look at the above photos of 12099, and so look more like 08's. The class 11's and 12's in BR use never had vacuum brakes fitted, although some Class 12's did have air brake capability fitted towards the end of thier lives.

 

Paul J.

 

Three of them from 1970 according to Wiki.

 

15230–15232 Air from 1970

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_12

 

 

Something I was looking at as I was wondering whether they were used as station pilots. Seems not.

 

http://www.semgonline.com/diesel/class12.html

 

 

Jason

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19 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Gosh it’s refreshing to see a new modern image type... 

I'm not sure a 75 year old design counts as modern image! 

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8 hours ago, Swindon 123 said:

Beware of some class 11's in preservation, as they have had exhauster boxes added, look at the above photos of 12099, and so look more like 08's. The class 11's and 12's in BR use never had vacuum brakes fitted, although some Class 12's did have air brake capability fitted towards the end of their lives.

 

Paul J.

I remember them as yard shunters in the West Midlands, much the equivalent of the Steam Braked Jinty.

In the late 1950s the local allocations were used for Bushbury yards (2), Bescot (2), and Aston Goods/ Curzon Street (4) on the LNW lines There was also one at Ryecroft but I dont know the purpose of that, possibly the goods depot by Walsall station and the PWay yard. Saltley had a big allocation of 13 , plus 6 08s for Lawley Street, Duddeston Sidings, Washwood Heath, Bromford Bridge and Water Orton.

 

Four, along with 15101 and 15103 were used at Tyseley during the early 1950s, but these were replaced by the first five 08s, 13000-04. The latter were replaced by 13025-29 about a year later.

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Posted (edited)
9 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Three of them from 1970 according to Wiki.

 

15230–15232 Air from 1970

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_12

 

 

Something I was looking at as I was wondering whether they were used as station pilots. Seems not.

Hi,

They were something of an ad-hoc solution to the lack of air braked shunters for the Bournemouth electrification and were used mainly at Bomo and Weymouth. They only lasted a short time before the A/B'd 03's with high level pipes came along and took over.

They could, and did, shunt A/B'd MK 1's and TC's, the latter using hose extensions in the same way as non push-pull Cromptons headed TC units.

They were used on the Weymouth Tramway for the Boat trains. At least one arrived with 3 link couplings and had to be hastily supplied with a screw coupling. They worked fine but not particularly liked primarily because of visibility running hood forward down the tram.

 

Definitely on the list but I've been collecting bits to do one from an 08 inspired by EM Gauge 70's http://emgauge70s.co.uk/model_omwb154.html

However with a longish wait in prospect may well carry on with it.

Stu

Edited by lapford34102
Appalling spelling!
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Posted (edited)

Prompted by this thread I've just opened my electronic copy of the mag. This model is most welcome and I shall certainly be ordering one of the LMS liveried examples. One thing though, the editorial says that this model will be suitable for 1930s layouts but that isn't true, the prototype was very much a 1940s to early 1970s machine.

 

A question to Chris Leigh, is it being designed so it will suitable for conversion to EM/P4?

 

Regards

Edited by PenrithBeacon
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15 hours ago, dibber25 said:

I love 18000's looks but I sometimes wonder if I would have enjoyed how it sounded or smelled. Having lived under the Heathrow flightpath for half my life, I guess the sound and the smell might be all too familiar! However, 18000 would be a bit big and too streamlined for Model Rail. We've just done a steam loco that looks like a garden shed, now we're doing a diesel that looks like a bunch of tin lockers nailed together! I guess what it lacked in beauty, it made up for with pretty colour schemes - and there are loads to choose from!. (CJL)

Ah yes, the whiff! “Kerosene Castle”. Smells can be very evocative, not necessarily in a good way. Diesel exhaust used to stink a lot worse than it does nowadays but the evil smell takes me back to messing about in cruise boats. The racket which comes from the turbines in the APT-E is very impressive but I can well understand that the stream of jet airliners over your head would leave you unenthused.

 

Model Rail does seem to go for the small stuff and does it very well. The USA Tanks were breathtaking. As for the 11s and 12s, apart from anything else, they fill two gaps at a stroke and I dare say that I’m not alone in looking at unmodelled TOPS codes. A very good choice! I wonder if Kernow might be persuaded once the steam railmotor is well in hand. If the Bulleid diesels and the diesel hydraulics have sold well, why wouldn’t the turbines?

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2 hours ago, PenrithBeacon said:

Prompted by this thread I've just opened my electronic copy of the mag. This model is most welcome and I shall certainly be ordering one of the LMS liveried examples. One thing though, the editorial says that this model will be suitable for 1930s layouts but that isn't true, the prototype was very much a 1940s to early 1970s machine.

 

A question to Chris Leigh, is it being designed so it will suitable for conversion to EM/P4?

 

Regards

Not something I can answer, but I would expect it will be a standard Heljan mechanism design and i don't know if they suit easy conversion or not. In general such considerations add to the cost (unless they are already built in to standard components and assembly methods) and with margins being very tight these days it usually doesn't make economic sense to spend a lot extra for a few extra sales. It's early days yet, anyway, so I doubt that any design work has yet been undertaken. (CJL)

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12 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Three of them from 1970 according to Wiki.

 

15230–15232 Air from 1970

Just to update this, not sure where Wiki got the info but four, 15230 - 15233, were A/B'd.  15231 was the errant 3 link equipped one.

Hopefully Heljan won't need reminding that the Class 12's had additional pairs of marker lights front and rear.

Stu

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Hello everyone

 

Firstly, congratulations to Chris and Model Rail on these welcome announcements!

 

In the Wishlist Polls since 2013, the Class 11 has been mainly Middle Polling with the Class 12 Low Polling. (Note that even if an item is Low Polling, it is still extremely high if one considers that the Polls could list 30,000+ items each year!)

 

On a personal note, I will certainly be ordering a Class 12.

 

Brian (on behalf of The 00 Poll Team)

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Posted (edited)
20 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

Not something I can answer, but I would expect it will be a standard Heljan mechanism design and i don't know if they suit easy conversion or not. In general such considerations add to the cost (unless they are already built in to standard components and assembly methods) and with margins being very tight these days it usually doesn't make economic sense to spend a lot extra for a few extra sales. It's early days yet, anyway, so I doubt that any design work has yet been undertaken. (CJL)

 

But it doesn't take much to make sure that such items are EM/P4 compatible. We had this with the 1600 thread. All that's required is a dimension in the spec to make sure there's sufficient clearance for EM/P4 wheels. That's all. Nothing more. I fail to see how that significantly adds to the cost of the project. I'd have thought that with margins being very tight any manufactuer would want to maximise all possible sales for what should amount to very little effort...

 

If I can get P4 wheels in one I'll definately have 15105. If not I'll buy another Hornby 08. 

 

Justin

Edited by jjnewitt
Yypo
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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, dibber25 said:

Not something I can answer, but I would expect it will be a standard Heljan mechanism design and i don't know if they suit easy conversion or not. In general such considerations add to the cost (unless they are already built in to standard components and assembly methods) and with margins being very tight these days it usually doesn't make economic sense to spend a lot extra for a few extra sales. It's early days yet, anyway, so I doubt that any design work has yet been undertaken. (CJL)

Thanks for that. I wouldn't like to predict what Heljan will do, the Bachmann 08 is suitable for EM/P4 but due (I think)  to the nature of the conversions the loco is out of the loading gauge at the platform level. It's difficult to design an outside frame chassis for RTR that's to scale and suitable for EM/P4; pity.

 

It might be worth noting that the LMS shunters were wider than the BR ones across the platform

 

Regards

Edited by PenrithBeacon
Additional paragraph

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23 minutes ago, lapford34102 said:

Just to update this, not sure where Wiki got the info but four, 15230 - 15233, were A/B'd.  15231 was the errant 3 link equipped one.

Hopefully Heljan won't need reminding that the Class 12's had additional pairs of marker lights front and rear.

Stu

They are fully aware, the article does state-

 

"We will include key differences- Bulleid 'Boxpok' wheels and the extra lamp iron/marker lights - but please be aware that limitations to the tooling may mean that it's not possible to include some smaller detain differences (also applicable to the Western Region machines)".

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6 hours ago, lapford34102 said:

Just to update this, not sure where Wiki got the info but four, 15230 - 15233, were A/B'd.  15231 was the errant 3 link equipped one.

Hopefully Heljan won't need reminding that the Class 12's had additional pairs of marker lights front and rear.

Stu

Hi Stu

 

Did they have a air-brake cabinet like an 08? 

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