sem34090 Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 (edited) So, the serious thread (The silly version is here - Today, or some other recent day, saw the inauguration of a competition by the DfT for new pacer uses. Now, I wondered what serious, useful, suggestions could be offered here? More on the competition here - https://www.railadvent.co.uk/2019/07/transform-a-pacer-competion-now-open.html/amp One thought of mine is that there is potential for them to be used for commuter services on heritage lines, the slower speeds and shorter distances meaning they'd be less of a problem. The ideal unit for any line to get would be the 144 that Porterbrook rebuilt not so long ago. Any other (serious/sensible) suggestions? Edited July 12, 2019 by sem34090 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted July 12, 2019 Share Posted July 12, 2019 I had a thought similar to AVS above to remove the bodies aft of the cab and adapt them for swap bodies for supermarket transport. What gave me the idea was here in Wales where supermarket lorries have to travel some distance to serve places like Welshpool (Tesco) and Aberystwyth (Morrison) along narrow single track roads. If a 142 was modified to take a swap body, it could run (possibly in multiple with units for other destinations) from wherever the current Stobart Tescoliner runs from, drop off at Shrewsbury, if necessary attaching to a service train if pathing is difficult, and with a new siding or an existing one reactivated, a mobile handling unit and an electric tug, then drop off the swap body at the supermarket(s) at relatively low cost and a chance for great greenwash publicity for the supermarket. The ability to multiple with other stock would be useful to avoid taking up paths on long single lines, allowing flexible delivery times if needed. Some routes would need to be cleared but it could be a cheap way of providing experimental goods services on rural lines without the need for expensive new kit which becomes wasted if the experiment fails. 3 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 The idea of using them for freight in some form seems reasonable, provided the freight could be handled at either end. Aberystwyth only has the passenger station platform, for example, so anything on the train would need to be unloaded using equipment which could go on there, not to mention the fun and games that ETCS on the Cambrian lines would cause. Building dedicated facilities at any station would probably be a step too far for the early stages of such an idea. But perhaps there are suitable flows somewhere around the country. Of course, no reason this has to be limited to Pacers. 150s would probably be a better bet with their wider doors if the existing body is retained. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesperus Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 I've often thought that a frieght service of sorts could be run using ex-passenger stock and something similar to supermarket rollcages. It's unfortunate in this case that 142's with the entrance step aren't very suitable. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 1 hour ago, Hesperus said: I've often thought that a frieght service of sorts could be run using ex-passenger stock and something similar to supermarket rollcages. It's unfortunate in this case that 142's with the entrance step aren't very suitable. Sounds suspiciously like Mk1 BGs and BRUTE trollies to me ;-). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrel Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 Parcels units? A updated red star parcels. These days there is so many more parcels being sent around the country thanks to Amazon, eBay online shopping and hattons. while 142with their step would not be suitable a 143 or a 144 would. They could be coupled onto the front of rear of a passenger service and wouldn't take up any extra paths. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesperus Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 If they ran into Aberystwyth as the front unit they could be unloaded between services and run back as the rear unit of the next service (subject to not causing chaos at Mach when the other unit joins). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 33 minutes ago, Hesperus said: If they ran into Aberystwyth as the front unit they could be unloaded between services and run back as the rear unit of the next service (subject to not causing chaos at Mach when the other unit joins). You'd have to fit them with ETCS on-board kit; somehow, I don't think the figures would add up.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JDW Posted July 13, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 13, 2019 As much as I'd like to see old stock re-used, and indeed more freight on the railways, I think realistically there isn't a future for them beyond preservation of a few examples. Any parcels projects would need infrastructure which has either been lost or never existed. By the time that's been done, there are better options than converting 142s (150s, Mk3s, ex FGW Motorail vans, HSTs, etc) - chiefly things like MPVs (either new or "borrowed" like for the log trains years back). Every time things like this are brought up, they lead nowhere despite efforts in the industry to get them off the ground, simply because they don't offer enough practical benefits for the cost and complication they introduce to supply chains. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbo675 Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 Just cut them up and be done with it all !!! 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Saunders Posted July 13, 2019 Share Posted July 13, 2019 Donate the engines, gearboxes to the former LT D-trains/class 230 project! Mark Saunders 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheesysmith Posted July 14, 2019 Share Posted July 14, 2019 How about taking the engines and gearboxes and fitting them to withdrawn PEP units. Each pair Pacers would power a PEP driving motor, giving a cheap proper DMU needed for some of the more financially poor lines or commuter use. Not every line needs or can afford 100mph brand new DMUs. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold adb968008 Posted July 14, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 14, 2019 (edited) Heres a few suggestions... Theyve got big windows / views, Take the bodies off the chassis and use them as a coffee shop. if the seats were removed and replaced by tables / chairs they could serve a grounded purpose. The chassis / cab could be used as a pway vehicle. In an undercover setting, they could be good to display a model railway, if you removed the glass from the windows, people could look in to see the layout in use, whilst giving a degree of separation from The layout to the user. Station waiting rooms, at locations with bay platforms, including bus stations.. Sink a couple off Blackpool beach and offer submarine tours ? (Yes serious). Holiday cottages ? Take out the cabs off two ends and block one set of doors, fit the entrance of the other with a ramp, add a full body width gangway, add the prm toilet and run as a 4 car unit. Edited July 14, 2019 by adb968008 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesperus Posted July 14, 2019 Share Posted July 14, 2019 5 hours ago, cheesysmith said: How about taking the engines and gearboxes and fitting them to withdrawn PEP units. Each pair Pacers would power a PEP driving motor, giving a cheap proper DMU needed for some of the more financially poor lines or commuter use. Not every line needs or can afford 100mph brand new DMUs. Perhaps not the PEP units which are nearly as rusty as the Pacers but there are a good few mk3 based units (317/455) that are being replaced soon and could probably live a few more years. 23 hours ago, Fat Controller said: You'd have to fit them with ETCS on-board kit; somehow, I don't think the figures would add up.. Would they need the kit if they were the rear unit? If they didn't then there is plenty of space for a siding at Aberystwyth if the Google maps images are up to date. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted July 14, 2019 Share Posted July 14, 2019 1 hour ago, Hesperus said: Perhaps not the PEP units which are nearly as rusty as the Pacers but there are a good few mk3 based units (317/455) that are being replaced soon and could probably live a few more years. Would they need the kit if they were the rear unit? If they didn't then there is plenty of space for a siding at Aberystwyth if the Google maps images are up to date. If they weren't fitted, then you'd have all the palaver of running round, which would probably increase dwell-times at either end to 30 minutes or more. I remember this having to be done with the BB22200 electrics when the Channel Tunnel first opened. As for putting in a new siding at Aber; you're looking at something between £250 000 and £500 000. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hesperus Posted July 14, 2019 Share Posted July 14, 2019 13 minutes ago, Fat Controller said: As for putting in a new siding at Aber; you're looking at something between £250 000 and £500 000. Maybe try Whitby first? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
25901 Posted July 14, 2019 Share Posted July 14, 2019 Rip the bodies off but leave the cabs on, new mini MPV's which would be handy at this time of years so all the Northern drivers can boost their Christmas bonus doing RHTT. Or could DRS and Harry Needle have a cunning plan, HS2 staff trains lol Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PatB Posted July 14, 2019 Share Posted July 14, 2019 24 minutes ago, Hesperus said: Maybe try Whitby first? That's rather a long way for the good people of Aberyswyth to go to collect their parcels ;-). 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Market65 Posted July 14, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 14, 2019 Convert them into the freight wagons that they really are. Of course, they would have to be able to run at 100 mph on today’s railway, so bogies would have to be fitted, etc, so I guess that rules that out. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted July 16, 2019 RMweb Gold Share Posted July 16, 2019 Put road wheels with rubber tyres on 'em and use them as bendybuses; that's what they are really anyway... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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