Talbotjohn Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 I offer the following as a cautionary tale.... I wanted to create a lightweight back scene I could use when exhibiting my HOm RhB layout "Rosental". Having thought about it long and hard I purchased a Faller “Oberstdorf “ back scene that looks the business and some A1 sheets of white 5mm Foam board. I had to join an extra strip of foam board down the side of each piece as the Faller sections are slightly longer than the A1 foam board sheets. So far so good. I was planning to stick the back scenes to the foam board using Prit Stik but then found we had some Solvite wall paper paste and decided to use that as I thought being able to slide it about a bit initially would help position the backscene on the foam board. This is where things started to go Wrong. When pasted with Solvite the Faller back scene sections increased in length by about an inch or so and were too long to fit my accurately cut foam board sections! Anyway, I centralised them thinking I would cut off the excess and jiggle the joints afterwards. Worse still I didn't weight them down to dry and then found that the height of the back scenes had shrunk back during drying and induced a nice concave shape into my foam board sections! (see photo) - Argh! (and various other expletives I would rather not type here...). I tried weighting them flat and even standing on the reverse side but to no avail. (I just put a lot of small creases in the foam board). I thought about buying a replacement.... In the end I decide to use 12mm x 32mm pine wood (doorstop) strips on the back to pull out the curvature. It is working and the pieces are still quite light to handle which was one of the initial considerations. (see photos). My wife saw them in the garage and said they looked good without prompting so that is good enough for me... I am planning to put another strip of wood along the white section on the front of each as a means of attaching the back scene to the layout. Learning points: 1. Like wall paper, most paper backscenes may stretch and perhaps shrink back when pasted with wall paper paste or diluted PVA glue. (obvious really to anyone who has put up wallpaper at home !) 2. Unsupported 5mm foam board isn't rigid enough to resist bending forces of shrinking thick papers. 3 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JimFin Posted September 7, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2019 I have been have lots of learning on that front as well. Given up with commercial and having a go at printing my own. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marly51 Posted September 7, 2019 Share Posted September 7, 2019 Do you think painting the back of the board, or pasting lining paper on the back, might have provided enough tension to adjust curvature of the board? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JimFin Posted September 7, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 7, 2019 Best solution I have come up with so far is to use 3M repositionable spray adhesive which does cure and become permanent eventually but gives you the ability to adjust while fitting. Does not seem to wet the paper in the same way as "conventional" adhesive. I have also been recommended to try Frisk mounting spray, have bought some but not used it yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Frutigen Posted September 8, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 8, 2019 I’ve found that pasting anything on to foam board causes it to curve as the skin is basically paper and reacts to the adhesive along with any tension in the thing you’re pasting to it. Even just painting on one side will cause it, so Marly51’s suggestion of painting the other side to balance it might be worth a try. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talbotjohn Posted September 10, 2019 Author Share Posted September 10, 2019 Hi. Thanks for your helpful comments. With hindsight I did think that pasting lining paper on the reverse might have helped but I suspect that would be best done at the same time - and it would have been a bit tricky to manage two glued surfaces at the same time. If I were doing it again I would explore some of the other adhesives mentioned by Jim above and add some form of bracing to the foam board from the outset. i would also ask someone to help me lay the back scene onto the foam board rather than try to do it myself again! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JimFin Posted September 10, 2019 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 10, 2019 IF - you are feeling brave, its worth adding a coat of this - https://www.diy.com/departments/ronseal-one-coat-clear-matt-stain-guard-clear-coat-0-75l/1212790_BQ.prd (other retailers are available!) . I have found it does protect against marking quite well and has no effect on the paper, just a tiny fraction darker shade as it is applied. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Salmotrutta Posted September 12, 2019 Share Posted September 12, 2019 On 07/09/2019 at 05:46, Talbotjohn said: I offer the following as a cautionary tale.... I wanted to create a lightweight back scene I could use when exhibiting my HOm RhB layout "Rosental". Having thought about it long and hard I purchased a Faller “Oberstdorf “ back scene that looks the business and some A1 sheets of white 5mm Foam board. I had to join an extra strip of foam board down the side of each piece as the Faller sections are slightly longer than the A1 foam board sheets. So far so good. I was planning to stick the back scenes to the foam board using Prit Stik but then found we had some Solvite wall paper paste and decided to use that as I thought being able to slide it about a bit initially would help position the backscene on the foam board. This is where things started to go Wrong. When pasted with Solvite the Faller back scene sections increased in length by about an inch or so and were too long to fit my accurately cut foam board sections! Anyway, I centralised them thinking I would cut off the excess and jiggle the joints afterwards. Worse still I didn't weight them down to dry and then found that the height of the back scenes had shrunk back during drying and induced a nice concave shape into my foam board sections! (see photo) - Argh! (and various other expletives I would rather not type here...). I tried weighting them flat and even standing on the reverse side but to no avail. (I just put a lot of small creases in the foam board). I thought about buying a replacement.... In the end I decide to use 12mm x 32mm pine wood (doorstop) strips on the back to pull out the curvature. It is working and the pieces are still quite light to handle which was one of the initial considerations. (see photos). My wife saw them in the garage and said they looked good without prompting so that is good enough for me... I am planning to put another strip of wood along the white section on the front of each as a means of attaching the back scene to the layout. Learning points: 1. Like wall paper, most paper backscenes may stretch and perhaps shrink back when pasted with wall paper paste or diluted PVA glue. (obvious really to anyone who has put up wallpaper at home !) 2. Unsupported 5mm foam board isn't rigid enough to resist bending forces of shrinking thick papers. Been there - done that! except it was painting and glueing scatter on the board that had that effect! Foam board looks like it should be much more stable than it actually is..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Vecchio Posted March 25, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2020 Well also I used the same Faller background, even with its extension. I use light ply boards of 3mm, but also they need a similar frame to reinforce the boards not to get warped. The first part I glued on with standard wall paper glue. It is difficult, there is massive shrinking and it doesn't glue well at the edges. After some head scratching I moved over to spray mount glue from 3M. Problem here is to be fast, before the glue dries. Also you need to have it in the right starting position, as there is no correction possible.... Solution: the first centimeter is glued on with standard all purpose glue (UHU) , then, when this is proper gluing the board is sprayed with the spray glue, using quite a bit. after that the background print is rolled over and hopefully sticks well. Using this method the warping/shrinking is less. To fix it over the edges I used again all purpose glue. If you look at the attached photo you will see some nice folds, but from some distance it looks ok. Next Layout: Probably I invest into proper, glue backed, printed background... By the way - the Faller extension is a joke. They just printed the same photo again, but mirror image.... Look at the rightmost module, here you see the point where the mirror image starts. Clearly visible - especially if you look at the clouds. 20200214_202839 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted March 25, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 25, 2020 There are lightweight plastic alternatives like Foamex available in 3 & 5mm sheets. They are stable and you can use spraymount or cheaper sprays for carpet tiles to mount the paper. I’ve laid the backscene on dry with the board on the floor, use a cut open bin bag to protect the floor from overspray, tack the far end on using low tack tape rolled into a tube so it’s sticky side out. Lift up the starting end once lined up, and the far end racked down, and spray the first couple of feet. Making sure the paper is lined up with the top edge unroll it into the glue and it should line up perfectly. Now remove the tack tape and roll up the other end and spray the boards lightly, then unroll slowly watching the top edge working along with a soft cloth to push out air bubbles as you go if you do trap one or two a sharp blade in the scalpel to release the air and gently wipe over with the cloth. I also use this application method with the vinyl self adhesive ones I’ve started having printed as custom ones 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium JimFin Posted March 25, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2020 Gave up with the paper backscenes, 10 exhibitions later and looking too scruffy. Got a local sign maker to print them up with images from Wiki Media onto sign board. Not cheap but may end up costing less in the long run. Standing in place, not yet fixed. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Vecchio Posted March 25, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 25, 2020 I like the effect of the jet plane leaving a condensation stripe. Makes it more natural. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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