GMRC Series 2 - Episode 1 - 'The Restless Earth'

[Phil Parker]

I've just been watching the coverage on the Hornby YouTube channel. What struck me was - why is there a coffin in this pub garden?

 

 

[Graham_Muz]

It’s where they keep Steve Flint’s the dead pan expressions...

 

 

 

 

.... I was going to keep him between takes but thought more of it.... 

 

 

 

 

.... doh! 

[No Decorum]

Coming late to the party, I have two observations which I haven’t seen mentioned. Tirpitz in the tar pit caused me a guffaw – a beautifully timed piece of humour. The other was the shot of a real steam locomotive sucking steam (condensate) down its chimney. About all that can be said in its favour is that it makes a change from mirror lettering which appears all too often. I wonder about the competence of some editors. Despite that, a very enjoyable programme.

 

I have no particular prejudice against old men (after all, I am one) but it was most agreeable to see a whole team of young people, half female, alight with enthusiasm. If “The Train Set” people reverse the trend to falling production, they will have done the hobby far more good than anyone else*.

 

*Except possibly Montana and Kay. I suspect the latter has resulted in Andy’s fondle ban from C&M. 

[iL Dottore]

Finally caught up with my recorded TV backlog (thanks to Mrs iD having filled up the HD with crime series ) and watched GMRC Season 2, Episode 1 and my overall impression - like for series 1 - is that it is very much the proverbial curate's egg.

 

Well done to the participating teams, some exemplary modelling done under what must be immense pressure.

 

This year a distinct improvement (at least - so far - in Episode 1) was the selection of items given out for the scratch built challenge: there was nothing that I would regard as "you're havin' a laff, aren't you" although I think that there was far too much tutu tulle doled out (1 tutu could probably meet the needs of a dozen or more layouts). I wonder how much feedback there was, last year, about the suitability of the items given out for the scratch built challenge.

 

For me, the major negative of the competition is the expectation of multiple "animations" on each layout and rather "over the top" ones at that (a volcano in the British Isles? Be serious). My personal perspective is that animations on a layout should be like salt&pepper, CGI and swearing - used sparingly to help showcase everything else and not used just for the sake of it, But aside from my personal preference, I think that emphasising the animations is doing the non-railway modeller viewer a diservice: how many non-railway modellers will - after watching this programme - go to a model railway exhibition and be disappointed by the dearth of flying saucers, erupting volcanos, animated Daleks and the like? Surely the programme should highlight the middle ground between the finescale 4mm replica run to a prototypical timetable and the all singing, all dancing, exploding toy train set?

 

I know that C5 needs viewing figures (and - to paraphrase PT Barnum - Nobody ever lost a pound by underestimating the taste of the British public), but surely - with the success of things like the Slow TV movement - GMRC could be a little more challenging and informative in its presentation? Still, it is compulsive viewing and thanks to the miracle of digital audiovisual technology I can fast foreward through the filler shots and talking heads to the modelling (and there is some great modelling being done).

 

Again, well done teams: you are far braver than I would ever be!

 

iD

[john new]

1 hour ago, No Decorum said:

Coming late to the party, I have two observations which I haven’t seen mentioned. Tirpitz in the tar pit caused me a guffaw – a beautifully timed piece of humour. The other was the shot of a real steam locomotive sucking steam (condensate) down its chimney. About all that can be said in its favour is that it makes a change from mirror lettering which appears all too often. I wonder about the competence of some editors. Despite that, a very enjoyable programme.

 

I have no particular prejudice against old men (after all, I am one) but it was most agreeable to see a whole team of young people, half female, alight with enthusiasm. If “The Train Set” people reverse the trend to falling production, they will have done the hobby far more good than anyone else*.

 

*Except possibly Montana and Kay. I suspect the latter has resulted in Andy’s fondle ban from C&M. 

 

Glad I’m not the only one who noticed the backwards running film snippet.  If being critical of the film work did anyone else notice that some of the film from inside the layout room was vertically stretched? My guess either (1) a format mismatch being made to fit panoramic to TV ratio, or (b) deliberate stretching vertically to cut some background out. Very noticeable on the shots of the Brit.

 

Definitely in the show footage, not our local TV settings.

Edited September 17, 2019 by john new

[whart57]

You need animations, but one thing I would say to anyone thinking of taking part in any series three is that the cameras KBG use can do pretty decent close-ups. Animations need to be interesting but they don't need to be three foot tall

[MarkSG]

16 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

I've just been watching the coverage on the Hornby YouTube channel. What struck me was - why is there a coffin in this pub garden?

 

 

Never mind the coffin, does the captain of the Corby team really share his name with a rock and roll star?
 

  

[Neil]

41 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

.... For me, the major negative of the competition is the expectation of multiple "animations" on each layout ......, I think that emphasising the animations is doing the non-railway modeller viewer a diservice: how many non-railway modellers will - after watching this programme - go to a model railway exhibition and be disappointed by the dearth of flying saucers, erupting volcanos, animated Daleks and the like? ....

 

A well reasoned point but one effect of the series may be that animated features become more commonplace on exhibition layouts. A number (an increasing number?) have moving road vehicles, lighting effects, loading and unloading animations. Earlier this year I spent an enjoyable day at Miniatur Wunderland in Hamburg which is stuffed full of animated features not seen on the average model railway. While animation isn't something I would want to build into my own layouts I can see the attraction for others.

[LMS29]

20 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

 

I'd also suggest that imagination, innovation and solid time-management are as important in this competition as pure model railway skills. You might be able to apply the correct number of rivets to a smokebox and solder lamp irons in place in one go, but these aren't the skills that look good on telly. Being able to build a working earthquake, that's what's needed. That and being able to make the trains work properly, but then if you saw the last series, you'll know how important that is.

 

 

 

Our team of experienced modellers had a serious discussion before entering the competition about how we felt modelling well outside our usual comfort zone.  We recognised that we were making a TV programme, that time would be limited and had to be well planned. What really mattered was how things looked to the Judges and ultimately the viewers, so extreme levels of detail were not necessary.   As you can see from Heat 1, the broad nature of the brief allowed plenty of freedom to interpret the brief as the teams wished. I think there were many challenges for modellers of all skills levels, we certainly found it so.  

[noiseboy72]

The rules say "All layouts must contain at least one functioning animation. Extra credit will be awarded for height, additional animations, ingenuity, humour and theatricality. The more creative and bold Teams are, the better." 

 

That being said, the layout as a whole must appeal to the judges and just having some cool animations that don't add to the layout won't win you points. I thought pretty much all of the animations in Heat 1 fitted the theme and added to their layouts. Maybe it's just the child in me, but they hold my attention much more than a boring, static diorama - however well it's been modelled. 

[RedgateModels]

45 minutes ago, Neil said:

 

A well reasoned point but one effect of the series may be that animated features become more commonplace on exhibition layouts. A number (an increasing number?) have moving road vehicles, lighting effects, loading and unloading animations. Earlier this year I spent an enjoyable day at Miniatur Wunderland in Hamburg which is stuffed full of animated features not seen on the average model railway. While animation isn't something I would want to build into my own layouts I can see the attraction for others.

 

and there's me looking to pick up an old Hornby operating conveyor for my new layout  ........

[TravisM]

4 hours ago, MarkSG said:

 

Never mind the coffin, does the captain of the Corby team really share his name with a rock and roll star?
 

  

 

I think he changed his name by deed poll.  I do know his real name but I don’t think he’d thank me for revealing it.

Edited September 17, 2019 by jools1959

[TravisM]

7 hours ago, iL Dottore said:

Finally caught up with my recorded TV backlog (thanks to Mrs iD having filled up the HD with crime series ) and watched GMRC Season 2, Episode 1 and my overall impression - like for series 1 - is that it is very much the proverbial curate's egg.

 

Well done to the participating teams, some exemplary modelling done under what must be immense pressure.

 

This year a distinct improvement (at least - so far - in Episode 1) was the selection of items given out for the scratch built challenge: there was nothing that I would regard as "you're havin' a laff, aren't you" although I think that there was far too much tutu tulle doled out (1 tutu could probably meet the needs of a dozen or more layouts). I wonder how much feedback there was, last year, about the suitability of the items given out for the scratch built challenge.

 

For me, the major negative of the competition is the expectation of multiple "animations" on each layout and rather "over the top" ones at that (a volcano in the British Isles? Be serious). My personal perspective is that animations on a layout should be like salt&pepper, CGI and swearing - used sparingly to help showcase everything else and not used just for the sake of it, But aside from my personal preference, I think that emphasising the animations is doing the non-railway modeller viewer a diservice: how many non-railway modellers will - after watching this programme - go to a model railway exhibition and be disappointed by the dearth of flying saucers, erupting volcanos, animated Daleks and the like? Surely the programme should highlight the middle ground between the finescale 4mm replica run to a prototypical timetable and the all singing, all dancing, exploding toy train set?

 

I know that C5 needs viewing figures (and - to paraphrase PT Barnum - Nobody ever lost a pound by underestimating the taste of the British public), but surely - with the success of things like the Slow TV movement - GMRC could be a little more challenging and informative in its presentation? Still, it is compulsive viewing and thanks to the miracle of digital audiovisual technology I can fast foreward through the filler shots and talking heads to the modelling (and there is some great modelling being done).

 

Again, well done teams: you are far braver than I would ever be!

 

iD

 

As part of Corby team, I did suggest steel making as nod to Corby’s steel making past.  There would be a Ironstone working, coal being brought in, steel making and I even undertook a trip to Tata steel works at Corby to get information and how the process worked.

 

We were hamstrung with the constant layout and rule changes (we nearly had a mutiny), so it was felt that we didn’t have time at Fawley to construct the suitable structures in the time given as most couldn’t be done as pre-builds, so we decided to go with the visually easier option as the volcano and landslide could be built into the scenery prior to filming starting.

 

As to the scratch build challenge, I’ve no idea who dreamt it up but to use rather bizarre items as props defies logic.  When we were at Fawley, there was a rumour that one of the items was a flip flop!!!

Edited September 17, 2019 by jools1959

[iL Dottore]

11 minutes ago, jools1959 said:

 

....We were hamstrung with the constant layout and rule changes (nearly had a mutiny), so it was felt that we didn’t have time at Fawley to construct the suitable structures in the time given as most couldn’t be done as pre-builds, so we decided to go with the visually easier option as the volcano and landslide could be built into the scenery prior to filming starting....

Thanks for clarifying why a volcano appeared in the British Isles.... But your comment about constant layout and rule changes intrigues me. Layout and rule changes on the instigation of whom? To my mind it has a whiff of some producer or director type - with no knowledge of (interest in?) railway modelling - "needing" to inject "more drama" or "more excitement" into the programme (but I could be wrong...). Could this be a "jumping the shark" moment for GMRC?

[TravisM]

2 minutes ago, iL Dottore said:

Thanks for clarifying why a volcano appeared in the British Isles.... But your comment about constant layout and rule changes intrigues me. Layout and rule changes on the instigation of whom? To my mind it has a whiff of some producer or director type - with no knowledge of (interest in?) railway modelling - "needing" to inject "more drama" or "more excitement" into the programme (but I could be wrong...). Could this be a "jumping the shark" moment for GMRC?

 

We had layout changes from what we believe the judges and rules changes from the production company.

[Pacific231G]

3 hours ago, RedgateModels said:

  

4 hours ago, Neil said:

 

A well reasoned point but one effect of the series may be that animated features become more commonplace on exhibition layouts. A number (an increasing number?) have moving road vehicles, lighting effects, loading and unloading animations. Earlier this year I spent an enjoyable day at Miniatur Wunderland in Hamburg which is stuffed full of animated features not seen on the average model railway. While animation isn't something I would want to build into my own layouts I can see the attraction for others.

 

and there's me looking to pick up an old Hornby operating conveyor for my new layout  ........

OOh, and can we also have a giraffe that ducks for tunnels, a misslle launcher, a helicopter that takes off from a flat car, a timber wagon that dumps its load of logs into a bin, a building on fire with firefighters squirting real water at it, a wagon with springs that makes it explodes if you shunt it too hard,  and maybe even a  TPO with a working mail exchange apparatus (though that's maybe not so exciiting)*

I keep telling Pendon that's the sort of thing they need to attract more visitors but they just won't have it, I can't think why not.

Should we perhaps ask Stern Steve Flint to re-introduce the Living Lineside to RM (I used to enjoy those cartoons by "Dax"- does anyone know who he or she was?) 

 

*To be fair, the automaton clock (as seen on many a European town hall) goes back a lot further than railways so perhaps that's the tradition that displays like Miniatur Wunderland trace their heritage to.  You might even say that railway modelling as a whole is just a derivative of automata.

 

[RedgateModels]

1 minute ago, Pacific231G said:

OOh, and can we also have a giraffe that ducks for tunnels, a misslle launcher, a helicopter that takes off from a flat car, a timber wagon that dumps its load of logs into a bin, a building on fire with firefighters squirting real water at it, a wagon with springs that makes it explodes if you shunt it too hard,  and maybe even a  TPO with a working mail exchange apparatus (though that's maybe not so exciiting)*

I keep telling Pendon that's the sort of thing they need to attract more visitors but they just won't have it, I can't think why not.

Should we perhaps ask Stern Steve Flint to re-introduce the Living Lineside to RM (I used to enjoy those cartoons by "Dax"- does anyone know who he or she was?) 

 

*To be fair, the automaton clock (as seen on many a European town hall) goes back a lot further than railways so perhaps that's the tradition that displays like Miniatur Wunderland trace their heritage to.  You might even say that railway modelling as a whole is just a derivative of automata.

 

 

I do have an old Triang plane launching car, not sure it will get round the tight curves of RPG though ......

[noiseboy72]

12 minutes ago, jools1959 said:

 

We had layout changes from what we believe the judges and rules changes from the production company.

That's interesting.

We didn't have anything like that - but we were in a later heat.

 

The board sizes and "The Rules"  didn't change and once we had submitted out plan, it was approved within a few hours and we were left to get on with it. Was it a case that they didn't like your design, or was it rule changes / clarification for everyone in your heat?

[jcm@gwr]

15 minutes ago, RedgateModels said:

 

I do have an old Triang plane launching car, not sure it will get round the tight curves of RPG though ......

 

You had a Rocket Propelled Grenade! WOW!

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, jools1959 said:

 

I think he changed his name by deed poll.  I do know his real name but I don’t think he’d thank me for revealing it.

Lord Lucan?

[Ian Morgan]

I believe there was a problem with supply of enough baseboards from the original supplier. A second source was required at short notice, and only off-the-shelf sizes were available. So, instead of three 5 foot by 3 foot 3 inch boards, some teams suddenly had two 5x4 boards and a 5x2.

 

 

[D9001]

I am glad that some folk are enjoying this programme and if you are, good on you and good on the presenters and producers.

 

But to me this programme isn’t about model railways at all, it’s about gimmicky, and frankly ridiculous, animations such as volcanoes made from old clothing. The actual model railways seem secondary to the silly animations and, as with series 1, i have watched one programme but won’t be watching any more.

 

I certainly would watch a programme which was genuinely about model railways; the programme about Hornby earlier this year was very watchable. 

 

But, as I say, if you like it, great. 

[TravisM]

1 hour ago, noiseboy72 said:

That's interesting.

We didn't have anything like that - but we were in a later heat.

 

The board sizes and "The Rules"  didn't change and once we had submitted out plan, it was approved within a few hours and we were left to get on with it. Was it a case that they didn't like your design, or was it rule changes / clarification for everyone in your heat?

 

As I still the emails, I’ve just gone through the rules that Knickerbockerglory sent us and there were three changes, one set of changes were done on behest of the judges.  I had assumed that the same applied to everyone.  Our plan was approved quickly but Knickerbockerglory kept asking for clarification of the plan, what went were, etc.  I think I replied to the same question at least three times, to three different people on more than one occasion.

[TravisM]

1 hour ago, Ian Morgan said:

I believe there was a problem with supply of enough baseboards from the original supplier. A second source was required at short notice, and only off-the-shelf sizes were available. So, instead of three 5 foot by 3 foot 3 inch boards, some teams suddenly had two 5x4 boards and a 5x2.

 

 

 

There was a issue with the supply of baseboards and we were given baseboards supplied by White Rose which were awesome, but unfortunately odd sizes to get the correct footprint.

[Torper]

On 16/09/2019 at 13:38, Phil Parker said:

 

For a start, everyone knew what they were getting in to - the novices can't have been surprised that there were experienced railway modellers in the competition. There were last year. They still chose to take part and did a creditable job.

 

How would you define a "non-novice" anyway? Someone who has built a couple of exhibition layouts might count as experienced, but of they were RTR on settrack, would your handicapping system need to help them against someone who has built 2 P4 layouts? It's a can of worms and something the production team won't have wanted to get in to .

 

I'd also suggest that imagination, innovation and solid time-management are as important in this competition as pure model railway skills. You might be able to apply the correct number of rivets to a smokebox and solder lamp irons in place in one go, but these aren't the skills that look good on telly. Being able to build a working earthquake, that's what's needed. That and being able to make the trains work properly, but then if you saw the last series, you'll know how important that is.

 

(Don't forget my programme synopsis: https://www.world-of-railways.co.uk/brm/reviews/others/the-great-model-railway-challenge-series-1-heat-1-the-restless-earth)

 

I don't understand the relevance of your first point. The rookies did not seem disappointed or surprised - I'm sure they enjoyed themselves.  They were a very personable lot.

 

A non novice?  How about a team from a model railway club?  Was it really reasonable to expect a team four of whose members had no model railwy experience at all and the fifth was a novice, to match the others in railway modelling expertise?

 

Imagination, etc - I thought The Train Set's earthquake was the best there (once it worked), as was their volcano, and their seaside diorama was actually first class,  perhaps the best bit of modelling there though it wasn't railway related as such.  I still say that if they were penalised because their railway work wasn't as good or extensive as a team from a model railway club, that is only to be expected and so what really is the point?  Except of course that it makes good telly - evryone likes an underdog.  But maybe I'm just taking it too seriously.

 

DT