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What would be the right chimney for a Bulldog? I have a K's model which I'm butchering to join with a Bachmann Earl chassis but the chimney on that looks a bit too stubby to meIMG_20190829_173558.jpg.6269baea7028bb3c1eba641fb25f914f.jpg

 

What would be an appropriate replacement from say Alan Gibson or 247 Development, no sepcific chimney for a Bulldog is listed? A 43xx one perhaps?

 

More on this little project soon.

 

Cheers

 

Jon

 

 

Edited by The Great Bear
Title changed to include making of the model
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10 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

Bulldogs shared the same chimney (give or take a capuchon) with several other classes. Suggest Brassmasters might have a 2251/61xx chimney.

 

 

Thank you, Russ. That drawing may prove useful, if I can fix my 3d printer, printing a new boiler to mount on the Bachmann chassis is an alternative to butchering the K's boiler. To that end, you wouldn't happen to have or be able to point me in direction of drawings for safety valve bonnets ideally with topfeed?

 

Cheers

 

Jon

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Short safety valve drawing

 

I haven't found a good drawing of a tall one yet. This one, from the talented pen of the late Peter Rich, is close, but the radii positions for the top underside aren't correct. Note that no part of the sides is actually straight - the middle section is a very large radius.

 

tall-safety-valve-cover.png.eb070e3fdd2d32abc51784ad0722785e.png

 

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8 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

Short safety valve drawing

 

I haven't found a good drawing of a tall one yet. This one, from the talented pen of the late Peter Rich, is close, but the radii positions for the top underside aren't correct. Note that no part of the sides is actually straight - the middle section is a very large radius.

 

tall-safety-valve-cover.png.eb070e3fdd2d32abc51784ad0722785e.png

 

 

Thanks again, Russ. A few Bulldogs look to have had the short cover, but most something taller (how many different heights were there?). The medium height casting I got from 247 looked about right pity I glued it in wrong place and mangled it removing it. Duh!

 

But I'm sure I can concoct something based on  the one linked to and photos. Would be a test of my fusion 360 skills!

 

Cheers

 

Jon

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14 minutes ago, The Great Bear said:

(how many different heights were there?)

 

AFAIK, there were only two official heights - short and tall.

 

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33 minutes ago, Miss Prism said:

 

I had assumed Jon was referring to the parallel chimney - the cast tapered one is in:

http://www.greatwestern.org.uk/drawings/loco/chimney.jpg

 

 

 

45 minutes ago, JimC said:

There was more than one chimney, just to complicate things...

 

Thanks, chaps. Good to know my eyes weren't deceiving me as looking at photos I thought I saw one that looked taller, though if I am looking right at that drawing the tapered one isn't taller, just thinner. (Second row down, second from left?)

 

I just need to pin down which Bulldog I want to model. As my layout is post war the selection to pick from is more limited. To help  I've now got a good selection of photos, both from GWRJ Bulldog articles, the David Maidment book and this photo archive site

Edited by The Great Bear

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1 hour ago, Coach bogie said:

I have just finished mine. One consideration is moving the safety valve back as K's position it forward based on early builds. With the topfeed the safety valve is set nearer the firebox.

 

Mike Wiltshire

 

 

Very nice, Mike and a lot neater than I am going to manage! The joint between the boiler and chassis is the tricky bit I'm realising and more of that is exposed with the Earl chassis with no sandboxes infront of the spashers. Plus I managed to hack away a bit too much so have then had to put filler back on to the K's boiler. Adding the the bump on the smokebox side (what is it) and the front of the cab (it that the reverser) I had also realised need to be done.

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2 hours ago, The Great Bear said:

Very nice, Mike and a lot neater than I am going to manage! The joint between the boiler and chassis is the tricky bit I'm realising and more of that is exposed with the Earl chassis with no sandboxes infront of the spashers. Plus I managed to hack away a bit too much so have then had to put filler back on to the K's boiler. Adding the the bump on the smokebox side (what is it) and the front of the cab (it that the reverser) I had also realised need to be done.

If you make to a particular engine, many Bulldogs had sandboxes on he running plate. The smoke fitting, is a cover for lubricating pipes, I believe. I crawled inside 6000 smokebox whilst it was in Swindon works in the 1980's and there were copper pipes going into the fitting. Mine is a bit big. I have made another and have not got around to replacing it. It is the same with buffers and chimneys. Different ones were used. I too, took away to much boiler trying to fit it over the motor mount. No worries, the nameplate hides the gap!

 

Here is one with footplate sandboxes, tall thin chimney, front heating pipe with coupling hook on opposite side. I have made several Bulldogs now and no two are the same. I built a complete K's alongside this one and fitted it with Westinghouse pump to hide damage to the firebox.

 

Lots you can do

 

Mike Wiltshire

Somerton002.jpg.d0a55dd7604d404755ce233c1c42ecc9.jpg

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Moving back to the modelling, a couple of photos I thought might help show the donor loco and how it comes apart. I should have taken these before taking it apart, so there's a bit of a mess here and there.

 

The donor Bachmann Earl. In this case on in BR livery which I found on Ebay for a reasonable price.

p3627002899-5.jpg

Taking the body off is a cinch, one screw on the underside  of the chassis that goes into the smokebox saddle. (Just need to remember where I put it along with the one for bogie!)

 

Having taken off the cab and backhead of boiler, leaves the chassis

p3627002896-5.jpg

One thing to note, is that the Bachmann Earl chassis does not have sandboxes above the running plate - as mentioned by Coach Bogie above many Bulldogs had these, as shown in the photo in his post.

 

If present, those ahead of the leading driving wheels would be useful in covering up the opening in the underside of the boiler which needs to be enlarge to fit the Bachmann motor, along with nameplate. I am going with a loco without these sandboxes.

 

 

Edited by The Great Bear
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In hacking around the K's boiler to make hole big enough to fit the Bachmann motor, I've manged to make a right mess of the boiler from that shown in the fist post.

 

p3627002900-5.jpg

 

p3627002901-5.jpg

 

One thing I've only just appreciated, is that the Earl cab is noticeably longer, because of the smaller boiler from the Duke, should have grasped that earlier, which means that as shown the smokebox is too far forward. So the whitemetal boiler in the photo above would need to be shortened and the cut outs in the bottom of the firebox for the splashers changed to suit. It could be done, but I doubt now I'd get something half decent.

 

So, having finally fixed my 3d printer, I'm trying plan B - as alluded to in the first post, print a new standard 2 boiler. Having done that a new shorter cab could be done too. More on this in the coming days.

 

Thanks for the help and information so far.

 

Jon

 

 

 

Edited by The Great Bear
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The Bachmann chassis has fluted rods and a deepframe bogie, so you'll need to find a Bulldog with those attributes. (Not a problem.)

 

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On 29/09/2019 at 23:03, The Great Bear said:

One thing I've only just appreciated, is that the Earl cab is noticeably longer, because of the smaller boiler from the Duke, should have grasped that earlier, which means that as shown the smokebox is too far forward. So the whitemetal boiler in the photo above would need to be shortened and the cut outs in the bottom of the firebox for the splashers changed to suit. It could be done, but I doubt now I'd get something half decent.

 

So, having finally fixed my 3d printer, I'm trying plan B - as alluded to in the first post, print a new standard 2 boiler. Having done that a new shorter cab could be done too. More on this in the coming days.

 

Thanks for the help and information so far.

 

Jon

 

 

 

Mine uses the Bachmann cab. I just cut it back from the tender end. I opened out the cutout for the spring/splasher, slightly and it slides back and forth over the splashers. There is enough on the springs to allow it to be moved back.

 

Mike Wiltshire

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These are excellent conversions.

 

The use of the Bachmann model as a basis for a Bulldog is something that has long commended itself to me.  It would not only provide a mechanically reliable chassis, but also a pairing with a 3,500 gal. tender, typical of the Class by the mid-thirties, rather than the smaller tender supplied with the K's kit.

 

The way the body components on the Bachmann model break down also seems to favour conversion.

 

In the past I have tried to get 3-D print and resin body producers interested in replacement body parts, and have contacted the NuCast Partners concerning availability of the body castings.  No luck so far, but I might renew my efforts, inspired by what Great bear and Coach Bogie have done.

 

I wonder if it would be practical to design 3-D print parts to extend the frames to the deeper Bird series?   

 

 

Edited by Edwardian
spelling!
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So here's where I am currently at with a 3d printed body

 

p3638593789-5.jpg

 

p3638593788-5.jpg

 

As can be seen I'm still tweaking things to get the body to fit properly on the Bachmann chassis. At the moment it is sitting a couple of millimetres too far forward. Back to the shed to do a spot of filing to work out what bit is fouling what; I suspect the details with the Bachmann cab that are fixed to the chassis...

 

The print quality isn't great as shown, that I'll look at when the dimensions of the model and fit are right. Nor have I tried to optimise support locations or file them off neatly if at all, the three pimples on the firebox being a case in point. As it stands it's been printed at 100 micron layer thickness for speed, my printer can do finer and playing around with the orientation of the model when printed should help reduce banding and stepping the photos cruely show. I'm not sure the front portion of the boiler has prined quite right looking at the underside.

 

Dimensions of the boiler I got from Jim Champ's website (hopefully interpreted them correctly!) a couple of detail drawings of cab and firebox in GWRJ 26 and if all else fails the weight diagrams on sites and in Russell. If something is leaping out at more informed eyes looking at this as being wrong do let me know.

 

I've also now realised somewhere along the line I've managed to snap off the leaf springs on the right hand side rear driver... oops.

 

Jon

 

 

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The screw reverser in the Bachmann cab was what was pushing the cab forward, so removing that (and filing down in due course) solves that.

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Can I ask a couple more questions (for my education!):

Some locos have a box on the cab front above the firebox looks like linked to the whistles - see picture of Kingfisher here - what is this?

What are the 4 "horns" on the corners of the firebox

Locos seem to have random patterns of rivets on the cab sides, these are just ad-hoc repairs?

 

Getting there with the prints, just making some final tweaks to match chosen loco.

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