Imaginary Locomotives

[sir douglas]

the 2ft locos in WW1 had them as well, though it caused problems when taking from shell craters, mud would get in and build up in the balance pipes between the tanks causing the loco to be off balance and fall over on rough track

[DK123GWR]

This post is not about the SSR (though if one were needed, there is no doubt that Lundy would have played a crucial role in providing it).

 

For context, the island of Lundy is much larger in my reality than in this one (the name is by far the greatest similarity). It has developed its own rail network slightly larger than Sodor's (though the places it serves are often larger or of greater importance than those on Sodor). Its legal status is similar to a Crown Dependency, and as a result it was exempt from nationalisation under BR (though the railways have been owned by the island's government since 1923). Its initial plan for modernisation looked something like Riddles' but unlike on BR it was kept to (electrification was considered cost effective due to the very heavy freight traffic from the west of the island to the east and to Britain, which uses a route similar to the South Devon Banks). The use of diesels on Lundy is minimised, as the skills to repair them in the event of a failure do not exist.

This creates some interesting posibilities for trains to London and cross-country services to the North. One of my suggestions is the development of an HST B unit (above). This would connect to a flat fronted driving coach (to control the electric loco on the eastbound journey), then the rest of the coaches, then a pointy driving coach on the end (to control the diesels when heading west). There may be an additional flat-fronted driving coach inserted at some point along the train, allowing it to divide if necessary. The trains would work pointy driving coach first from their start point towards Lundy. At the first stop on the island, a Bournemouth-style operation would occur, with the diesels uncoupled and an electric attatched, the diesels waiting to take the next eastbound train.

 

Of course, this would probably require significant modification the the HST's multiple working system and a new variation of Mk3 coaching stock. It would also have been developed before Polmont, and the associated nervousness around high-speed push-pull trains.

 

One thing I'm unsure of is how to put it into TOPS. Firstly, is it one locomotive or two? Given the trouble that occurred when HSTs were considered MUs, I would suggest two separate locomotives would be better. The second is whether the B unit (or the whole lot, if it were classed as a single loco) should be a sub-class of class 43 or a new class entirely (42 had fallen out of use by this point, and all the other warship TOPS classifications were re-used for HST vehicles (41 for the prototype, 43 for the production series).

 

I can't think of a time and place on the real network when these would have been useful. Perhaps the most plausible situation that would create a need for them (certainly more plausible than the situation for which they were imagined) is that London-Bristol had been electrified in the 1980s, where they might have been useful for trains continuing beyond Bristol.

[Johnson044]

On 20/07/2021 at 09:13, PhilJ W said:

Its your layout so you can run what you like. The complete opposite is 'rivet counter'.

They are not mutually exclusive! I'm my own CME- my freelance locomotives have EXACTLY the right number of rivets!

[Corbs]

Not related to any recent post but..... Streamlined Hudson Garratt? Yes please!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WcatOMaVW0

[tythatguy1312]

23 minutes ago, Corbs said:

Not related to any recent post but..... Streamlined Hudson Garratt? Yes please!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WcatOMaVW0

this would've probably worked very well for the heaviest passenger trains, imagine if the PRR built that instead of the T1

[ScottishRailFanatic]

I can imagine that if my Extended WW2 situation were to take place we could also take some other liberties. My thoughts are that, if Gresley never had that fatal heart attack or was replaced by Peppercorn rather than Thompson, then the CMEs of the Big Four would end up working alongside Robert Riddles to produce some extremely effective collaborated locomotives.

[John Besley]

11 hours ago, Corbs said:

If one looks at how the USATC and ROD operated in Europe during the wars, a no-fuel-oil, no-electricity situation could make use of an SSR even without infrastructure, providing collieries were still available.
In a crisis, one might imagine large coal dumps being organised at required locations, and deployment of water 'gins' as used in Australia and elsewhere to support long distance running. Perhaps even steam powered water pumps to plug into mains supplies, reservoirs or rivers in lieu of water cranes etc.

I remember reading in Railway World during the oil crisis of the early 1970's there was a hair brained scheme to save on the limited deisel fuel by requesting all preserved steam locos and those at Barry where used on the mainline, this would have meant putting all the ex Barry ones through Swindon works for a heavy general.... nice thought and for a 13 year old wishful thinking

Edited July 21, 2021 by John Besley
Correction

[PhilJ W]

Wasn't the April edition by any chance?

[Mr Jorrox]

12 hours ago, John Besley said:

I remember reading in Railway World during the oil crisis of the early 1970's there was a hair brained scheme to save ...

Hare brained schemes are the stock in trade of bureaucrats and the politicians who serve them.

[Johnson044]

What I've found to be enjoyable has been to generate a freelance locomotive from whatever scrapbox material accumulates- or from bits that are cheap and useful - from ebay or thrown at me by friends. I've tried to stick to some degree of plausibility if I can but inevitably push boundaries sometimes. The loco below (not painted by me I hasten to add, but the lovely livery was applied by Bob Fridd of Canterbury) I built from some very cheap bits in a box in a model shop in Rochester - Terrier coupling rods and some very early Slaters 3'7" drivers. Mainly brass but with a plastikard tank and the chimney from the Minicraft Vulcan 2-4-0T kit. Runs quite well but very noisy- she's got a small can motor vertically in the firebox and a home-made reduction gearbox. The detail parts mainly from Laurie Griffin (actually Shedmaster now I come to think of it- it was that long ago!). I know that long boiler types generally should have a strongly asymmetrical wheelbase and this is an equal 6' but there are French prototypes... All hopefully rather Boulton's Siding in aspect. She was fun to build.

 

The sketches I made years ago - the very tiny mogul intended as a possible use for the 0-6-0ST's drivers and coupling rods - and the "Non Terrier" with outside frames would have had Tri-ang Lord of the Isles drivers.

[sir douglas]

beautiful victoriana

[Johnson044]

Thanks Sir Douglas. I might pursue the Non-Terrier (or even Antiterrier?) one day.

[rodent279]

2 hours ago, Johnson044 said:

What I've found to be enjoyable has been to generate a freelance locomotive from whatever scrapbox material accumulates- or from bits that are cheap and useful - from ebay or thrown at me by friends. I've tried to stick to some degree of plausibility if I can but inevitably push boundaries sometimes. The loco below (not painted by me I hasten to add, but the lovely livery was applied by Bob Fridd of Canterbury) I built from some very cheap bits in a box in a model shop in Rochester - Terrier coupling rods and some very early Slaters 3'7" drivers. Mainly brass but with a plastikard tank and the chimney from the Minicraft Vulcan 2-4-0T kit. Runs quite well but very noisy- she's got a small can motor vertically in the firebox and a home-made reduction gearbox. The detail parts mainly from Laurie Griffin (actually Shedmaster now I come to think of it- it was that long ago!). I know that long boiler types generally should have a strongly asymmetrical wheelbase and this is an equal 6' but there are French prototypes... All hopefully rather Boulton's Siding in aspect. She was fun to build.

 

The sketches I made years ago - the very tiny mogul intended as a possible use for the 0-6-0ST's drivers and coupling rods - and the "Non Terrier" with outside frames would have had Tri-ang Lord of the Isles drivers.

The 2-6-0 is reminiscent of this Norwegian 2-6-0 on the KESR.

 

 

 

 

 

[John Besley]

22 hours ago, PhilJ W said:

Wasn't the April edition by any chance?

Good point, it also included a photo I seem to recollect of a 9f on a passenger train " undergoing trials" .... it was a long time ago now unless anyone else remembered it...

[Corbs]

7 hours ago, Johnson044 said:

What I've found to be enjoyable has been to generate a freelance locomotive from whatever scrapbox material accumulates- or from bits that are cheap and useful - from ebay or thrown at me by friends. I've tried to stick to some degree of plausibility if I can but inevitably push boundaries sometimes. The loco below (not painted by me I hasten to add, but the lovely livery was applied by Bob Fridd of Canterbury) I built from some very cheap bits in a box in a model shop in Rochester - Terrier coupling rods and some very early Slaters 3'7" drivers. Mainly brass but with a plastikard tank and the chimney from the Minicraft Vulcan 2-4-0T kit. Runs quite well but very noisy- she's got a small can motor vertically in the firebox and a home-made reduction gearbox. The detail parts mainly from Laurie Griffin (actually Shedmaster now I come to think of it- it was that long ago!). I know that long boiler types generally should have a strongly asymmetrical wheelbase and this is an equal 6' but there are French prototypes... All hopefully rather Boulton's Siding in aspect. She was fun to build.

 

The sketches I made years ago - the very tiny mogul intended as a possible use for the 0-6-0ST's drivers and coupling rods - and the "Non Terrier" with outside frames would have had Tri-ang Lord of the Isles drivers.

 

You win the thread. May as well close it now  

[PhilJ W]

48 minutes ago, John Besley said:

Good point, it also included a photo I seem to recollect of a 9f on a passenger train " undergoing trials" .... it was a long time ago now unless anyone else remembered it...

Railway Magazine are the ones for April fool's jokes. I was taken in a few years ago with an article claiming that there had been a proposal for the four Peppercorn A2's named after pre-grouping constituent companies would  receive the liveries of those companies, Great Central, Great Eastern, Great Northern and North Eastern. An A2 in Royal Blue and with a white cab roof has a certain appeal.

[Corbs]

Didn't someone do a model of those 4?

 

[PhilJ W]

There was a drawing as I recall. Perhaps Hornby could be prevailed upon to turn some out.

[Ben Alder]

6 hours ago, rodent279 said:

The 2-6-0 is reminiscent of this Norwegian 2-6-0 on the KESR.

 

 

 

 

 

Interesting pedigree for this loco - built in Glasgow and designed by Jones of the HR, IIR - I'd have to delve for details.

[rodent279]

30 minutes ago, Ben Alder said:

Interesting pedigree for this loco - built in Glasgow and designed by Jones of the HR, IIR - I'd have to delve for details.

 

Not according to the worksplate.

 

 

Unless it was rebuilt by N&H.

 

It is a neat little machine though, probably not far out of UK loading gauge, and certainly wouldn't look out of place on many branches and secondary routes.

 

Edit:- öfverhettare apparently means superheater in Norwegian. Maybe the plate only refers to the superheater?

Edited July 22, 2021 by rodent279

[PenrithBeacon]

I think there's another at Bressingham. Nice engines. 

[rodent279]

12 minutes ago, PenrithBeacon said:

I think there's another at Bressingham. Nice engines. 

Correct, according to this link.

https://norwegianlocomotivetrust.wordpress.com/the-nsb-type-21s/

 

@Ben Alder isn't far off the mark though-although this example was built in Sweden, the first batches were built by Dübs & Co in Glasgow, in the early 1900's.

 

Edited July 22, 2021 by rodent279

[Ben Alder]

18 minutes ago, rodent279 said:

Correct, according to this link.

https://norwegianlocomotivetrust.wordpress.com/the-nsb-type-21s/

 

@Ben Alder isn't far off the mark though-although this example was built in Sweden, the first batches were built by Dübs & Co in Glasgow, in the early 1900's.

 

Thanks, forgot that the later batches were built abroad.Would have made a nice little Highland loco with more restrained boiler fittings......

[Ben Alder]

A bit more on my rewheeled Clans - I took the opportunity of some spare K1 drivers popping up on ebay to do a possible more freight orientated version with 5'3" drivers - replacement for the HR Clan Goods perhaps...Also gave it a double chimney to see if it cured the Clans perceived steaming shortcomings. The slightly larger drivered    one can be seen above. Still at its put together stage, hence bits hanging loose but it has passed running trials   laude and is now ready to become a proper loco.

Edited July 23, 2021 by Ben Alder

[Ben Alder]

Another shake together from the diminishing stash - a Bachmann LMS Stanier mogul chassis with an extended GBL Black Five body to give a 2-6-2.