RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 18, 2018 My attempt at a Stanier 4-8-4. I don't think ASLEF will like me now. I used Black 5 wheels and motion to get more in the space, and the firebox and boiler have both been lengthened. Rear bogie added, 4 axle rigid tender. Not thought of a name or number yet. 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 That would look better with a Vanderbilt tender. But then I happen to think that just about every steam engine would... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 18, 2018 Yes, but I wonder how to make a vanderbilt tender that still looks like Stanier designed it? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 (edited) Here's my attempt at a Chapelon/Churchward 4-8-0... Big boiler, small driving wheels, four cylinders, four sets of Walschaerts gear. Quite different approach than the Cathedral class shown earlier. Edited January 19, 2018 by Dr Gerbil-Fritters 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Compound2632 Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 18, 2018 In terms of the general disposition of elements the 240P is not a million miles away from contemporary GWR practice. Churchward was certainly aware of and engaged with the work of Chapelon. A GWR 4-8-0 four cylinder version of a Castle/47xx mash up anyone? That's interesting. I hadn't realised Chapelon was quite so precocious: he graduated from college just the year before Churchward retired from the Great Western. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Gerbil-Fritters Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Probably mid 30s 4-8-2s would look like and late steam 4-8-4s like this It always surprises me that we built more advanced locomotives for our export market while domestic UK lines made do with archaic 0-6-0s and the like. I know loading gauge was one factor, but surely there must have been other factors effectively stagnating domestic locomotive design. I've read Swindon Apprentice by A E Durrant and the implicit suggestion was a lack of interest in innovation and a moribund promotional cycle that stifled talented young engineers. 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bloodnok Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 It always surprises me that we built more advanced locomotives for our export market while domestic UK lines made do with archaic 0-6-0s and the like. I know loading gauge was one factor, but surely there must have been other factors effectively stagnating domestic locomotive design. What you could fit on a turntable seemed to be a key factor... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 ......I've read Swindon Apprentice by A E Durrant and the implicit suggestion was a lack of interest in innovation and a moribund promotional cycle that stifled talented young engineers. Within some of the companies very obviously so. It shall be the way it has always been. Bulleid clearly wasn't too stifled though... ...It always surprises me that we built more advanced locomotives for our export market while domestic UK lines made do with archaic 0-6-0s and the like. I know loading gauge was one factor, but surely there must have been other factors effectively stagnating domestic locomotive design... There were superior ideas 'out there' where there were major problems to solve in making a whole country work, rather than protecting one's organisational position by running a thorough CYAIP programme. (I started my working life among the 'stuffies' who would not deviate from the conventional line even when the need for change was kicking them in the groin.) Just look at the coupler on that loco for a start. The UK's railways were endlessly constrained by built infrastructure and other existing investment that no one had the authority to change. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 18, 2018 (edited) Here we go, I thought of a suitable name and looked up a gap in the numbering. The Warship class? I'm not sure why my pics get squished so much. Click on it to bigify. Edited January 18, 2018 by Corbs 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satan's Goldfish Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Question (as we seem to be covering big steam engines at the moment but the tenders aren't changing much), what was the idea behind the rotating drum on the uk Garrett 'tenders'? Did that have any major capacity or help for the fireman advantage? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PhilJ W Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 18, 2018 Question (as we seem to be covering big steam engines at the moment but the tenders aren't changing much), what was the idea behind the rotating drum on the uk Garrett 'tenders'? Did that have any major capacity or help for the fireman advantage? They were angled down and forward so that as they rotated the coal moved to the front. The coal space was at least 12 feet long (I'm sure others here can give the actual measurement) which meant that the fireman would be almost constantly shovelling the coal forward. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold john new Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 18, 2018 There is a very interesting debate going on through a series of articles in the SLS Journal currently regarding the advantages (or not) of compounding and suggesting flaws in Chapelon's cost etc., advantages for compounding. I have an open mind. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 18, 2018 (edited) Might as well have a fleet of them while I'm about it... I think 'Dreadnought' is my favourite name for a battleship. Edited January 18, 2018 by Corbs 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hroth Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 If its Warships you want to name them after howabout 6321 Delphinium 6322 Jonquil 6333 Petunia All legit RN vessels......... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Yes, but I wonder how to make a vanderbilt tender that still looks like Stanier designed it? We didn't have any Vanderbilts on the main national network in the UK, did we? Makes it hard to do much other than just stick a Southern Pacific one behind a British engine... I guess their advantages weren't really that helpful for the kind of trains that we had, and for the same water capacity as a rectangular tank they'd need to be a bit longer, running into turntable trouble... They're still terrific though. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lu4472ke Posted January 18, 2018 Share Posted January 18, 2018 Maybe a full bogie tender? BR-STD-4-8-4-7.jpg and the Berkshire for comparison BR-STD-2-8-4-4.jpg I think these are my favourity iterations of these so far. Now where are those GBL 9Fs..... Talking of 9F's has anyone done photoshops of 9F tank engines? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 18, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 18, 2018 chap2.jpg A British version of this, perhaps. Getting all the elements in balance is the key, rather than just stretching existing designs to have more wheels. The 4 wheel trailing truck is designed to support a big wide firebox, not just because of the type of coal but the thermal efficiency. Then there's round top fireboxes, belpaire, compound taper, parallel, etc etc. Small wheels, large wheels, maintenance, duties, so many factors make this an interesting exercise. The least important of all of course, is what it looks like. Which is the very factor that drives most of our dooddlings! Worth reading anything by Chaplon, Durrant and Wardale before jumping into aesthetically driven designing. Here's my attempt at a 'Chapelward' 4-8-0, No. 9900 It ended up being quite similar to the Cathedral 4-8-0 but with smaller drivers, closely spaced. The boiler and firebox have both been stretched, but I repositioned the rings so hopefully it doesn't stick out too much. I've stuck with Stephenson motion on this. Then again if I'd gone with County-style splashers and a Hawksworth tender maybe it Walschaerts would be more fitting? 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LNWR18901910 Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 My attempt at a Stanier 4-8-4. I don't think ASLEF will like me now. I used Black 5 wheels and motion to get more in the space, and the firebox and boiler have both been lengthened. Rear bogie added, 4 axle rigid tender. Not thought of a name or number yet. stanier-4-8-4.jpg An excellent model! Is it worth an attempt in model form? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Johnster Posted January 19, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 19, 2018 If its Warships you want to name them after howabout 6321 Delphinium 6322 Jonquil 6333 Petunia All legit RN vessels......... 'Flower' class corvettes, for convoy escort duties and, I am told, developed from whale chasers. My father was a Merchant Navy Officer during the Second World War, and involved in North Atlantic convoys amongst other things. He claimed that the crews of these little ships were amongst the toughest and hardiest that he ever came across. The seminal film 'The Cruel Sea', based on a Nick Monserrat novel itself rooted in the author's wartime experience, is a very good account of the sort of war that these ships were involved in, a long, bitter, and largely unthanked and unchronicled one otherwise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scots region Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 (edited) Might as well have a fleet of them while I'm about it... stanier-4-8-4-4.jpg I think 'Dreadnought' is my favourite name for a battleship. Now all we need to do is smuggle it into Margate and hope no one notices Edited January 19, 2018 by scots region 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rockershovel Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 'Flower' class corvettes, for convoy escort duties and, I am told, developed from whale chasers. My father was a Merchant Navy Officer during the Second World War, and involved in North Atlantic convoys amongst other things. He claimed that the crews of these little ships were amongst the toughest and hardiest that he ever came across. The seminal film 'The Cruel Sea', based on a Nick Monserrat novel itself rooted in the author's wartime experience, is a very good account of the sort of war that these ships were involved in, a long, bitter, and largely unthanked and unchronicled one otherwise. HMS Compass Rose, IIRC? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB-AU Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 And now the Bulleid version. Cheers David 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB-AU Posted January 19, 2018 Share Posted January 19, 2018 Bulleid originally wanted the MN to be a 4-8-2, but what if he had been just a bit more ambitious? Cheers David 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 19, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 19, 2018 (edited) That would look better with a Vanderbilt tender. But then I happen to think that just about every steam engine would... Today is your lucky day Edited January 19, 2018 by Corbs 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Corbs Posted January 19, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 19, 2018 Talking of 9F's has anyone done photoshops of 9F tank engines? Today is your lucky day also. 'Ah, Mr Riddles, I've been looking for you. I say, your office does seem to be rather smokier than usual, and what's that scent?' 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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