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70s Industrial steam


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5 minutes ago, TheEngineShed said:

I've taken an interest in Brynlliw, after purchasing a Hornby Peckett.  I don't recognize the purpose of the cantilevered roof structures in the photo behind 1426.  Brynlliw Colliery landsale yard, any ideas?

 

Peckett 1426 at Brynlliw

 

I've seen them at a few other sites; I think they're there as an improvised roof to keep the coal dry, though I'd say that was a forlorn hope in Pontarddulais.

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38 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

I've seen them at a few other sites; I think they're there as an improvised roof to keep the coal dry, though I'd say that was a forlorn hope in Pontarddulais.

 

The name "Landsale" yard might suggest this is where they sold the coal to local merchants, there is a lorry parked next to one of the wagons.  Sold by weight, you wouldn't want to buy wet coal.  Even if the attempt was forlorn, it might have been a sales pitch of sorts from the NCB?  One of the videos I watched showed 1426 switching out the empties for loaded wagons.  I'd have thought internal wagons would be used for internal movements, but they were BR wagons.  Maybe by 1978, BR wasn't as concerned about how fast the NCB returned their wagons...

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1 hour ago, Fat Controller said:

I've seen them at a few other sites; I think they're there as an improvised roof to keep the coal dry, though I'd say that was a forlorn hope in Pontarddulais.

Looks like this is the landsale siding. Looks like the NUM have negotiated hard for half decent working conditions as every wagon is unloaded by hand.

It is worth remembering that before the introduction of the area bonus scheme, surface workers were paid little more than general labourers. They did however enjoy the protection of one of the strongest unions and management that generally took a benevolent approach to it's employees.

Edited by doilum
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48 minutes ago, TheEngineShed said:

 

The name "Landsale" yard might suggest this is where they sold the coal to local merchants, there is a lorry parked next to one of the wagons.  Sold by weight, you wouldn't want to buy wet coal.  Even if the attempt was forlorn, it might have been a sales pitch of sorts from the NCB?  One of the videos I watched showed 1426 switching out the empties for loaded wagons.  I'd have thought internal wagons would be used for internal movements, but they were BR wagons.  Maybe by 1978, BR wasn't as concerned about how fast the NCB returned their wagons...

It's quite possible that the land-sale coal was actually brought in from elsewhere on the coalfield, both for merchants and for concessionary coal. Anthracite (the local coal) needed an enclosed firebox, and a forced draught, if it was to burn.

 

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2 hours ago, TheEngineShed said:

I've taken an interest in Brynlliw, after purchasing a Hornby Peckett.  I don't recognize the purpose of the cantilevered roof structures in the photo behind 1426.  Brynlliw Colliery landsale yard, any ideas?

 

Peckett 1426 at Brynlliw

 

 

There was a bit of a discussion about them after I posted that picture...

 

 

 

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59 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

It's quite possible that the land-sale coal was actually brought in from elsewhere on the coalfield, both for merchants and for concessionary coal. Anthracite (the local coal) needed an enclosed firebox, and a forced draught, if it was to burn.

 

Which might explain the BR wagons. In later years miners could opt for coke or anthracite beans in order to comply with local smokeless fuel regulations. The distribution of concessionary coal was handled usually by independent contractors called coal leaders. My brother burnt the beans and mother's uncle was a leader!

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9 minutes ago, montyburns56 said:

 

There was a bit of a discussion about them after I posted that picture...

 

 

 

 

Thanks, I missed that set of posts in my initial search.  I have to agree with one of the posts, these shelters would be interesting to model, interchange with lorries instead of canal boats...

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On 09/03/2021 at 23:37, pete_mcfarlane said:

1990 at Castle Donnington power station is the normal answer, with a few fireless locos still working after that date. 

 

https://preservedbritishsteamlocomotives.com/robert-stephenson-hawthorn-works-no-7817-no-1-0-4-0st/

 

 

 

I think that trumps the fireless loco at Croda Chemicals Four Ashes which I saw in steam, a couple of times in the 1980s.

p2149032648-4.jpg

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15 hours ago, montyburns56 said:

OT picture, but as it has a lot of useful modelling detail and didn't know where else to post it....

 

T W Ward Tinsley 1985 by Gordon Egdar

 

T W Ward Tinsley

 

 

This wouldn't look out of place in the company of @Ruston's Charlie Strong Metals (and Watery Lane siding's) thread ....and vice versa !  Wonderfully atmospheric.

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On 22/03/2021 at 19:09, montyburns56 said:

OT picture, but as it has a lot of useful modelling detail and didn't know where else to post it....

 

T W Ward Tinsley 1985 by Gordon Egdar

 

T W Ward Tinsley

 

YorkshireDHorange-011.jpg.6ffd31569f9f67de9a9953bc32b1adf3.jpg

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Okay this one is cheating a bit as it's actually Dinting's Austerity 'Warrington' appearing at Transpo 73 at Salford Docks, but they are cool pictures. I've been trying to work out where they were taken and judging from the swing bridge in the background of one of them I'm guessing it was near Dock 6??

 

Trafford Park Railfreight Exhibition Hunslet 3892

 

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Somewhere near here:9C82902E-EFC1-48E2-A042-455F83917DFB.jpeg.d5313f719a900220244470b2191f0238.jpeg

I think the modern warehouse on the right of the first photo faced onto No6 dock. The older warehouses in the distance are on the Trafford side. The swing bridge is swung for ships to pass. 

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On 20/05/2021 at 19:39, montyburns56 said:

Charlie Hulme has another picture of Expo 73 on his site.

 

http://www.manlocosoc.co.uk/chulme/slide-webone-off.cgi?ch-006&53

 

And here's a pic of 84007 on the site.

 

British Rail class 84 electric locomotive 84007, ‘Expo 73’ No.6 Dock, Manchester. 1973

 

And it seems that there was even an APT-E mock up

 

Mock up of the British Rail gas turbine Experimental Advanced Pasenger Train (APT-E), "Expo 73" Manchester Docks. 1973

 

SELNEC Mock-up Picc-Vic light rail vehicle

 

SELNEC Mock-up Picc-Vic light rail vehicle, ‘Expo 73’ No.6 Dock, Manchester. 1973

 

Manchester tram 765

 

Manchester tram 765, ‘Expo 73’ No.6 Dock, Manchester. 1973

 

I think the Picc-Vic vehicle is now at the bus museum on Queens Road

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4 hours ago, Corbs said:

 

I believe that's a repurposed RAF Queen Mary trailer.

Looks like it has been modified with another axle, originally they only had one axle as aeroplanes are light but bulky things

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On 14/03/2021 at 16:53, doilum said:

Looks like this is the landsale siding. Looks like the NUM have negotiated hard for half decent working conditions as every wagon is unloaded by hand.

 

It is worth remembering that before the introduction of the area bonus scheme, surface workers were paid little more than general labourers. They did however enjoy the protection of one of the strongest unions and management that generally took a benevolent approach to it's employees.

My recollection of  Landsale Yards ( in my case, in particular, Cwm-Llantwit and 'Mount' ), was that as with BR coal yards, the wagons were unloaded by the coal merchant, not NCB (or BR) staff.

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On 14/03/2021 at 17:44, Fat Controller said:

It's quite possible that the land-sale coal was actually brought in from elsewhere on the coalfield, both for merchants and for concessionary coal. Anthracite (the local coal) needed an enclosed firebox, and a forced draught, if it was to burn.

 

 

The movement of 'concessionary' coal around South Wales, and into the area from further afield, was in the main, in the odd wagon, or maybe a pair, and often travelling in the opposite direction to the prevailing traffic flows.

.

Even allowing for almost 50 pits at the turn of the 70s, I doubt the traffic was overly remunerative for the railway......but would give an excuse to run a couple of 'fulls' - 'up the valley' in a train of empties heading back for loading.

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On 24/05/2021 at 13:51, br2975 said:

 

The movement of 'concessionary' coal around South Wales, and into the area from further afield, was in the main, in the odd wagon, or maybe a pair, and often travelling in the opposite direction to the prevailing traffic flows.

.

Even allowing for almost 50 pits at the turn of the 70s, I doubt the traffic was overly remunerative for the railway......but would give an excuse to run a couple of 'fulls' - 'up the valley' in a train of empties heading back for loading.

If I recall correctly, the concession was a ton / month for each miner. If, for some reason the local coal was unsuitable or deemed too valuable this might be a not inconsiderable tonnage for a colliery with 800 plus employees.

Another twist in the tale might result from the centralisation of coal washing plants with washed and graded " clean" coal returning up the valley to the colliery landsale.

Edited by doilum
Predictive text error
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