'Genesis' 4 & 6 wheel coaches in OO Gauge - New Announcement

[The Johnster]

I suppose it comes down to what you are prepared to accept as 'layout models', a term which assumes a pre-determined degree of compromise.  Of course, what we all want is cheap, easily sourced, completely accurate, all singing all dancing RTR with lights, opening doors and windows, full compensation and superbly applied liveries, but we will never get them.  Current RTR is very good indeed, close to as good as it is reasonable to expect from volume produced models, but prices are increasing and with them the demand for the highest possible fidelity, which will, if supplied, push prices further north.

 

I, and I suspect you as well Colin, are from a generation which considered itself lucky if an RTR item was ballpark enough to be worked up into something reasonable, and when loco kits were designed to run on RTR chassis with unflanged middle wheelsets and no detail below the running plate, or kit chassis with no detail below the running plate that we described as superdetailed because the middle wheelsets were flanged...  This led to a culture in which the Triang shorties were the standard raw material for any attempt at a panelled clerestory coach, B1 bogies an' all.  The panelling was very well and crisply moulded for the time and still is, and they respond well to a bit of working up but will never be scale models of anything.  Mine have been cut'n'shut to the correct number of compartments for Deans, and have decent buffers, interiors, and the B1 bogies converted to ersatz 8'6" Deans by having the tie bars cut out and footboards added.  I could do more, separate handrails and proper door handles, and better underframe detail, and probably eventually will, but they'll do for now.

 

They are, in other words, 'layout coaches', passable to my satisfaction at about a 3' viewing distance.  A generic coach will only ever be a layout coach, and it is interesting to see the success of the Hornby 4/6 wheelers, which will I am sure be replicated by the Hatton's products, among people who consider themselves to be fairly serious modellers and who would be insulted if you called them box openers.

 

The art of modelling as opposed to buying models is, IMHO, alive and well, but the focus has shifted away from locos and stock to scenery, infrastructure, and buildings, along with weathering and presentation.  The likes of KNP or NHY581 here produce superb models, but the trains are RTR and use tension lock couplings; very good results can be achieved (by those with more skill and ability than me) using RTR and even RTP items, but they are weathered and presented in a very different way to the impression we have of the box opener's layout, setrack and RTP platforms, foam underlay, and no paint on the sides of the rails.

 

I contend that such layouts count as 'proper' railway modelling if an attempt is made to operate them realistically on plausible track plan, even on a bare board with no scenery. 

 

The future, I reckon, will see a resurgence of 'traditional' modelling as more of us find ourselves unable to afford the even better RTR that will be along in a few years; I think we are going to be looking at around £1k for full fat locomotive and half that for a coach.  The RTR part of the hobby will revert to being the rich man's game it was a century ago in the days of Bassett Lowk, Leeds Model Co., and so on, and the rest of us will soldier on like we did in the 60s and 70s with kits and 3D printed parts; the fidelity will be in the kit design and 3D programming of the printer.

 

But I'll long be a'mouldering in my grave by then.  I returned to the hobby in 2016 and made a concerted effort to buy my RTR locos and stock before the prices got beyond me, a policy that has paid off big time already.  I'm a poor pensioner (cue tragic violins) and will have to use kits or scratch aids to build any items I want in future, which is not that cheap but at least the cost can be spread; chassis kit, followed by axles and gearbox, followed by wheels and pickups, followed by motor.  In other words, my focus now will be on building such items before my eyesight and hand-eye co-ordination deteriorate to an extent that prevents me doing so.  A program of kit built coaches is now complete, and one or two locos are on the wishlist, a Collet 31xx, which can be made with a Comet large prairie chassis kit and a hybrid kit-bashed/scratchbuilt large prairie body with a cut down running plate and a no.4 boiler from perhaps a Kitmaster CoT or an old Mainline 43xx.  The cab and roof will need scratchbuilding, as it's profile and the position of the cutout is unique to this class.

 

This will be a layout loco, not a scale model.  There will also be a Southeastern chassis for an old Wills 1854 given me by Philou, and the next thing to look at will be a 44xx, kit/kitbashed/scratched in a similar way to the 31xx, and then an attempt at scratchbuilding some panelled auto trailers using RTR or 3D printed bogies (will be happy if Rue d'Etropal produces prints for Diagram J, N, or TVR gangwayed twin sets), all of which will count as 'proper modelling' and none of which will provide models as good as RTR, but will hopefully provide models that I am happy with.  A point often made by Tony Wright is that such models are one's own, in the sense of Karl Marx's concept that products are partly owned by the labour that constructed them. 

 

Looking forward to it!

[The Johnster]

On 16/08/2021 at 14:23, Colin_McLeod said:

 

Agree 100%.  This statement neatly puts into context the ever increasing demand for 100% accuracy in RTR models as an (expensive) alternative to either a bit or modelling, or a bit of flexibility in what one will accept from the manufacturer.  

Although they were. IIRC, not far off correct as GCR coaches!  Inaccurate models are still in many RTR producers' current catalogue, though most of them have their roots in older products.  Hornby do not produce a 7-plank or 16ton steel mineral with the correct wheelbase, neither do Dapol, who also still have some stuff with moulded handbrake levers, including an incorrectly dimensioned Fruit D which dates back to Hornby Dublo!  Bachmann until recently still been knocking out the incorrectly proportioned LMS sliding door van I believe they inherited from Mainline originally, and are also reluctant for some reason to do anything about the similarly incorrect and wrongly wheelbased LMS cattle wagon, which they use as a generic in all sort incorrect, but correctly applied liveries, the thinking being apparently that 'if the model is wrong to start with, nobody will mind if we put it out in LNER livery'.  There are plenty of these on dealer's shelves, so in many ways it can be regarded as a current model.

 

Hornby have not taken their opporunity to upgrade the shorties with better bogies and underframes; it is still fundamentally the 1961 model, albeit with plug in bogies making replacement easier.  Hornby are somewhat inconsistent to my view, though they try hard not to be and use Railroad as a dumping ground for models that should have been, and in some cases have, upgraded years ago.  Ex-Airfix A30 auto trailers still have their original crude underpinning and recessed windows, and a small alteration to the cab doors would enable a new hi-fi underframe for their very good 7' Collett bogies to be used for an A28.  The cost of production mean that this coach cannot be brought to market at a much lower cost than it is at present, and the difference in price between this and Hornby's full-fat recent coaches makes it look poor value for money, but they obviously sell enough of them to make it worth their while.

 

Dapol still market LMS compartment suburbans from the old Airfix range, and apparently have no plan to update them, but while they are dated in terms of underframe detail and body side thickness, they are at least in the ballpark of being the correct dimensions  In general there is still a lot of older tooling about for which there is no RTR alternative, either still in production or having been recently enough produced to be still in the retail system.  I can put up with this where the old tooling is at least reasonably close to scale and can be worked up, but many of them seem to have been made deliberately inaccurate, on the basis that it's just as hard to make an inaccurately sized model as it is to make an accurately sized one.  I can sort of understand the LMS cattle wagon, as Mainline succumbed to the temptation to use thier genric 10' chassis, and the same goes for the Hornby minerals, but what was Hornby Dublo's thinking in making the Fruit D overwidth when they could have just as easily got it right, given that they had to tool a specific chassis for it, and why oh why did Dapol repeat this mistake with Stove R years later? 

 

A poorly modelled item that is the correct size is a better propostion to my thinking than a well detailed one that is not.  I would like a rake of Dean era non-gangwayed clerestories to run as an early 1950s South Wales miner's workman's and have worked up a 2h Hornby with a cut'n'shut to provide the correct number of compartments and bring the length a little closer to scale, with interiors and better bogies and buffers, but it needs a new underframe and more work to get it to the level of 'reasonable layout model'.  And then I need another two of them to represent the Glyncorrwg workmen's. 

 

Ok, now I've got that off my chest, 60 years of frustration with RTR producers; they have improved quite a bit, but why do they persist in continuing with some of the older stuff that really is past it's sell by now?  Because it makes money of course, and it always did.

[RJS1977]

The reason the Hornby ex-Airfix autocoach continues to sell well may have something to do with the fact that last time I looked, the 'modern standards' Bachmann equivalent was wrong side of £70!

 

Of course, an autocoach is ideal for a small layout, which may well be built by someone on a low income.

[Mark Saunders]

25 minutes ago, RJS1977 said:

The reason the Hornby ex-Airfix autocoach continues to sell well may have something to do with the fact that last time I looked, the 'modern standards' Bachmann equivalent was wrong side of £70!

 

Of course, an autocoach is ideal for a small layout, which may well be built by someone on a low income.

There are those that know, those that don’t  and those that don’t care and are happy to put it on their layout and run it!

 

Many people were really impressed by it when it came out! 
 

Rather like it is acceptable to trash Lima locomotives that were a game changer in many respects of the well tooled moulds!

 

 

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, Mark Saunders said:

There are those that know, those that don’t  and those that don’t care and are happy to put it on their layout and run it!

 

Many people were really impressed by it when it came out! 
 

Rather like it is acceptable to trash Lima locomotives that were a game changer in many respects of the well tooled moulds!

 

 

We were impressed with Airfix/GMR/Mainline/Lima back in the day because they represented an overall improvement in appearance over seventies Tri-ang-Hornby and offered some previously unavailable types of coach. Not just the Auto-trailer, but the B-set and the various LMS types, too.

 

We hadn't yet come to expect millimetre-perfect scale dimensions, either, and they were no worse than everything else available at the time. 

 

Whether continuing to roll out models that are effectively forty-odd years old can be justified, other than under Railroad branding is, perhaps, more debateable.....

 

John

Edited August 25, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Butler Henderson]

3 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

The reason the Hornby ex-Airfix autocoach continues to sell well may have something to do with the fact that last time I looked, the 'modern standards' Bachmann equivalent was wrong side of £70!

But subject to some hefty discounts such as 2p under £45 at TMC for the BR Maroon one

Edited August 25, 2021 by Butler Henderson

[The Johnster]

The Bachmann A38 costs ballpark twice as much as the Hornby A30, but, fair play, it's twice as good a model; I would unhesitatingly include it in a list of RTR items to 'current standards' that are just about as good as I think it is reasonable to demand from volume manufacturers without doubling the price again...

 

Now, I accept that if you simply want an auto train on your layout and are not overfussed about scale or detail, the old Airfix A30 is not a bad punt at all either as a 2h buy or the current Hornby iteration.  It is pretty much spot on for size for the A28 and A30, and actually has features of both, but it is more like an A30 and Hornby's releases of it have used A30 numbers.  It can be worked up if you are like me, and want a better auto trailer but the Bachmann A38 is a bit too modern for your layout.  Cwmdimbath is in the Tondu valleys in the 1950s, and auto working was introduced here in 1953, and A30s in 1955 along with 1953 conversion A43 'Cyclops' and A44 intermediate (cabless) compartment trailers, available as kits from Wizard/Comet.  A38s did not appear in this area until 1961, when the only service left was the Porthcawl Branch, too late for my period.

 

This is regrettable and of course I could invoke Rule 1.  But I would contend that Bachmann picked the wrong Auto trailer to produce; a panelled one would have been more useful I reckon, like Lionheart/Dapol's 7mm Diagram N (spot on for Tondu in 1953/7).  These were in service from 1907 to 1957, a good period spread, and could have been released in at least 10 different liveries; cf the A38 which lasted from 1949 to 1965 and carried 3 liveries not counting departmental and incorrect preservation liveries.

 

Not to be, sadly, but I would be in the market for 4mm Diagram N, J, A10, A20/21 (Taff Vale gangwayed twin trailer sets) in RTR, kit, 3D print or any other form, but do not consider that my wishes are likely to be satisfied any time this century.  The other type of trailer at Tondu was the highly improbable, and therefore absolutely essential for the layout, highly interesting. and strangely painted A2 Clifton Downs compartment driving trailer W 3338, but this least likely of all models is available as a brass kit from Roxey and a very kind friend is building one for me!  The panelled trailers at Tondu are 'represented' by A31s, ancient whitemetal Keyser kits worked up; some were allox Newport Division in my period and could have appeared as Rule 1 spares for trailers undergoing overhaul, though there is no evidence at all that they ever actually did.

 

This is shameless wishlisting and drifting a bit from the topic, but there is a tenuous link in that we have been discussing the reasons we think the manufacturers have in the past and at present produced and marketed generic items, commenting on their 'acceptability' to modern modellers, so I contend this screed is more or less valid...  The reasons that I buy or wishlist models may be of interest to manufacturers, though I have no expectation that any will accede to my wishes unless they think they can make a bob or two out of it in general; they are not request stops or charities!  Dapol certainly thought the N was worth continuing with in 7mm, though, and hope springs eternal etc.

[HonestTom]

On 14/08/2021 at 15:51, JohnR said:

 

And yet the 4/6 wheelers have proved extremely popular. The Hornby ones are more problematic, yet they too have sold well. 

 

The Hornby (Triang) clerestories have filled this role for at least 50 years, and something a bit betterfor today would be really good.

I think just upgrading the clerestories would do the job for a lot of people. If they tooled up a flat roof (the roof being a separate component), I think they could really open up the possibilities for plausible liveries.

 

With modern livery printing techniques, to be honest I'm kind of surprised that they haven't taken more advantage of the tooling they have. They've produced the coaches in GWR, LMS/Midland, LNER, BR (!) and a couple of totally fictional liveries (Thomas and Railway Children), but there are a lot of pre-Grouping liveries that I think they'd look pretty good in. And the popularity of the new generic coaches demonstrates that there is a market for something that looks sort-of right.

[Compound2632]

42 minutes ago, HonestTom said:

I think just upgrading the clerestories would do the job for a lot of people. If they tooled up a flat roof (the roof being a separate component), I think they could really open up the possibilities for plausible liveries.

 

With modern livery printing techniques, to be honest I'm kind of surprised that they haven't taken more advantage of the tooling they have. They've produced the coaches in GWR, LMS/Midland, LNER, BR (!) and a couple of totally fictional liveries (Thomas and Railway Children), but there are a lot of pre-Grouping liveries that I think they'd look pretty good in. And the popularity of the new generic coaches demonstrates that there is a market for something that looks sort-of right.

 

Well, that could be Hornby's spoiler for Hattons moving on to generic late 19th century short bogie carriages. But I think that if their 4/6 wheelers are a commercial success, such models would not be a very big step as the only significant extra bit of research and design work needed would be the bogies.

[PhilJ W]

47 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Well, that could be Hornby's spoiler for Hattons moving on to generic late 19th century short bogie carriages. But I think that if their 4/6 wheelers are a commercial success, such models would not be a very big step as the only significant extra bit of research and design work needed would be the bogies.

They could also ring the changes with different types of bogie to fit in with the liveries.

[Compound2632]

14 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

They could also ring the changes with different types of bogie to fit in with the liveries.

 

Given that in many cases the panelling - a much more immediately obvious feature - doesn't match the livery, I'm not convinced there's a good argument for anything beyond generic late 19th century bogies for generic carriages - they'd at least be more appropriate than the BR Mk1 bogies fitted to the Hornby shorties. Say 8ft wheelbase, and with stepboards, much other detail hidden.

[Nick Holliday]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Given that in many cases the panelling - a much more immediately obvious feature - doesn't match the livery, I'm not convinced there's a good argument for anything beyond generic late 19th century bogies for generic carriages - they'd at least be more appropriate than the BR Mk1 bogies fitted to the Hornby shorties. Say 8ft wheelbase, and with stepboards, much other detail hidden.

Fox bogies, from the Leeds Forge, were used under a number of lines coaches, albeit with minor variations, so would be probably more generically correct, if there is such a thing, than the panelling. There are always Hornby's SR Maunsell rebuilt LSWR coaches to provide a bit more variation - only an expert can really tell Stork from Butter.

[The Johnster]

On 26/08/2021 at 10:48, HonestTom said:

They've produced the coaches in GWR, LMS/Midland, LNER, BR (!) and a couple of totally fictional liveries

Not just BR, but BR blood & custard, to go with a B12 in a train set.  I thought Triang were pretty brave to market Lord of the Isles in 1961, and the shorty clerestories were originally intended to go with that, and to be fair to Triang, who I've criticised many times over the years on the subject, their standard length for a coach at that time was 9 inches, as was Hornby Dublo's, and the underframe 'detail' was from the previous 8 inch Staniers.  The Dean coaches they purport to represent were a compartment longer.  The only bogie Triang made in those days was the BR B1, excpept for the 'Transcontinental' range, and this appeared incorrectly on the Staniers, the suburbans, the BLV, the SR emu, and the MetroCamm dmu; it also appeared on the Blue Pullmans and the loco hauled Pullmans.  Taken on it's own, this bogie was a very creditable representation of the B1, and pretty much to scale, which is more than can be claimed for Hornby Dublos.  This meant it was proportionally wrong for the 9" mk1s.  The motor bogie for the SR emu was a creditable cast metal attempt at an SR 750v power bogie though no attempt was made to model the pickup sledges, but it was also used very incorrectly on the MetroCamm and the Blue Pullman.

 

Triang were nothing if not the home of the anomaly, and the clerestories compounded their incaccuracy to run with Lord of the Isles they were turned out in a plain 1920s chocolate and cream livery.  Lord of the Isles was presented in simplified lined out version of the full Edwardian GW livery, Indian Red frames, and full lining albeit a single orange line rather that the real orange/black/orange.  This was 'normal for Triang' and featured on their BR green lined locos as well.  To run with the Dean Single in that livery, the coaches should have been finished in the fullly lined out Edwardian livery; Triang Hornby eventually produced this livery on the later Gangwayed Dean Clerestories, but on this occasion failed to represent the actual panelling!  At least they made an attempt at the 10' Dean bogie!

 

Any GW, or for that matter GE, compartment non-gangwayed clerestories that survived into BR service long enough to be painted in a BR livery would have been painted in the appropriate BR livery at the time they were repainted, so in the case of the blood & custard coaches presented in the 'Anglian' train set with a B1, they should have been in plain crimson livery, assuming there were prototypes.  I am aware that some ER coaches were painted in a plain brown livery in early BR days. 

 

On the WR, the only clerestories that survived in service were used on miners' workman's trains in South Wales, the last famously on the Glyncorrwg service between 1953 and 1958, where they succeeded the last Dean Ratio type 4 wheelers.  TTBOMK, all these coaches were painted a plain dark brown livery, as had been used on the GW for such stock for many years and not the lighter, milk chocolate colour, lined brown 1942-5 austerity coach livery.  Caerphilly Works painted some Dean 4 wheelers in BR crimson in 1949, but I believe these were used on the Senghenhydd miners' workmans, not at Glyncorrwg.

 

The only difference I am aware of between the current Hornby release of the shorty clerestories and the original Triang version is the bogies, still BR B1s but now 'plug in' types instead of the original rivetted fitting, and with current Hornby 14.1mm coach wheels.  The coach now rides at the correct height at the buffers.

[Dunsignalling]

On 26/08/2021 at 15:21, Nick Holliday said:

Fox bogies, from the Leeds Forge, were used under a number of lines coaches, albeit with minor variations, so would be probably more generically correct, if there is such a thing, than the panelling. There are always Hornby's SR Maunsell rebuilt LSWR coaches to provide a bit more variation - only an expert can really tell Stork from Butter.

And Hornby have tooled the LSWR variety of Fox bogie for their recent Gangwayed bogie Luggage Van.

 

John 

[Compound2632]

6 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

Triang were nothing if not the home of the anomaly, and the clerestories compounded their incaccuracy to run with Lord of the Isles they were turned out in a plain 1920s chocolate and cream livery.  Lord of the Isles was presented in simplified lined out version of the full Edwardian GW livery, Indian Red frames, and full lining albeit a single orange line rather that the real orange/black/orange.  This was 'normal for Triang' and featured on their BR green lined locos as well.  

 

Technological litations of the day - no printing, just hand-lining by the ladies at Margate, I believe.

 

7 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

The only difference I am aware of between the current Hornby release of the shorty clerestories and the original Triang version is the bogies, still BR B1s but now 'plug in' types instead of the original rivetted fitting, and with current Hornby 14.1mm coach wheels.  The coach now rides at the correct height at the buffers.

 

An important difference for the bodging hacker is that the original plastic was rather brittle (or at least is now) whereas the plastic used in the 80s/90s for the faux-teak examples is much more amenable to sawing and cutting.

 

4 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

And Hornby have tooled the LSWR variety of Fox bogie for their recent Gangwayed bogie Luggage Van.

 

But not with footboards - vital for that 19th century look.

[The Johnster]

Fox bogies are available as kits or cosmetic sideframes from Roxey, and the correct 8’6” Deans as 3D prints from Stafford Road Works/Shapeways.  I have several Stafford 3D bogies on my layout, and they all run very well with Hornby or Bachmann wheels. 
 

11 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

no printing, just hand-lining by the ladies at Margate, I believe.

 Fair enough.  

[Dunsignalling]

3 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

But not with footboards - vital for that 19th century look.

There are footboards on the bogie GLVs, but they appear to be a separate fitment, as is usual with Hornby's current level of coach tooling.

 

Thus it should be readily possible to fit different ones or omit them, as necessary.

 

John

[Compound2632]

5 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

There are footboards on the bogie GLVs, but they appear to be a separate fitment, as is usual with Hornby's current level of coach tooling.

 

Thus it should be readily possible to fit different ones or omit them, as necessary.

 

I beg their pardon - my ignorance. But one's unlikely to get Hornby bogies on a Hattons carriage! (Which thread are we in?)

[Dunsignalling]

22 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

I beg their pardon - my ignorance. But one's unlikely to get Hornby bogies on a Hattons carriage! (Which thread are we in?)

But the thread had also been covering the possibility of a Hornby "spoiler" (perhaps derived from their existing GWR clerestories) aimed at for any putative Hatton's generic bogie stock, as happened with the 4/6 wheelers.

 

John

 

 

[Halvarras]

55 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

 

The only difference I am aware of between the current Hornby release of the shorty clerestories and the original Triang version is the bogies, still BR B1s but now 'plug in' types instead of the original rivetted fitting, and with current Hornby 14.1mm coach wheels.  The coach now rides at the correct height at the buffers.

 

I picked up a crimson & cream brake vehicle loose an exhibition - I had no idea where it came from and had to look it up. Can't recall what purpose I had in mind for it now.......It quickly became apparent that it wasn't running properly due to zero clearance between the underframe and the top of the bogies - upclipping the bogies and inserting a metal washer cured that although it probably reset the ride height to 'Tri-ang standard'! I didn't keep it long........

At the Swindon Works Open Day on 13/9/75 I purchased a tired 'Lord of the Isles' for restoration, and shortly after three shorty clerestories, in "teak" I think, to go with it. I repainted them chocolate & cream and picked out all the beading in black..........all six sides. It was bonkers really as in the end I never got around to doing the loco!!!

[The Johnster]

You have just highlighted the major contribution that Triang shorties have made to the hobby over the last 60 years as a result of their inaccuracies; people try to make decent coaches out of them.  We cut'n'shut them, repainted them, cut the clerestories off and made Clifton Downs auto trailers, some of us try to do something about the bogies, we get upset by the crude underframe; in short (sorry), they are often a training ground during our early modelling careers in skills that prove invaluable later for 'proper' modelling.  They remain one of the best RTR evocations of panelling, and we can see the potential in them.  They have taught us much and provided us with hours of harmless fun, and, occasionally, after a lot of work, decent models.  One might argue that an accurate model would have had less influence...

 

Their day is done now IMHO, though, and a replacement to current standards, whether by Dean non-gangwayed clerestories of the correct length or a generic solution as is being discussed, is about 40 years overdue and would be very welcome!

Edited August 29, 2021 by The Johnster

[jcm@gwr]

1 hour ago, The Johnster said:

You have just highlighted the major contribution that Triang shorties have made to the hobby over the last 60 years as a result of their inaccuracies; people try to make decent coaches out of them.  We cut'n'shut them, repainted them, cut the clerestories off and made Clifton Downs auto trailers, some of us try to do something about the bogies, we get upset by the crude underframe; in short (sorry), they are often a training ground during our early modelling careers in skills that prove invaluable later for 'proper' modelling.  They remain one of the best RTR evocations of panelling, and we can see the potential in them.  They have taught us much and provided us with hours of harmless fun, and, occasionally, after a lot of work, decent models.  One might argue that an accurate model would have had less influence...

 

Their day is done now IMHO, though, and a replacement to current standards, whether by Dean non-gangwayed clerestories of the correct length or a generic solution as is being discussed, is about 40 years overdue and would be very welcome!

 

I'm afraid that, although I agree with your first paragraph, I don't think that

'Their day is done now'.

I have a number of these coaches in the process of an upgrade (cut-n-shut),

and the list of diagrams you can create (to varying levels of accuracy) is quite

big, so far, I've done the following:-

C23

C19

C10

C4

A4

E17

D3

D8

D14

D37

F12

Most of which probably won't ever feature in kit-manufacturers thoughts,

let alone RTR!

Edited August 29, 2021 by jcm@gwr

[Steamport Southport]

On 29/08/2021 at 21:51, jcm@gwr said:

 

I'm afraid that, although I agree with your first paragraph, I don't think that

'Their day is done now'.

I have a number of these coaches in the process of an upgrade (cut-n-shut),

and the list of diagrams you can create (to varying levels of accuracy) is quite

big, so far, I've done the following:-

C23

C19

C10

C4

A4

E17

D3

D8

D14

D37

F12

Most of which probably won't ever feature in kit-manufacturers thoughts,

let alone RTR!

 

C23    Trevor Charlton

C19    Blacksmith

C10    Slaters

C4      Blacksmith / Worsley

A4     Blacksmith

E17   Broad Gauge Society

D3     

D8     

D14    Slaters / Blacksmith

D37    Blacksmith / Worsley

F12     Roxey Mouldings

 

Some still available, most are pretty common on eBay (Blacksmith and Charlton). The Slaters kits are slated for reissue.

 

Worsley say on their website.

 

We produced the above kits and parts because we were asked to.

Try us for 'any' Great Western Railway coach kit in 4mm scale.

We have a large selection of artwork.

The kit "you" are looking for may be among them.

Why not ask?

 

 

Jason

[Hattons Dave]

Hi all, 

 

We have received an updated delivery schedule for the coaches from our factory and, due to the demands of the last 18 months, our dates for release have changed. We apologise for the delay with the release and we assure you that we are doing everything we can to ensure this does not change again. 

 

There is a 10-week allowance between when these will be ready at the factory and them being in stock with us. This is to allow for transport to and from the boat, shipping, customs transit and quality checking. 

 

The new release dates are as follows:

 

Delivery 1 - GWR & SECR

Ready at Factory: Saturday 15th January 2022   /   Into Stock: Monday 28th March 2022
Delivery 2 - LBSCR, GNR & LNWR

Ready at Factory: Wednesday 20th March 2022   /   Into Stock: Monday 6th June 2022

Delivery 3 - LMS, LNER, SR & Departmental

Ready at Factory: Saturday 30th April 2022   /   Into Stock: Monday 11th July 2022

 

The good news is that all of the prices are being held as they were originally announced and we have no plans to increase these at this time.

 

Batch 2 will now be available after March 2023.

 

Again, we apologise for the delay on this project and we thank you for your patience and understanding.

 

Full information is available on our site, HERE

 

Thanks,
Dave

[PeterH]

Thank goodness, the rest of the year won’t be as expensive as I had feared!