'Genesis' 4 & 6 wheel coaches in OO Gauge - New Announcement

[phil_sutters]

3 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

I think the choice for populating coaches is underscale people from the Continent or heavy metal ones from the UK aftermarket ! ........... neither option's cheap.

How cheap do you want them is £27.50 for 120 unpainted HO from Preiser too much? https://www.trainshop.co.uk/figures-animals-unpainted-oo/15141-sitting-people-120-4041032163284.html?gclid=CjwKCAjwm_P5BRAhEiwAwRzSOwN-LChCAx3JOLtiPLVSxr5TYyCcnnlgCdn6D3HfIrKH_-ZBO0oU-BoChqcQAvD_BwE

[MarkSG]

2 hours ago, Chris116 said:

I would not advise those figures as they are 1:50 according to the information even if it is marked 00 scale in the heading. 

 

Good point, you'd need to check the listings carefully! But there are plenty of alternatives, that was just the first I came across.

[phil_sutters]

17 hours ago, phil_sutters said:

How cheap do you want them is £27.50 for 120 unpainted HO from Preiser too much? https://www.trainshop.co.uk/figures-animals-unpainted-oo/15141-sitting-people-120-4041032163284.html?gclid=CjwKCAjwm_P5BRAhEiwAwRzSOwN-LChCAx3JOLtiPLVSxr5TYyCcnnlgCdn6D3HfIrKH_-ZBO0oU-BoChqcQAvD_BwE

What you could do is to use Andrew Stadden's very well sculpted Edwardian seated people in either 4mm or 3.5mm scale. You could place them nearest to the windows and fill the rest of the carriage with cheaper figures as they will just be shadowy shapes. At £1 a figure they are actually very good value in my opinion, as a satisfied customer. https://www.acstadden.co.uk/product-page/oo3-edwardian-people  There are two sets. oo4 might be better as it has smaller hats, to fit under the luggage racks! He does Victorians as well but not in seated poses.

Edited August 20, 2020 by phil_sutters

[Dunsignalling]

20 hours ago, Budgie said:

 

I'd love to populate my coaches. I remember the trains I used to travel on to and from school, fifty to sixty years ago. Eight-car trains, packed to the gunwales. I wish somebody would make commuter models to fill RTR coaches. 

TBH, you'll only notice those in window seats anyway, but I've never worked out why the makers don't produce interiors with at least some figures integrally moulded.

 

A lot cheaper and easier than trying to break into a lot of coaches without wrecking them.

 

I still haven't mastered Hornby Hawksworths…

 

John

[russ p]

sorry if this has been covered before but its a huge thread.  Is there a rough estimate to when the red tool and riding vans will be released? 

[Pre Grouping fan]

They are in batch 1 which hattons say is due Q1 2021

[Hattons Dave]

18 hours ago, russ p said:

sorry if this has been covered before but its a huge thread.  Is there a rough estimate to when the red tool and riding vans will be released? 

 

Hi Russ,

The full release schedule and latest dates for all the Genesis coaches can be found on the Hattons website via the link below.

Hattons Genesis coaches release information

We'll also put any updates on there too, as well as sending them directly to customers with pre-orders (or registered interest) and of course updating this thread as well.

Cheers,

Dave

[Hattons Dave]

Hi all,

Here's our next set of full livery artwork for the Genesis coaches. We're staying in the South for now and showcasing the South Eastern and Chatham Railway liveried vehicles that will be produced.
 

Full colour layouts for every coach can be seen on the website and pre-ordered via the link below:
 

Hattons Genesis coaches - SECR livery artwork
 

Thanks again for the feedback on the LB&SCR vehicles and let me know what you think about this latest livery.
 

Cheers,
 

Dave

 

[Pre Grouping fan]

This and the LBSCR livery sheets look great.

 

Interesting to see you've chosen the lighter colour. I expected the same Dark lake livery like the 2 coaches on the Bluebell, this features on the individual product pages. They would have matched the Birdcage coaches currently available.

 

The colour in the artwork in the artwork above is closer to the lighter colour on coach 2947 at the KESR. 

[sem34090]

As far as I'm aware the KESR shade is more accurate, and to my eye more pleasing.

[Skinnylinny]

That being said, it might be better for models to attempt to match (at least closely, if not perfectly) the Bachmann colour, which is very close (to my eye) to the Phoenix Precision colour. Lack of consistency between the Bachmann birdcages which many will already own and the Hattons Genesis carriages would put me off, were I looking for SE&CR carriages. A personal preference, maybe, but I'd prefer my models to all be the same colour, even if that colour is slightly wrong, compared to having a mix-and-match. 

Personally, I prefer the darker livery as applied at the Bluebell. 

On another note, it looks from the livery artwork as though Hattons intend to (correctly) include the scarlet red lining outside the gold. Having seen the standard of printing on the P class locos (the "South Eastern and Chatham Railways Managing Committee" text in the garter being legible was a lovely touch!) I would not be surprised at this, but there surely can't be many 4mm modellers who would consider applying that by hand!

[Hattons Dave]

Hi all,

We've chosen to produce the initial SECR shade used on its coaches, described in "Britains Railway liveries" as 'Bright lake'.

This has also been carried on some vehicles in preservation, for example 2947 at the Kent & East Sussex Railway, which was one of the many vehicles we assessed in the early stages of the project.

The darker shades (referred to as "Wellington brown" and "Maroon" in "Britains Railway liveries") were introduced later and have been replicated on models of the SECR 'Birdcage' coaches.

The earlier style was chosen as the SECR's 4 and 6 wheel coaches were an every day feature in the company's earlier days, as opposed to during/post WW1 and their replacement with bogie stock. 

Hope that helps!

Cheers,

Dave   

Edited August 20, 2020 by Hattons Dave

[Pre Grouping fan]

Thanks for that explanation. Slight shame the darker livery isn't being produced now but hopefully it can be in the future. 

[wainwright1]

1 hour ago, Hattons Dave said:

Hi all,

Here's our next set of full livery artwork for the Genesis coaches. We're staying in the South for now and showcasing the South Eastern and Chatham Railway liveried vehicles that will be produced.
 

Full colour layouts for every coach can be seen on the website and pre-ordered via the link below:
 

Hattons Genesis coaches - SECR livery artwork
 

Thanks again for the feedback on the LB&SCR vehicles and let me know what you think about this latest livery.
 

Cheers,
 

Dave

 

 

Hi Dave.

 

I like the price being quoted for the SE & CR four coach sets on the website. Can I order them at that price now ?

 

All the best

Ray

[friscopete]

Most model s need a slightly brighter colour than whats on the original or in someones so called memory  IMHO .It brings out detail that is often lost on  a darker shade and.,When i hear people banging about the 'right" colour i have a small internal giggle and an under breath" bollox".There I have said it .....he he

[Hattons Dave]

1 minute ago, wainwright1 said:

 

Hi Dave.

 

I like the price being quoted for the SE & CR four coach sets on the website. Can I order them at that price now ?

 

All the best

Ray

 

Hi Ray,

Yes, the full range of Genesis coaches are available to pre-order now at the prices quoted on the website.

Follow the links through to the product pages if you want to place your order online, or feel free to give our orders team a call on 0151 733 3655 - they're available 24/7, 7 days a week.

We don't charge you a penny for the coaches (or any pre-order) until they arrive into stock also.

Cheers,

Dave

[wainwright1]

3 minutes ago, Hattons Dave said:

 

Hi Ray,

Yes, the full range of Genesis coaches are available to pre-order now at the prices quoted on the website.

Follow the links through to the product pages if you want to place your order online, or feel free to give our orders team a call on 0151 733 3655 - they're available 24/7, 7 days a week.

We don't charge you a penny for the coaches (or any pre-order) until they arrive into stock also.

Cheers,

Dave

 

Hi Dave. 

 

Have you checked the price that you are quoting for the SE & CR four coach sets ?

 

Ray

[Pre Grouping fan]

1 minute ago, wainwright1 said:

 

Hi Dave. 

 

Have you checked the price that you are quoting for the SE & CR four coach sets ?

 

Ray

Oh yeah, on the page quoted by Dave above it says £30/36. But is correct on the product page. 

[Hattons Dave]

3 minutes ago, wainwright1 said:

 

Hi Dave. 

 

Have you checked the price that you are quoting for the SE & CR four coach sets ?

 

Ray

Hi Ray,

Thanks for highlighting this - its now amended.

Cheers,

Dave

[JeremyKarl]

39 minutes ago, Hattons Dave said:

We've chosen to produce the initial SECR shade used on its coaches, described in "Britains Railway liveries" as 'Bright lake'.

The darker shades (referred to as "Wellington brown" and "Maroon" in "Britains Railway liveries") were introduced later and have been replicated on models of the SECR 'Birdcage' coaches.

The earlier style was chosen as the SECR's 4 and 6 wheel coaches were an every day feature in the company's earlier days, as opposed to during/post WW1 and their replacement with bogie stock. 

I really like this shade ("bright lake") as I found the later colours used on the Bachmann coaches somewhat dull, especially on the unlined wellington brown coaches. 

 

[wainwright1]

58 minutes ago, Hattons Dave said:

Hi all,

We've chosen to produce the initial SECR shade used on its coaches, described in "Britains Railway liveries" as 'Bright lake'.

This has also been carried on some vehicles in preservation, for example 2947 at the Kent & East Sussex Railway, which was one of the many vehicles we assessed in the early stages of the project.

The darker shades (referred to as "Wellington brown" and "Maroon" in "Britains Railway liveries") were introduced later and have been replicated on models of the SECR 'Birdcage' coaches.

The earlier style was chosen as the SECR's 4 and 6 wheel coaches were an every day feature in the company's earlier days, as opposed to during/post WW1 and their replacement with bogie stock. 

Hope that helps!

Cheers,

Dave   

 

Hi Dave.

 

Without wishing to put my neck on the block, I am not sure about this lighter shade of livery.

I have a SE & CR layout and am a member of the South Eastern and Chatham Railway Society and have seen a lot of livery detail references over the years, but no reference to this Bright Lake.

As far as I am aware, the dark lake colour as used by Bachmann on their birdcage stock was the principal livery used on coaches from the turn of the century up until 1912/14 when a change to the dark brown 'Wellington Brown' commenced which then lasted up to the grouping in 1923. However for the first few years after the formation of the Joint Management Committee, some other livery variations were tried, including some coaches appearing in a pseudo half and half livery of dark red lower and varnished teak upper panels, but I do not think that they would have stayed that way for very long. Older South Eastern Railway vehicles would probably have carried on in their former livery for some time probably with a coat of varnish to freshen the paintwork, possibly darkening it in the process and the same with the Chatham coaches getting a fresh coat to their teak finish.

I do not have a copy of the 'Britain's Railway Liveries', so cannot comment on that, but you could consult the South Eastern and Chatham Society who I am sure would be more than pleased to advise you on their livery records.

 

Incidentally, some years ago Cherry Paints, now part of Phoenix Precision, produced a small range of railway paints including S.E.R. ones and I have a tin of their S.E.R. coach red which is as dark if not darker than the colour used by Bachmann on the S.E. & C.R. birdcage coaches, though that is without sampling and testing it. So where did they do their research ? Similarly, what did the K.E.S.R. match their colour to ?

 

I hope that this helps.

 

All the best

Ray

 

 

 

Edited August 20, 2020 by wainwright1
sent prematurely

[BlueLightning]

I agree with @wainwright1

 

Harry Wainwright referred to the first livery as "A dark purple lake" but at the moment I don't have my source for that quote so was going to keep quiet for now.

 

Hoping some of the historial facts I don't know about are more accurate than the things I do.

 

Gary

[maico]

Forgive my plonker like ignorance, but what is the bit that sticks out on the full brake CAD. Does it fold outwards for access?

Edited August 20, 2020 by maico

[mozzer models]

27 minutes ago, maico said:

Forgive my plonker like ignorance, but what is the bit that sticks out on the full brake CAD. Does it fold outwards for access?

Its a Ducket it do's not move its for the guard to see down the side of the train without sticking his head out 

[Skinnylinny]

That's a guard's lookout (also called a ducket by some companies) - usually featuring a seat on the inside, it allowed the guard to look forward and back along the train to check that all is well without risking getting slapped in the face by passing trees/telegraph poles/signals/tunnel walls. The recessed rectangle at each side is a window. 

An example can be seen on this Peco 009 carriage, on which it's proportionally bigger than the one above:


There were various forms of side lookout, some of which were just big enough for the guard's head rather than going all the way down to the floor. Other companies favoured top lookouts (so-called "birdcages" - see the Bachmann birdcage stock for an example).