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Locomotion & Rails of Sheffield announce SE&CR D Class


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All  three SE&CR versions are now here.

Having received the 2nd replacement from Locomotion Models yesterday and having received my grey version today.

 

I’m well chuffed, despite their niggles, these are lovely.

I originally ordered all three versions, I cancelled the grey version and then decided a couple of days ago I should get it.

20EEED46-AC04-40F5-B5F5-4BE265A0B297.jpeg

97C0DFD7-DC10-4A16-946F-88F8DF4AFA75.jpeg

 

44EE60B1-7A82-495C-A0C9-6A998DA322AE.jpeg

Edited by Steam here!
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22 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Where was the engine prepared for preservation? Ashford? 

 

Ashford. 1960 I believe.

 

That's why I was interested in what it was up to from the mid 1950s until being incarcerated. It was genuine interest.

 

Unrestored in May 1959 at Tweedmouth.

 

https://thetransportlibrary.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=96949

 

And in June with some other preserved locos and stock.

 

http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/t/tweedmouth/index6.shtml

 

 

Jason

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Well finally my Southern green loco has arrived in America! Shipped on 2/7 and arrived on 8/7, fasted shipping from the UK I have ever received. My first reaction was is this OO scale, it is so small compared even to my GWR Mogul, but coupled up to 6 Hornby GWR coaches it looked OK and it pulled them up a 1% grade on a curve with the traction tyres still installed. As usuall one buffer was floating in the box but the tender height matched the loco cab. Getting the smokebox door off for fitting the decoder was not easy as the door is basically a flush fit and the little tool was useless. An Xacto knife blade slid under the hinge worked though. As indicated above it is a very smooth runner with DCC installed, so now I need to replace the traction wheelset and install the various bits. I also plan to gut the electronics in the boiler and hard wire a decoder which should give me room for a little extra weight and a Keep Alive from TCS. Right now I’d give Dapol/Rails a 9.9/10 on this one.

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A question regarding the SE&CR grey version no: 726, regarding the lamp irons, there are six at the front and only four at the back.

 

Was this prototypical? It just looks odd, I could understand, four at the front and four at the back.

or six at the front and six at the back.

 

A couple of things to ask as well, when was this loco painted into SECR grey?

When was was it painted into Southern Railway livery?

 

Many thanks for your help.

 

Callum

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1 hour ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Where was the engine prepared for preservation? Ashford? 


Yes cosmetically restored at Ashford Works between 15th December 1959 and May 1960 and taken to Clapham Museum on 27th June. 

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39 minutes ago, Steam here! said:

A question regarding the SE&CR grey version no: 726, regarding the lamp irons, there are six at the front and only four at the back.

 

Was this prototypical? It just looks odd, I could understand, four at the front and four at the back.

or six at the front and six at the back.

 

A couple of things to ask as well, when was this loco painted into SECR grey?

When was was it painted into Southern Railway livery?

 

Many thanks for your help.

 

Callum


I would have expected it to have four lamp irons front and back in SECR days. 
 

I don’t have a date for 726 gaining the grey livery but would have been post 1915. 
She was painted in SR olive in October 1924.

 

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OK, fitted the driver without traction tyres and this little can hardly pull 3 Hornby coaches up a 1% grade. Good thing it will mainly be run on my flat modules. When it makes its appearance on my US Southern Rwy layout it will have to have a diesel assigned to the train to prevent stalling in the helices.

 

Now for the important question—which side was the driver on in the cab of a Southern Wainwirght? Also given the limited space it appears that the driver can be standing in front of the firebox door and the fireman standing on the tender footplate, or the driver has to be sitting to allow the fireman access to the firebox. I have a handful of Modelu drivers but they are all standing and set up for GWR right hand position. Anyone have photos of their crew installed yet?

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8 hours ago, Cofga said:

Now for the important question—which side was the driver on in the cab of a Southern Wainwirght? 

 

The side with the reverser reach rod. Well hidden Wainwright engines but in this photo the reverser can be seen mounted above the right-hand splasher.

 

9 hours ago, Cofga said:

Also given the limited space it appears that the driver can be standing in front of the firebox door and the fireman standing on the tender footplate, or the driver has to be sitting to allow the fireman access to the firebox.

 

That'll be because the splashers are too wide, to accommodate the 00 wheels. There's probably no more than 13 mm between the splashers where there should be 16 mm. Some surgery will be required on your drive to merge his nether regions into the splasher so that his upper parts are in the correct position.

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3 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

The side with the reverser reach rod. Well hidden Wainwright engines but in this photo the reverser can be seen mounted above the right-hand splasher.

Because Mr.Wainwright followed Mr.Stirling's example and used a STEAM reverser - that thing that ISN'T a Wessy pump - only the little control lever whatsit is required in the cab ....... as probably shown in the photo ( above ) that my computer 'can't reach'.

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1 hour ago, Wickham Green too said:

Because Mr.Wainwright followed Mr.Stirling's example and used a STEAM reverser - that thing that ISN'T a Wessy pump - only the little control lever whatsit is required in the cab ....... as probably shown in the photo ( above ) that my computer 'can't reach'.

 

Aha! I should have known. Hence the rather natty little reverser in the cab - no great heavy rod and gear to pull on. And I know perfectly well that the SER / SECR / SR was a vacuum line - although the LC&DR was Westinghouse - I wonder how quickly that was done away with?

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On 08/07/2021 at 20:35, Steam here! said:

A question regarding the SE&CR grey version no: 726, regarding the lamp irons, there are six at the front and only four at the back.

 

Was this prototypical? It just looks odd, I could understand, four at the front and four at the back.

or six at the front and six at the back.

 

A couple of things to ask as well, when was this loco painted into SECR grey?

When was was it painted into Southern Railway livery?

 

Many thanks for your help.

 

Callum

 

Period photos indicate that the two extra lamp irons were fitted from 1920. As for the back of the tender, it seems rather camera shy so I can't tell. Has the preserved loco got them?

That places the grey model in the early 20s, unless you remove those lamp irons to back date it to the war years.

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With the Brighton, next door, being air-braked some Wainwright locos DID have Westinghouse pumps well into B.R. days : a few C class at least - I'm not sure what else .......... but the Chatham's coaching stock was converted - or broken up - fairly quickly ( L.C.D.R. coaches exported to the Isle of Widget had to be converted back ! ).

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Yes, I was looking for the various controls but could not pick them out. I think I will just stand the driver in the middle and park the fireman on the tender footplate where he will be more visible anyway. I guess I could sever the driver’s right leg at the knee to get him closer to the correct position. Right now I wish my cab roof was removable for easier access, but alas only one buffer was loose. 

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On 08/07/2021 at 21:20, Graham_Muz said:


I would have expected it to have four lamp irons front and back in SECR days. 
 

I don’t have a date for 726 gaining the grey livery but would have been post 1915. 
She was painted in SR olive in October 1924.

 

Thanks Graham, that’s a great help. It’s given me food for thought and will certainly come in handy.

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Thanks for the info Nile, something new I’ve learnt.

It may be possible to remove the two extra lamp irons, the next task would be how to hide the holes and how to blend it all in.

 

As for the loco, there’s a high chance I will run it with the other SE&CR green locos.

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My SECR #448 arrived yesterday, well packed for its journey to the USA. Having read all the comments and watched a bunch of videos, I was pretty sure this would be a winner. 

 

I was right. 

 

Mine was flawless out of the box. No loose parts. Set her on the rails and she ran quite well. I like the "chuff" sound much better in person than I did on the Rails videos. And the two-speaker approach will (I hope) become the industry standard. 

 

Honestly, I have to put this up there with the best plastic RTR locomotive I have ever seen. And for its price point, it delivers well above expectation.

 

We can all nit pick any model (that seems to be a more common activity among modelers than actually running their trains), but I will say this: I would happily order another pre-grouping locomotive of this spec and price point.

 

I hope Dapol and Rails team up for something from the north next. 

 

Enjoy your toys, 

 

Rob

 

 

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I did some experimenting earlier on this evening regarding a haulage test using the Bachman SE&CR birdcage coaches. (A hill start at the bottom of the 2% gradient followed by 2nd radius curves).
Plus weight comparison of some 4-4-0’s and the other SE&CR related locos released just for comparison.

 

First up comparison of 4-4-0

Bachmann GWR no: 3440 “City of Truro , 295grams, max haulage capacity 9X coaches

 

Hornby L&SWR no: 120 (no traction tyres, 2021 version), 210grams, max haulage capacity  6x coaches.

 

Dapol SE&CR no: 488 (no traction tyres), 230grams, max haulage capacity 9X coaches

Bachmann SE&CR C class no: 583, 245 grams, max haulage 9X coaches.

Hornby SE&CR H class no: 308, 168grams, max 9X coaches.

Hattons SE&CR P class no: 27, 122 grams 9X coaches.

Edited by Steam here!
Missed out some detail.
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10 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Aha! I should have known. Hence the rather natty little reverser in the cab - no great heavy rod and gear to pull on. And I know perfectly well that the SER / SECR / SR was a vacuum line - although the LC&DR was Westinghouse - I wonder how quickly that was done away with?

Although the SECR was fairly quick at fitting vacuum ejectors to ex-LCDR locos, they were in no rush to remove the Westinghouse equipment, especially on the 0-4-4 tanks, where it proved useful for the later type of pull-push equipment.  For the 4-4-0 classes, the Westinghouse brake removal started around 1907, but several survived to grouping intact, although the Southern soon scrapped them.

7 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

With the Brighton, next door, being air-braked some Wainwright locos DID have Westinghouse pumps well into B.R. days : a few C class at least - I'm not sure what else .......... but the Chatham's coaching stock was converted - or broken up - fairly quickly ( L.C.D.R. coaches exported to the Isle of Widget had to be converted back ! ).

No doubt the retention of Westinghouse brakes on ex-LCDR locos reflected the need to work with LBSC coaches, the newly formed SECR not only had some 16 C Class built new with the air brakes, the R1 0-4-4 tanks built under their aegis to the LCDR design all arrived with air brakes too, as well as 16 of the new H class, and some ex-SER locos has Westinghouse brakes to deal with LBSC trains. 

The transfer of LCDR coaches to the Isle of Wight took place in 1930/1 - the Southern would have had plenty of time to remove the Westinghouse brakes if the SECR hadn't.

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