DCC starting out - I'm not a techy but so far its been worth it!

[Ron Ron Ron]

I have a load of old, spare QED 79 strand that I thought might be useful on layouts, but unfortunately it isn’t colour coded and lacks any markings to denote the separate conductors, other than the orientation of the printed QED branding etc.

 

All my other speaker wire is either 4mm or 6mm and colour coded, but is far too good and expensive to be wasted on a model layout.

 

Back on topic, the Wago connectors are very good, but do require more cutting and stripping.

Earthing connectors are also good for splitting off a number of droppers, but ideally should be enclosed in covers for isolation and to prevent shorts.

 

[WIMorrison]

Wago are superb - but they are for wire ends, unlike IDC suitcase type which go along the length of the wire 

Edited December 6, 2019 by WIMorrison
Auto correct - again!!!

[Crosland]

1 hour ago, WIMorrison said:

Did you know that the telephone system - including your FTTC broadband connection - relies on IDC connectors?

 

Yes, and a lot of high reliability electronics is built with wire-wrap. But these are built by people who know what they are doing, not a grease monkey in a back street garage who will just pick a connector he likes the colour of and use it regardless .

[Junctionmad]

I have a friend with a very large DC layout. He went dcc by just opening all his dc section switches and running in two wires from his NCE dcc system.  Layout runs very well 

 

dcc wiring can be very simple , much simpler then dc to achieve the same running freedoms. 
 

No contest really 

[Clive Mortimore]

2 hours ago, Junctionmad said:

I have a friend with a very large DC layout. He went dcc by just opening all his dc section switches and running in two wires from his NCE dcc system.  Layout runs very well 

 

dcc wiring can be very simple , much simpler then dc to achieve the same running freedoms. 
 

No contest really 

I have a large DC layout. Tonight's operating session has 30 locos to chose from and 30 DMUs of which 25 are formed into 11 trains (2 or 3 units per train). I have not included the other "layout" locos and units, let alone the non layout ones that get a run now then. With decoders coasting about a £10 each I would have to find £600. That is 4 or 5 locos. 

 

I would be looking at another £1,500 for the rest of my layout stock (still not including those that get a yearly run).  I can run 4 trains at one time, the track layout and signalling wouldn't allow for anymore. 

 

DCC would not cure operator errors, the odd derailment (normally due to an operator error) or the Royal Mail coach uncoupling itself as it comes off Windie Viaduct and passes the Doncaster Sidings. 

 

I think I will save my money to buy some new locos.

 

No contest really.  

Edited December 7, 2019 by Clive Mortimore

[Andymsa]

11 hours ago, Clive Mortimore said:

.DCC would not cure operator errors, the odd derailment (normally due to an operator error) or the Royal Mail coach uncoupling itself as it comes off Windie Viaduct and passes the Doncaster Sidings. 

 

I think I will save my money to buy some new locos

 

No contest really.  

 

I think we know your views on DCC by now, and let's not get into the DCC vDC debate. I respect that your choice is DC and your happy with that but a balanced view is what is needed. I can see the point that someone who wanted to change from DC to DCC would incure a large cost to convert a large fleet, but as I have found recently much of my old stock runs so badly compared to more recent additions and the cause of this improvement is better manufacturing methods and materials used, and this improvement would equally apply to DC or DCC

 

The cure of DCC operation errors is not strictly true, even the other day where a coupling failed on one of my trains half the train was left behind, the occupancy showed this and no issues were caused with crashes ect as it failed safe. But that said it is possible with DC to achieve this type of fail safe (balanced view).

[newbryford]

The old chestnut of converting DC to DCC...……….

 

I totally "get" the argument for those with large DC fleets and large layouts such as Clive, and Clive is happy in his world (Hi Clive!)

 

But in reality, how many of us have large loco collections but only a small layout - and therefore only run a few locos at one time.

And of those few, some are "favourites" that always get run.

Others - never run because they are unreliable etc. and stay packed away in a drawer.

 

Then convert one loco at a time, starting with the favourites.

It can still be run on DC with a DCC decoder fitted. (That fact is often overlooked by those resistant to DCC)

Then when the DCC fitted fleet reaches critical mass, throw away remove the DC controller, connect up the DC system and turn all your section switches on.

 

As for those that are never run - sell them and buy more decoders...…………...

 

Cheers,

Mick

 

 

[halsey]

I think I should report progress - layout wiring well under way …………………(see my other thread)

 

AND

 

I have successfully got a "programming" and "test running" 5ft length of track working 

 

AND 

 

I have fitted my first (Zimo) decoder on a Bachmann DCC ready "Fairburn Tank" and reprogrammed it (and 2 Jinty's) to new ID numbers to coincide with running numbers and it all works - well chuffed!!

 

Thanks for all contributors who encouraged to head me in the DCC direction

[Pete the Elaner]

1 hour ago, halsey said:

I think I should report progress - layout wiring well under way …………………(see my other thread)

Sounds like you are enjoying the hobby right now. Surely this has to be the most important thing regardless of your approach.

 

The layouts section seems to turn over very quickly. Although a new post bumps the thread to top, it can often be on page 2 after half an hour, getting lost within the many other threads.

Is the any chance you can add a link to it in your signature? That would make it easy to find.

[halsey]

1 hour ago, Pete the Elaner said:

Is the any chance you can add a link to it in your signature? That would make it easy to find.

 

Happy to try if someone can tell me how??

 

otherwise I think you can get at it by going to my profile?

[Pete the Elaner]

31 minutes ago, halsey said:

 

Happy to try if someone can tell me how??

 

otherwise I think you can get at it by going to my profile?

I can see your activity but can't see any sign of you visiting your layout thread recently, so I can't find it there.

 

To add a link to your layout:

Firstly you will need to find your layout thread & get a link for it. I did this by right-clicking on the "Posted xx minutes ago" bit then copying the link address.

Click on your name in the top right. You should see a drop-down list. Choose Profile.

A little under here, you should see Edit Profile.

I can see you have got this far because you had already added your location. 

Underneath your location, you should see a box labelled Interests. This is where I have put the footing message for my posts.

[dhjgreen]

Here

 

[halsey]

52 minutes ago, Pete the Elaner said:

I can see your activity but can't see any sign of you visiting your layout thread recently, so I can't find it there.

 

To add a link to your layout:

Firstly you will need to find your layout thread & get a link for it. I did this by right-clicking on the "Posted xx minutes ago" bit then copying the link address.

Click on your name in the top right. You should see a drop-down list. Choose Profile.

A little under here, you should see Edit Profile.

I can see you have got this far because you had already added your location. 

Underneath your location, you should see a box labelled Interests. This is where I have put the footing message for my posts.

 

as you can see I have tried but failed to get it to display as a link in http format

[halsey]

4 hours ago, halsey said:

I think I should report progress - layout wiring well under way …………………(see my other thread)

 

AND

 

I have successfully got a "programming" and "test running" 5ft length of track working 

 

AND 

 

I have fitted my first (Zimo) decoder on a Bachmann DCC ready "Fairburn Tank" and reprogrammed it (and 2 Jinty's) to new ID numbers to coincide with running numbers and it all works - well chuffed!!

 

Thanks for all contributors who encouraged to head me in the DCC direction

 

I spoke too soon - just fitted a couple more with complete success then tried a Zimo 21 pin direct fit decoder and the loco wont run (the lights are on) and the prodigy wont recognize/identify the chip and with 21 pins am I not right in saying that it cant be the wrong way round

[Harlequin]

3 minutes ago, halsey said:

 

I spoke too soon - just fitted a couple more with complete success then tried a Zimo 21 pin direct fit decoder and the loco wont run (the lights are on) and the prodigy wont recognize/identify the chip and with 21 pins am I not right in saying that it cant be the wrong way round

You might have misaligned the socket and the pins, I.e. the socket is one pin too far to the left or right. I did the same thing once and it was very confusing for a while!

[newbryford]

11 minutes ago, halsey said:

 

as you can see I have tried but failed to get it to display as a link in http format

 

You've got the http link - copy it to your browser.

In your sig - type in "My layout" or whatever you want to call it.

 

Highlight the "my layout" bit and then use the link icon (looks like a piece of chain) and paste the http link there.

 

(Or at least I remember that's how it's done.)

[halsey]

2 hours ago, newbryford said:

 

You've got the http link - copy it to your browser.

In your sig - type in "My layout" or whatever you want to call it.

 

Highlight the "my layout" bit and then use the link icon (looks like a piece of chain) and paste the http link there.

 

(Or at least I remember that's how it's done.)

 

I think I've managed it at last!

[halsey]

2 hours ago, Harlequin said:

You might have misaligned the socket and the pins, I.e. the socket is one pin too far to the left or right. I did the same thing once and it was very confusing for a while!

 

I'll have a look tomorrow but I don't think that's the issue - how often do faulty decoders occur ??

[halsey]

How can I check the loco/engine further without a decoder installed?

 

I only have DCC equipment available to me now and a couple of other 6 and 8 pin decoders but not a 21 pin

 

Hopefully the suppliers will replace it for me as there is no logic to it being anything other than a fault one

[WIMorrison]

Decoders are very, very rarely faulty when delivered - that is why manufacturers give warranties on them, some of them very long warranties. Personally in 20 years I have never received a faulty one - though I have damaged a few!

 

Chances are that either have it misaligned with the pins (reasonably easy to do) or potentially, and theoretically impossible - upside down. I say theoretically because I have seen one upside down which meant a very careful straightening of a pin.

[Izzy]

I have had quite a few dud decoders straight out of the packet, mainly Lenz & Zimo, either completely dead or with faulty software, so while it might not be all that common it does happen. The supplier should be able to check the decoder for you I would think.

 

Izzy

[WIMorrison]

Really? I, and my friends, must have been very lucky in not experiencing any failures out of the packet - or perhaps you have all the bad luck and are ensuring that we only get the good ones without failures.

[halsey]

After a bit of "googling" it appears a CV8 hard reset is the next thing to try before I send it back

 

Re my comments about testing the loco (in DC mode with the DC "bit" refitted) will it work if I wire up a short piece of track and connect to the 12v cigar lighter socket in my car - just to ensure the motor is responding??

[WIMorrison]

You don’t need the track - just cradle the loco upside down, touch the wires to the wheels and the motor should turn - after you have refitted the blanking plug.

 

i also suggest that you buy something long a Gaugemaster Combi to do this in the railway room as you should always run locos on DC before fitting a chip to ensure that they work correctly - you can’t do this in the car every time you buy a new loco

Edited December 23, 2019 by WIMorrison

[Nigelcliffe]

21 minutes ago, halsey said:

After a bit of "googling" it appears a CV8 hard reset is the next thing to try before I send it back

 

Re my comments about testing the loco (in DC mode with the DC "bit" refitted) will it work if I wire up a short piece of track and connect to the 12v cigar lighter socket in my car - just to ensure the motor is responding??

 

I wouldn't use a car 12v socket.  Don't know what its max current is on your car through the 12v socket, but it could be 10A or more.  So, I'd be cautious about that as a test circuit.

 

A 9v PP3 battery is a cheap - under £5 for brandname examples at a supermarket, far less at some other sources -  and the two terminals are about the right place to just push directly onto the wheels of a OO loco to show its working.  Max current from a PP3 is more reasonable.