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Rails Announce OO 18000 Gas Turbine Locomotive


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On the transition from black to green there is contemporaneous evidence in the 'Locomotive Notes' on p143 of the 1957 Railway Magazine. Relating back to December 1956 it is noted that at Swindon '...18000 had been given an undercoat of green paint, which suggests that it is about to come back into service.' Which it did, in February 1957. 

 

The Swindon repainting memorandum of 25 October 1956, referred to by Robertson (p122) does not mention the lining at all so the colour used has to be the subject of an educated guess. 

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I don't have the references or the article which I wrote for Trains Illustrated, to hand anymore but back in the 1980s I received a message from C.P. (Phil) Atkins, the Librarian at the National Railway Museum. He said, "I believe you're interested in the Western Region gas turbine locos. We have a box of records from Swindon. It's not been opened since it arrived here. Would you like to come and open it?" You don't get those kind of invitations very often! The box contained original correspondence between the Swindon engineer who was sent to Switzerland to monitor the construction and his head office. I recall most significantly a 'begging letter' from the poor chap to Hawksworth. His meagre allowance had been decimated by a revaluation of the £ to the point where he could no longer afford to be there. Yet, he had to stay longer than expected because the progress was slow and at one point a panel or grille had been made wrong-handed and had to be re-made. The box also contained 18000's 'Failures Book' an album of photographs of parts that had failed in traffic. Time and again it was the combustion chamber linings, which looked like a garden incinerator after it had been used to often - bent, burned and collapsed. Sadly, the good stuff - epic trains restarted unaided on the South Devon banks etc - was eclipsed by the simple economies that came with a state-of-the-art 'Castle 4-6-0. (CJL)

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1 hour ago, 61661 said:

Dear All,

Thanks for the all the recent replies to the roof line issue. Rails has reversed its previous decision and asked us to add the orange band. Fortunately we were still in a position to do this as the improved body decoration samples had not yet been produced. Revised artwork has already been approved and we expect the modified/improved samples shortly. 

 

Hope this Helps

 

Ben

 

 

 

Ben,

 

Now that is how manufacturer / customer communication should work !!

 

Thank you very much - and please convey this to Rails - for being prepared to consider the views of RMweb members and act upon evidence that comes forward.

 

If there had been more than one 18000, I would have considered increasing my order - as it is, I will have to wait for 18100 / E1000 / E2001 !?!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

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2 hours ago, cctransuk said:

Ben,

 

Now that is how manufacturer / customer communication should work !!

 

Thank you very much - and please convey this to Rails - for being prepared to consider the views of RMweb members and act upon evidence that comes forward.

 

Nice, positive post, John. It's just as important to note when things go right as when they go wrong. I only wish I could upvote it.

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It's great to see this being produced; the model looks fantastic already. And even better now it's going to have the red/orange cantrail stripe applied – well done to all involved in making that happen. The news that that line will be added has confirmed that I will order one of the green ones, I now just have to decide which version!

 

But I've just come across a colour photo of the loco in early-BR logo green livery that clearly shows it has another thin red/orange line. Not wishing to open a further can of worms, there is clearly a fine line about a quarter of the thickness of the cantrail stripe applied across the base of the curved cab front almost immediately above the joining strip (bracing?) at the very bottom. The line parallels that bracing strip up around the side of the cab to the base of the cab door. The bracing strip itself, and maybe the angled triangular plate angle that fills the gap between the buffer-beam corner and the base of the cab front also look black to me in the photo, rather than green, though that is not definite.

 

The colour photo can be found in Green Diesel Days by Derek Huntriss (First edition 2005, published by Ian Allen / ISBN 9780711030664 – the one with the green 55 on the cover) and found on page 24. It shows a clean 18000 at Swindon works with a ladder leaning against its side and is credited to TB Owen and dated 18 May 1957. I've not been able to find the same photo online, but it is almost the same as the RCTS one that John Isherwood has posted/linked to in black & white – the 12th one down; it was clearly taken on the same occasion and from almost the same spot. To me, the red/orange line doesn't show in the B&W photo, but the black bracing band at the bottom of the cab does and is distinguishable from the green.

 

Gareth

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39 minutes ago, Gaz101 said:

It's great to see this being produced; the model looks fantastic already. And even better now it's going to have the red/orange cantrail stripe applied – well done to all involved in making that happen. The news that that line will be added has confirmed that I will order one of the green ones, I now just have to decide which version!

 

But I've just come across a colour photo of the loco in early-BR logo green livery that clearly shows it has another thin red/orange line. Not wishing to open a further can of worms, there is clearly a fine line about a quarter of the thickness of the cantrail stripe applied across the base of the curved cab front almost immediately above the joining strip (bracing?) at the very bottom. The line parallels that bracing strip up around the side of the cab to the base of the cab door. The bracing strip itself, and maybe the angled triangular plate angle that fills the gap between the buffer-beam corner and the base of the cab front also look black to me in the photo, rather than green, though that is not definite.

 

The colour photo can be found in Green Diesel Days by Derek Huntriss (First edition 2005, published by Ian Allen / ISBN 9780711030664 – the one with the green 55 on the cover) and found on page 24. It shows a clean 18000 at Swindon works with a ladder leaning against its side and is credited to TB Owen and dated 18 May 1957. I've not been able to find the same photo online, but it is almost the same as the RCTS one that John Isherwood has posted/linked to in black & white – the 12th one down; it was clearly taken on the same occasion and from almost the same spot. To me, the red/orange line doesn't show in the B&W photo, but the black bracing band at the bottom of the cab does and is distinguishable from the green.

 

Gareth

 

I'm so glad I'm having a black one! :) 

I think you're right. It seems to continue under the door as well.

 

1878849282_Screenshot2020-11-03at19_31_16.png.8842ff4cb757c7b25f95269ffde9372c.png

 

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But from that photo you can't see clearly where the line goes or how far it extends. It is a tall order to print a line, that fine, crisply over raised detail, and it would be essential to know where it begins and ends - or if it goes right round. If it's that uncertain, is it worth bothering with? (CJL)

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5 hours ago, dibber25 said:

But from that photo you can't see clearly where the line goes or how far it extends. It is a tall order to print a line, that fine, crisply over raised detail, and it would be essential to know where it begins and ends - or if it goes right round. If it's that uncertain, is it worth bothering with? (CJL)

But is is more clearly visible in some if the photos John posted earlier. I have to say though, you are right, it is mighty fine. 

Roy

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I don't think that it's a painted line around the lower cab front - I think it's light reflecting off a raised seam (weld seam) which runs exactly there. If you look at the pictures that cctrans posted on page 9, you can see the seam, and the Rails decorated samples show it very well.

 

Edited to add: Gaz101’s photo later shows that there is a thin orange line above the seam - so I was wrong.

Edited by Zero Gravitas
Correction of fact.
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I think that I would be happy to 'stick' while we are ahead.

 

Here is a crop from, I think, from an RTCS photo, similar to the 'propped ladder' photo referred to above. Here it looks like there might be some sort of colour band above the bevel. But the bevel itself is less distinct than in other photos. And the colour band is less intense than either the roof or side stripe. Which may be due to weathering. Or maybe it is some trick of the light, enhanced by cleaning - the top of the bevel does stand out even in black livery photos.

 

 

18000.jpg

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The 'bottom orange line' is definitely there and Gaz101's photo shows it doesn't continue across the door. BUT if the photo is blown up as large as possible on a computer screen it shows another orange line along the top of the angle running along the bottom of the mainframe. :scratch_one-s_head_mini: 

 

753307650_Screenshot2020-11-04at11_19_04.png.70041ecec157964636eee669fe0302d0.png

 

Who'd be a model manufacturer!

 

Whatever the decision(s), many thanks to Rails and Heljan for taking this project on. I hope sales reward their effort and maybe even encourage interest in, and conservation of, the real thing.

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38 minutes ago, TrevorP1 said:

The 'bottom orange line' is definitely there and Gaz101's photo shows it doesn't continue across the door. BUT if the photo is blown up as large as possible on a computer screen it shows another orange line along the top of the angle running along the bottom of the mainframe. :scratch_one-s_head_mini: 

 

753307650_Screenshot2020-11-04at11_19_04.png.70041ecec157964636eee669fe0302d0.png

 

Who'd be a model manufacturer!

 

Whatever the decision(s), many thanks to Rails and Heljan for taking this project on. I hope sales reward their effort and maybe even encourage interest in, and conservation of, the real thing.

 

Looking at my own copy of this photo (Colour-Rail DE838) enlarged as much as possible, I'd say this bottom line runs the full length of the loco just above this flange/stiffener. However it is so fine I think it would be almost impossible to replicate without it becoming too visible and attracting the eye and is therefore better left off.

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There's also a colour photo of the loco in green late crest running light into Swindon station, which shows the thin line across the front and sides of the loco quite well.

 

In this livery it looks like there was a pipe added to the solebar - does anyone know what that was? It appears to be on both sides at the 'double side window' end of the loco only. The photos above show the other end of the loco. (For discussion because I've just noticed it, and not a demand for it to be included.)

18000 Clip.jpg

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1 hour ago, Gaz101 said:

There's definitely a very thin red/orange band above the bevel, and the bevel appears black.

 

Here's a close crop of the colour photo I mentioned (hope that's allowed; happy to remove it if not).

IMG_8590.JPG

 

Having seen this, I am now convinced that the lines are GWR chrome orange - it would seem that Swindon were trying to adapt the GWR steam loco lined livery to an unfamiliar body outline.

 

I would concur that the sloping plating above the bufferbeams is black, including the angle iron, and that there is an orange line between the black and the green.

 

Which now begs the question of exactly what the broad, three line bodyside lining was comprised of. Does an extreme enlargement of the colour photo help here? Could they all be orange lines - narrow/ gap / broad / gap / narrow?

 

I would agree that the low bodyside line is too narrow to reproduce commercially - which won't stop me trying to print an appropriate transfer!

 

John Isherwood.

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19 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Having seen this, I am now convinced that the lines are GWR chrome orange - it would seem that Swindon were trying to adapt the GWR steam loco lined livery to an unfamiliar body outline.

 

I would concur that the sloping plating above the bufferbeams is black, including the angle iron, and that there is an orange line between the black and the green.

 

Which now begs the question of exactly what the broad, three line bodyside lining was comprised of. Does an extreme enlargement of the colour photo help here? Could they all be orange lines - narrow/ gap / broad / gap / narrow?

 

I would agree that the low bodyside line is too narrow to reproduce commercially - which won't stop me trying to print an appropriate transfer!

 

John Isherwood.

 

'Interesting/Thought Provoking' if I could flag it as such!

 

It makes complete sense that Swindon were trying to follow steam locomotive livery.

 

All this said and however interesting, I imagine these lines would be a devil of a job to do commercially. Also, unless the model were kept pristine, they would disappear under weathering just as they did on the real thing.

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On the pipework - also just for discussion - the 'ladder' period photographs, green early crest, do not have any pipework. So the pipework was not added during the period in 1956-57 during which 18000 was overhauled, repainted and then returned to traffic in early February 1957.

 

In the RTCS archive there is a photograph of 18000 approaching Reading General with a Passenger train dated 27/8/58 with the pipework visible. Robertson has a photo (p125) dated 4/3/58 clearly showing a late crest but apparently no pipework.

 

Discussing visits back to Swindon in 1958 Robertson (p126) refers to a fire in some of the control cables. This event is not dated, but 18000 was apparently noted at Swindon Works in April 1958. Could this be when and why the pipework appeared?

 

If so it may be reasonable to conclude that the pipework was present for the final 18 months of 18000's active life. But prior to that it was in service between Feb 1957 and (?) April 1958 in green/early crest and then green/late crest, with no pipework. 

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Yes that sounds potentially plausible.

 

I do have a photo which shows 18000 at Bristol TM on train 211, coupled to a Crimson and Cream BSK reputedly taken in 1957, which has late crest livery and the pipework present. Loco and coach windows are open, but it would be good to tie down when that photo was actually taken. It's Colourrail ref 226482.

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18 minutes ago, Pteremy said:

I had hoped that the information here

 

https://davidheyscollection.com/pages/david-heys-steam-diesel-photo-collection-23-br-western-region-3

 

might shed some further light. But unfortunately the reporting number '211' is missing from the lists during the relevant period.

From the same source, the only page with 211 is for Summer 1959 which shows it as the 1315 EWD Paddington - Weston super Mare.

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On 31/10/2020 at 17:48, dibber25 said:

... The lining - waist and roof - still looks to my eyes to be red, not orange, but I much prefer the loco in its original black and silver anyway. (CJL)

 

 

If you can't see the buffer housing red is a different colour to the lining in this photo, I would suggest using a colour calibrated display.

 

18000_06.jpg.6e972cda2a39737a3085af133627f4de.jpg

Edited by maico
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