Jump to content
 

Hornby 2020 range "reveal date" = 6th Jan


phil gollin
 Share

Recommended Posts

1 hour ago, 159220 said:

159220 to Santa’s list for what I would like to see from Hornby in 2020:
 

A new unit, either the CAF Civity or the Stadler Flirt. They’re “now”, they’re snazzy, they’re the future...

 

As mentioned before, can be dangerous jumping to quickly onto new rolling stock until time shows what variations show up - nothing worse (at least for us modellers who want the variations) than having someone tool up a model and then have the prototype deliver a slightly different version that the tooling can't accommodate.

 

So for the Flirt, best to at least wait and see what the Welsh units look like.

 

Given new stuff seems to require agreements/licenses, the Civity may not be available for Hornby to do.

 

1 hour ago, 159220 said:

Seeing as last year brought us the Mk3 with sliding doors, surely a standard HST Mk3 re-tool would be a simple and welcomed update to the range?

 

One would hope the Mk3/sliding doors tooling would allow for the standard Mk3 versions to be done as well.

 

1 hour ago, 159220 said:

Saying that, there are a number of models in the range which need a re-tool. Most have been taken on my others, so if Hornby don’t re-tool the class 50, 56 (which spring to mind), someone else will.

 

Too soon for anyone to do a Class 56, ideally they should wait for the Class 69 to appear so the tooling could do both.

 

1 hour ago, 159220 said:

And of course, surely we are going to see the tooling changes to the 800/0 to get the 802s in GWR/TPE & HT?

 

Possibly a demonstration of being too quick to market.  If the tooling was designed to allow the variations (assuming there are any, not familiar with them) then it would make sense.

 

On the other hand, if the tooling doesn't allow for any differences then we may never see them made.

 

 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

I have my doubts that Hornby will go for any new detailed contemporary image.  I think they will plough on releasing their existing back catalogue of less detailed models in contemporary liveries at pocket money prices.  And good luck to them in that.  There is a market for the Limby 156 (although not at the price they are at the moment) and their Class 90, which compete for the price sensitive market compared to the competition with other more detailed models aimed at wealthier, dare I say it "adult" buyers.  Whilst they have turned out some nice high detail non-steam models such as the Class 87 (although they then laid an egg with the half-assed DCC arrangements) past performance suggests that this year will see a load more detailed steam locos and rolling stock whilst they milk the last dregs of the grey pound, a dribble of liveries for a few non-steam existing toolings (probably avoiding the most popular requests, and focussing on celebrity one-offs) and possibly a continuing expansion of contemporary liveries in the Railroad range.  I'd be very surprised if there is any new tooling for a unit or modern coach.

A retool of the 50 or 56 won't happen, they sell out quickly enough as it is.  in any case, neither is actually that bad compared to the models they effectively replaced. 

  • Like 1
  • Agree 3
Link to post
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

past performance suggests that this year will see a load more detailed steam locos and rolling stock whilst they milk the last dregs of the grey pound, a dribble of liveries for a few non-steam existing toolings (probably avoiding the most popular requests, and focussing on celebrity one-offs) and possibly a continuing expansion of contemporary liveries in the Railroad range.  I'd be very surprised if there is any new tooling for a unit or modern coach.

A retool of the 50 or 56 won't happen, they sell out quickly enough as it is.  in any case, neither is actually that bad compared to the models they effectively replaced. 

 

While I don't think steam will entirely disappear as a market (it offers a lot of advantages), and I do hope somebody announced a detailed Manor, I would be disappointed if Hornby remains steam focused as I don't think that suits the bulk of the spending market.

 

Using the Bachmann era system, I would guess the bulk of the market is now era 7 (the prevailing wisdom is that the spending bulge of the market is adults once the children move away and the mortgage mainly paid off, so say late 50s to early 60s in age - I'm 50 and thus would be era 8).  Thus Hornby (and others) should likely be looking at stuff that was in use in the 1970s.

 

This would also match what we are seeing, with Accurascale grabbing the Deltic and Class 37.

 

To that end a redone 50 would make sense (both in a preventing someone else from taking it, but also I think the Hornby model is only appropriate for the rebuilt units and not the originals).

 

Or any of the other early diesel era BR stuff.

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold
54 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

I have my doubts that Hornby will go for any new detailed contemporary image.  I think they will plough on releasing their existing back catalogue of less detailed models in contemporary liveries at pocket money prices.  And good luck to them in that.  There is a market for the Limby 156 (although not at the price they are at the moment) and their Class 90, which compete for the price sensitive market compared to the competition with other more detailed models aimed at wealthier, dare I say it "adult" buyers.  Whilst they have turned out some nice high detail non-steam models such as the Class 87 (although they then laid an egg with the half-assed DCC arrangements) past performance suggests that this year will see a load more detailed steam locos and rolling stock whilst they milk the last dregs of the grey pound, a dribble of liveries for a few non-steam existing toolings (probably avoiding the most popular requests, and focussing on celebrity one-offs) and possibly a continuing expansion of contemporary liveries in the Railroad range.  I'd be very surprised if there is any new tooling for a unit or modern coach.

A retool of the 50 or 56 won't happen, they sell out quickly enough as it is.  in any case, neither is actually that bad compared to the models they effectively replaced. 

 There is a certain logic to this. I'm mostly 'acquired out'. There is only the large prairie left that I would like to own, along with the Dapol Mogul & prairie. Past that, there's nothing really. Sure, something will turn up to catch my eye, but  the list has diminished to the point whereby that the possibility of suitable financial reward for the producers is extremely rare indeed. 

 

Bachmann have cottoned on to this. Why make a locomotive for X pounds, when you can make a generic wagon for X pennies but still be able to sell said wagon for (again) X pounds? The first producer to be able to produce a quality wagon without the inflated prices will be able to command the market, and hopefully, still return a profit. Good luck to them, I say!

 

I think I've bought my last Hornby locomotive ever this week, apart from the  Large Prairie. That is a  72xx tank. After that, it's all wagons, built from the back stocks. It's the same for Bachmann; the 94xx has 'missed' the boat. It's only one sale, but how many are like myself?

 

Have a good weekend, folks,

 

Ian. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, eldomtom2 said:

The assumption there is that the majority of modellers want to model their youth.

 

We've been here many times before, but, for example of the half dozen or so active modellers I know I'm the youngest who is planning a primarily steam era layout (LMS 1930s) and I'm 57. My other layout is most definitely of the period I grew up with, WCML electrics 1967-2005! My friends who are my age or younger are all modelling post steam - mainly BR Sector period.  That unscientific straw poll is also what tends to be the response when I have talked to people visiting the Dolgellau layout over the past few years - a steam era layout set in the 1960-63 period.  Those who are modellers, or are interested in building a layout and seeking advice (a surprising number of people) do tend towards the older age group for a steam interest, and a younger age group for diesels.  There are exceptions - I've spoken to a couple of young, teenage modellers who were really into modelling steam, and very well informed about their interest, but they were notable by their rarity.

 

The thing is, whenever people have raised this on here, all sorts of polls are trotted out to prove that steam is just as appealing to the young as the old.  Which is fine, but coming back to my "modelling circle" I'm the only one on this forum.  Many "modern" post steam modellers have their own social media groups, YouTube social feeds, and so won't be counted in any surveys or polls.  Given Bachmann, Accurascale, Realtrack, Heljan, Hattons and Cavalex are all spending serious money on post steam models to the high standards the Hornby steam outline models achieve, and in some cases, including Bachmann, are focussing a substantial or main part of their investment and production in post-steam, it does suggest that the market is shifting and that Hornby are in danger of becoming a niche supplier in the longer term if they focus the majority of their development budget on developing more steam outline models.  The competition has picked off a number of models Hornby could have made based on their back catalogue or in some cases blagged a whole market segment to themselves, like Bachmann  have with modern DMUs.  In the 80s, Hornby would have had a model of the Virgin Voyager out to market almost as soon as the real trains were entering service.  Bachmann blagged the model instead.  However, they do seem to be getting back to their old ways with the 80x, Javelin and last year's refurbished HST, all of which were released when the units were new and the sort of thing a young enthusiast would be excited about having a model of.

There will always be demand for steam.  But when you look at the proportion of new models by competitors that are non-steam you do have to wonder if Hornby have quite got the balance right 

  • Like 1
  • Agree 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold
6 hours ago, acg5324 said:

My email from the RM/CM yesterday has a tantalising clue on the front cover.

7CC51F64-4EB5-4B93-A951-055836C67828.jpeg

I have a better one than that, for the last few weeks (indeed it might be months), there is an image online which appears to be a screenshot from Hornbys website detailing a quite accurate artwork CAD drawing of a loco listed as a 2020 release. 

 

I cannot confirm it’s authenticity (and it was denied when I asked if there had been a leak, not that i’d expect a different response) so I’ve not shared it.

But it’s quite exciting, if it they were to be modelled.

 

 

Edited by adb968008
Link to post
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, adb968008 said:

I have a better one than that, for the last few weeks (indeed it might be months), there is an image online which appears to be a screenshot from Hornbys website detailing a quite accurate artwork CAD drawing of a loco listed as a 2020 release. 

 

I cannot confirm it’s authenticity (and it was denied when I asked if there had been a leak, not that i’d expect a different response) so I’ve not shared it.

But it’s quite exciting, if it they were to be modelled.

 

 

 

I have to agree, I saw that too. But it's best to not share it elsewhere.

Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
5 hours ago, MGR Hooper! said:

 

I have to agree, I saw that too. But it's best to not share it elsewhere.

 

Because it's rubbish, and is categorically nothing to do with Hornby - as I told adb968008.....

  • Like 4
  • Friendly/supportive 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold
7 hours ago, eldomtom2 said:

The assumption there is that the majority of modellers want to model their youth.

An arguably true assumption, but that's possibly only an indirect motivation. Modelling an area and era which holds personal memories/familiarity has a number of advantages.

 

One is more likely to spot/avoid anachronisms, have an instinct for what looks right, (and perhaps more importantly, what looks wrong) and there is usually less research required,

 

It can easily be later than ones youth, though. any period when one enjoyed observing the prototype scene will do! Somebody once observed that all modelling is historical even if one chooses to portray the week before last.

 

I used also to model/collect items from the 1990s when I first worked on the railway but have narrowed it back to what I saw in my youth. I just didn't have the time, space or money to do both. Even so, I find my interests drifting slightly earlier to a time when any personal observation could only have been conducted from the comfort of my pram. :)

 

John

 

  

  • Like 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium

A bit puzzled at the need for a new class 50.  I thought the existing one was generally well regarded .  It looks like a 50 to me .   I suppose the question is would a new class 50 be so superior to the existing model that people would go out and replace existing models?  As prices head over £160 and towards £200, I somehow doubt it.

  • Agree 8
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
42 minutes ago, Legend said:

A bit puzzled at the need for a new class 50.  I thought the existing one was generally well regarded .  It looks like a 50 to me .   I suppose the question is would a new class 50 be so superior to the existing model that people would go out and replace existing models?  As prices head over £160 and towards £200, I somehow doubt it.

Who said anything about a new 50? The Hornby one is fantastic. 

  • Like 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Premium
5 minutes ago, Hilux5972 said:

Who said anything about a new 50? The Hornby one is fantastic. 

 

I think it was 159220 that suggested revamped 50 and 56 before someone else pinches them.  I thought both models plus the 60, 08 and new HST are generally well regarded , if a touch expensive (especially the HST power cars)

  • Like 1
  • Agree 4
Link to post
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, eldomtom2 said:

The assumption there is that the majority of modellers want to model their youth.

 

I was going to say the same thing, we've argued the topic to death in this forum several times haha. 

 

Personally, I model an era 50 years before I was born, because it interests me. I do model my local lines though because I'm interested in local history. The late 1930s/ early 40s scene on the Brighton - Portsmouth line is certainly more interesting (to me) than 1991 onwards.... 

 

Anyway, I'd like to see Hornby release the H in wartime black and perhaps introduce a SR Q or an ex LBSCR K =) Hornby often likes to do ex LSWR stuff so some of these 3 sets that frequently pop up on the route I model would be great! 

 

Marsh 'H2' atlantic no. 2424 Beachy Head in charge of a Brighton - Portsmouth service at Lake Lane on 15/3/1938. [J. H. Venn / Mike Morant collection]

 

Southern Railway, RJ Billinton E4 class 0-4-2 radial tank no.2505 photographed on 26/4/1938 near Shoreham [J. H. Venn / Mike Morant collection]

 

 

And sometimes with other odds and sods attached, sets are great but odd carriages needed also! (and if an I3 appeared that'd be great! I know Loco Works did one but... £££!) 

 

Former LBSCR Marsh I3 class 4-4-2T no. 2028 at Barnham on 22/8/1937. [J. H. Venn / Mike Morant collection]

 

 

 

  • Like 6
  • Agree 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

6 hours ago, Legend said:

A bit puzzled at the need for a new class 50.  I thought the existing one was generally well regarded .  It looks like a 50 to me .   I suppose the question is would a new class 50 be so superior to the existing model that people would go out and replace existing models?  As prices head over £160 and towards £200, I somehow doubt it.

 

The existing 50 has issues that prevent me from considering it (a problem for one who would like to model Devon in the 80s), with the major one being the toy like operating louvers - you can find on here and elsewhere kitbashing projects people have done to replace them.

 

And despite what many on here think, there isn't a static never changing group of people in this hobby.  In addition to people replacing an existing model there will be people like myself who haven't bought the existing model because of its issues, as well as the yearly influx of new people to the hobby who don't have a model of X to replace.

 

 

 

Edited by mdvle
revised for provided info
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold
12 hours ago, Legend said:

A bit puzzled at the need for a new class 50.  I thought the existing one was generally well regarded .  It looks like a 50 to me .   I suppose the question is would a new class 50 be so superior to the existing model that people would go out and replace existing models?  As prices head over £160 and towards £200, I somehow doubt it.

Speaking as someone who has the whole fleet. They could be better. The model is over 10 years old and the bar keeps rising. There are the lourves which are too deep,. The face of the loco is wrong. The headcone is not a good representation as the lights are too deep and the main roof grille is undersize.  They are not a bad model but no where near as good as the Hornby 60, the SLW 24, the Dapol 68, many Bachmann offerings and presumably the Accurascale Deltic when it arrives. They are a 7 or 8 out of 10 model.

I can definitely see someone else doing one and the 31 while they are at it unless Hornby redo it themselves. 

Edited by BR Blue
Spelling
  • Agree 1
  • Informative/Useful 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

  • RMweb Gold

I dunno, the class 50 is a hard one to beat.

 

it runs like a dream, pulls the house down.

i like the sprung buffers, opening doors, posable louvres.

The model was made at a time of hope, and when the UK was finally on-par with the latest US toolings.

Whilst standards have definitely moved on overseas, I can’t see a new UK class 50 matching US standards today and being affordable.

If therefore the trade off was an improved shape, but a loss of everything above to more conventional form of UK model.. I can’t see me switching my 15-20 class 50’s, and if a new one was made to a super standard.. I can’t see it being affordable.

Hornbys class 50 does kind of set a benchmark, it might be old but I’ve not seen much better details since those times.

 

  • Agree 2
Link to post
Share on other sites

Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...