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20s to Skegness + Mk. 1s

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Hi

Trying to recreate the class 20's to Skegness but unsure what coaching stock was used. Particularly interested in the Mk. 1s era. Can anyone assist?

Ta in advance.

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There are a lot of photos of the trains scattered through my photo thread on RMWeb at:   

 

The photos are also on flickr, mainly in my Grantham to Nottingham album at:

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/davidwf2009/albums/72157626279144040

 

I am afraid you will have to go through a lot of photos to find the ones you want!.

 

David

 

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From memory, lots of SKs and BSKs. 

 

Some sets had TSOs which probably became more prevalent as the corridor versions were scrapped. 

 

A few sets had a BCK at the front just to provide some 1st class accommodation, but many were second class only. I don't remember any catering vehicles, although that may have changed in later years. 

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Here’s what I had on one summer Saturday..2FAD9FE6-36F2-479C-9C9A-F69B045CC07B.jpeg.20930ec91b3b6066b667b77659d5cab9.jpeg

 

5x SK and 1x BSK

Edited by adb968008
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The 'Jolly Fishermen' I remember seeing were usually twelve coaches each from Leicester, Derby/Burton, Nottingham and Sheffield but not sure on coach types. As they were summer specials, I would assume they were second class only with any firsts being suitably labelled.

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I've probably got some notes from 1981-83ish, showing actual coach numbers. Should I look them out (can't do it today though)?

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In 1985 the 09.29 SO and 09.40 TWO Derby to Skegness, and 09.09 MTHO Burton to Skegness, were booked 4 SK, BSK, 4 SK. The 08.48 SUN Derby to Skegness was booked BSK, 9 TSO, BSK (all Mk1). This rake worked the 08.48 Leicester to Skegness service during the week.

 

I caught the train back to Derby from Beeston on numerous Sunday nights that August in order to use up my allocation of free travel from my Dad before I started work on the railway in the September. Sadly I don't seemed to have bothered to write down the individual coaches, probably because I knew I'd seen them all already.

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I looked out some notes from 1982 and 1983...

Leicester Sat 29/5/82

20186+20159 with 21242 25824 25758 25985 15942 25990 24847 25407 35055

i.e. BCK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Sun 30/5/82

20159+20186 with 25740 25777 25798 16121 35342 25754 25425 25819 26010

i.e. SK SK SK CK BSK SK SK SK SK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Sun 6/6/82

20169+20158 and the same coaches as 30/5

 

Leicester Sat 12/6/82

20143+20166 with 35055 25407 24847 25770 15942 25985 25758 25824 35474

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches, nearly the same as 29/5

 

Leicester Sat 26/6/82

20072+20159 with the same coaches as 12/6. My notes say rear loco failed at Boston, and instead of the 20s taking the ECS back to Derby, the 20s went onto Leicester depot, and 45002 took the ECS

 

Leicester 28/5/83

31282+31283 with 35124 25361 25432 25286 16073 24887 25360 24859 35330

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Mon 30/5/83 (bank holiday)

20173+20134 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Tue 31/5/83

20070+20075 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Wed 1/6/83

20075+20072 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Sun 5/6/83

20173+20134 with 35325 24845 18415 18374 7081 18300 24854 18283 35074

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

N.B. the renumbering of the Mk1s was beginning to take effect - 25xxx SKs went to 18xxx for example, and CKs were also renumbered.

 

Leicester Sat 25/6/83

20135+20157 with 35124 25361 25432 25286 16073 25769 25360 25796 35330

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

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On 16/11/2019 at 11:26, eastwestdivide said:

I looked out some notes from 1982 and 1983...

Leicester Sat 29/5/82

20186+20159 with 21242 25824 25758 25985 15942 25990 24847 25407 35055

i.e. BCK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Sun 30/5/82

20159+20186 with 25740 25777 25798 16121 35342 25754 25425 25819 26010

i.e. SK SK SK CK BSK SK SK SK SK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Sun 6/6/82

20169+20158 and the same coaches as 30/5

 

Leicester Sat 12/6/82

20143+20166 with 35055 25407 24847 25770 15942 25985 25758 25824 35474

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches, nearly the same as 29/5

 

Leicester Sat 26/6/82

20072+20159 with the same coaches as 12/6. My notes say rear loco failed at Boston, and instead of the 20s taking the ECS back to Derby, the 20s went onto Leicester depot, and 45002 took the ECS

 

Leicester 28/5/83

31282+31283 with 35124 25361 25432 25286 16073 24887 25360 24859 35330

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Mon 30/5/83 (bank holiday)

20173+20134 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Tue 31/5/83

20070+20075 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Wed 1/6/83

20075+20072 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Sun 5/6/83

20173+20134 with 35325 24845 18415 18374 7081 18300 24854 18283 35074

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

N.B. the renumbering of the Mk1s was beginning to take effect - 25xxx SKs went to 18xxx for example, and CKs were also renumbered.

 

Leicester Sat 25/6/83

20135+20157 with 35124 25361 25432 25286 16073 25769 25360 25796 35330

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Would these have 'E' or 'M' prefix?

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9 hours ago, Atlantic said:

Would these have 'E' or 'M' prefix?

Vast majority would be M as the coaches were supplied from Derby on the LMR. They might have borrowed one or two from other regions. The coaching stock books from the time might be able to confirm the prefixes. 

Not sure when they started dropping the prefixes, think it was later than 82-83, but not by much.

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23 hours ago, Atlantic said:

Would these have 'E' or 'M' prefix?

 

All the 82 ones were 'M'

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On 16/11/2019 at 11:26, eastwestdivide said:

I looked out some notes from 1982 and 1983...

Leicester Sat 29/5/82

20186+20159 with 21242 25824 25758 25985 15942 25990 24847 25407 35055

i.e. BCK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Sun 30/5/82

20159+20186 with 25740 25777 25798 16121 35342 25754 25425 25819 26010

i.e. SK SK SK CK BSK SK SK SK SK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Sun 6/6/82

20169+20158 and the same coaches as 30/5

 

Leicester Sat 12/6/82

20143+20166 with 35055 25407 24847 25770 15942 25985 25758 25824 35474

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches, nearly the same as 29/5

 

Leicester Sat 26/6/82

20072+20159 with the same coaches as 12/6. My notes say rear loco failed at Boston, and instead of the 20s taking the ECS back to Derby, the 20s went onto Leicester depot, and 45002 took the ECS

 

Leicester 28/5/83

31282+31283 with 35124 25361 25432 25286 16073 24887 25360 24859 35330

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

Leicester Mon 30/5/83 (bank holiday)

20173+20134 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Tue 31/5/83

20070+20075 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Wed 1/6/83

20075+20072 with same coaches as 28/5

 

Leicester Sun 5/6/83

20173+20134 with 35325 24845 18415 18374 7081 18300 24854 18283 35074

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

N.B. the renumbering of the Mk1s was beginning to take effect - 25xxx SKs went to 18xxx for example, and CKs were also renumbered.

 

Leicester Sat 25/6/83

20135+20157 with 35124 25361 25432 25286 16073 25769 25360 25796 35330

i.e. BSK SK SK SK CK SK SK SK BSK, 9 coaches

 

 

 

 

I suspect that in the 1960s and 70s (at least) the carriage rakes which included a BCK or CK were the regular dated services in the main timetable. I cannot find any reference in the published material to suggest they were branded second class only, and therefore a couple of compartments had to be provided in the hope that a wealthy through passenger turned up, or compensation would have had to be provided. 

 

The all second class sets were much more likely (in those years) to have been Adex (of which there were many) from various stations in mining country. These eventually were cut back to larger towns/cities such as Nottingham, Derby, Leicester, Sheffield and Doncaster; but they could easily be advertised as second only. 

 

I only lived by the line from Sleaford to Boston in the 60s and early 70s, but on a summer Saturday morning there would be about 12-15 loco hauled passenger trains heading east between 09:30 and 13:00, with the return trains appearing soon after that and through the afternoon. This was mostly before the Lincoln and Spalding direct lines closed in Oct 1970 and therefore I missed the services on those routes. With nostalgic hindsight I wished that I could have cycled to Bellwater Junction and seen them all, but it was a long way away, and would have probably taken a couple of hours each way. 

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Just for clarity, all those I listed above were the regular summer-dated, public timetabled trains to/from Skegness, and not excursions.

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Any records or photos of the famed 'Derby maroon set' of Mk1 excursion coaches to Skegness, up to 1974

 

Dava

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Thanks, evocative photos !

 

Dava

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On 03/12/2019 at 07:44, Dava said:

Thanks, evocative photos !

 

Dava

 

Apart from the addition of a Morrisons store, removal of one signal arm and some track, it's still very much the same today.

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5 hours ago, great central said:

 

Apart from the addition of a Morrisons store, removal of one signal arm and some track, it's still very much the same today.

 

The station maybe, no excursion trains with class 20, 25, 31, 37 &, Mk1 maroon and blue/grey coaches though!

 

I wonder if we'll look back at the passing era of East Midlands Trains/Railways with similar nostalgia - I suspect so in the case of the HST sets and maybe 158s, depending on what replaces them.

 

Dava

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11 minutes ago, Dava said:

 

The station maybe, no excursion trains with class 20, 25, 31, 37 &, Mk1 maroon and blue/grey coaches though!

 

I wonder if we'll look back at the passing era of East Midlands Trains/Railways with similar nostalgia - I suspect so in the case of the HST sets and maybe 158s, depending on what replaces them.

 

Dava

 

The  current HST sets should be replaced by ex LNER sets in the near future, they may or may not run to Skegness in future years, the 15x family to be replaced by 170s in the next couple of years.

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