Has anyone done a cut and shut to form a Class 119 DMU?

[Tallpaul69]

Hi All,

 

I am thinking about the possibilities of forming  Class 119 DMU DMS and DMBS by cut and shut on a Mk1 coach with a Lima 117 drivers cab.

 

I have not got as far as checking drawings or any serious work on this.

 

I thought it sensible to try to avoid reinventing the wheel by asking the Forum for help and assistance.

 

So if anyone has built these units, not necessarily by the method outlined above, I would appreciate your help.

 

Many thanks

Paul

[Gibbo675]

Hi Paul,

 

Having just had a look at the diagram on RAILCAR.co.uk the Mk1 profile is quite different and also the windows are too deep. Both features may be corrected but would require a lot of work. The Mk2 profile is somewhat similar and also has the advantage that the windows are not as deep as the Mk1.

 

In a thinking out loud sort of a way might it be possible to use cut and shut Triang Mk2's with altered window vents ?

 

I look forward to seeing your efforts however you decide to proceed.

 

Gibbo.

[Karhedron]

The cab of the 117 was not quite the same as the 119. Whilst it had the same 3-window layout, the 117 had a large headcode box while the 119 had a much smaller destination blind.

 

 

[Mallard60022]

Ask Clive.

[Darius43]

Silver Fox models does a conversion kit with side overlays:-

 

Silver Fox Class 119

 

Not exactly cutting and shutting but it does hopefully provide the correct cabs and sides/window profiles.

 

Cheers

 

Darius

[russ p]

Both those DMUs look great except for stupid headlights WHY? Neither are mainline those headlights are more of hindrance to a driver at night as they don't give much light at all but preservation is obsessed with them

Sorry to go OT

[Steamport Southport]

6 minutes ago, russ p said:

Both those DMUs look great except for stupid headlights WHY? Neither are mainline those headlights are more of hindrance to a driver at night as they don't give much light at all but preservation is obsessed with them

Sorry to go OT

 

Possibly how they got them from BR?

 

 

 

As for the OP. Maybe get in touch with Charlie to see whether the DC Kits version is going to be reissued?

 

https://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=131_224_137&product_id=1155

 

 

 

Jason

[russ p]

26 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Possibly how they got them from BR?

 

 

 

As for the OP. Maybe get in touch with Charlie to see whether the DC Kits version is going to be reissued?

 

https://www.dckits-devideos.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=131_224_137&product_id=1155

 

 

 

Jason

 

 

Off locos and units in scrapyards 

Edited November 14, 2019 by russ p
Spelling

[NIK]

51 minutes ago, russ p said:

Both those DMUs look great except for stupid headlights WHY? Neither are mainline those headlights are more of hindrance to a driver at night as they don't give much light at all but preservation is obsessed with them

Sorry to go OT

Hi,

 

At least one Class 119 in Blue Grey had a headlight in 1989 so preservation societies probably inherited them.

 

Thanks to Darius43 for pointing out Silver Fox are now doing conversion kits. If I buy any I may use Bachmann DMMU chassis as the donor at least for the power car.

 

 

Regards

 

Nick

[Tallpaul69]

Hi All,

Thanks for your input.

 

I was trying to use things I already had, and which had a sound structure.

The Silver Fox and dc Kits products have good points but ready made up are expensive, while the conversion kits require more skill than I have!

 

However, this is a long term project so something may turn up!

 

Cheers

Paul  

 

 

[TheSignalEngineer]

4 hours ago, Karhedron said:

The cab of the 117 was not quite the same as the 119. Whilst it had the same 3-window layout, the 117 had a large headcode box while the 119 had a much smaller destination blind.

And the Lima one wasn't quite right for either.

[MJI]

Worsley Works sides and ends.

 

[MJI]

2 minutes ago, MJI said:

Worsley Works sides and ends.

 

 

And a 116 DMS

 

The 119 (all 3) now in B&G and with Lima chassis awaiting bogies.

[John Tomlinson]

22 hours ago, Karhedron said:

The cab of the 117 was not quite the same as the 119. Whilst it had the same 3-window layout, the 117 had a large headcode box while the 119 had a much smaller destination blind.

 

 

Rather a useful pair of photos side by side, as both show a very similar bodyside profile.

 

Namely straight from the cantrail to the waistband - below the bottom of the windows - then a quite gentle tumblehome. I've always thought the Lima tumblehome on their 117 to be overdone, but nonetheless capable of correction with a bit of filing and filling to reduce the curvature. MJI's Worsley examples above look just right in the photo.

 

Whether the Silver Fox sides for a 119 refered to above would be better on a Lima 117 than a Mk1 I don't know, IIRC the 119 had an end gangway profile like a Mk1 rather than flat.

 

John.

[Rich Papper]

Hello

I'm doing a cut-and-shut 119. Have seen the conversion kits, but I'm a cheapskate and I already had spare bodies! Early days.

Rich

[Geep7]

On 12/12/2019 at 06:35, Rich Papper said:

Hello

I'm doing a cut-and-shut 119. Have seen the conversion kits, but I'm a cheapskate and I already had spare bodies! Early days.

Rich

I presume that's using Hornby Class 110 parts, or are they from Bachmann Class 108's? I guess the cab is from a 108...

[Rich Papper]

Yup. Bodies from Hornby 110s and cab from a Bachmann 108. 108 will need some fettling to fit - surprisingly is wider than the 110. Much gluing, filling, filing to do. No idea how it will turn out but all of these bits and pieces were picked up second hand for very little so that's part of the fun!

Rich

[SRman]

Chris (Geep7): the class 108 would not have the right body side profile, as it has a continuous curve from cantrail to solebar level. Even Hornby's 110 is not quite right because Hornby, in their wisdom, decided to mould the change in angle below the windows with a sharp crease rather than a curve, but at least that can be filed and sanded to a smoother curve (I did that with some class 104 conversions using the 110 bodies).

[SRman]

On 16/11/2019 at 00:17, John Tomlinson said:

Rather a useful pair of photos side by side, as both show a very similar bodyside profile.

 

Namely straight from the cantrail to the waistband - below the bottom of the windows - then a quite gentle tumblehome. I've always thought the Lima tumblehome on their 117 to be overdone, but nonetheless capable of correction with a bit of filing and filling to reduce the curvature. MJI's Worsley examples above look just right in the photo.

 

Whether the Silver Fox sides for a 119 refered to above would be better on a Lima 117 than a Mk1 I don't know, IIRC the 119 had an end gangway profile like a Mk1 rather than flat.

 

John.

Having used the Craftsman conversions, I would agree with you about the 'bowed' ends of the 119 (and 120) units. The kits include overlays that need to be shaped to the profile at the ends as well as for the sides. Just for the record, my photo shows the effect of using the Craftsman kit for the 120 on the Lima 117 bodies; the 119 is exactly the same kit without the etched two-window cab fronts for the 120.


P_20181224_131014_vHDR_On by Jeffrey Lynn, on Flickr

[SRman]

p.s.to the previous post: Ignore the extra footsteps all the way along as I re-chassised it in more recent times with a Hornby class 121 chassis, which needs the steps carved off. I had done this with the original Lima class 117 chassis.

[John Tomlinson]

That's a very nice model Jeff. I've never envied anyone painting the Blue/ Gray scheme, even less NSE!

 

John.

[rogerzilla]

If I had one I'd number the set L577.  It was a regular on the Newbury main line in the 1980s and it was the roughest-sounding, smokiest DMU on the route.  I think it had a permanent engine fault and the exhaust system was full of holes.  We used to laugh when we saw it coming. 

 

On a bad day at Thatcham we'd see about 50/50 Class 119s and HSTs (Class 253 then).  On a good day we'd hear a thunderous rumble from far off and then, about a minute later, a Class 50 would appear at full line speed (only the DMUs ever stopped there).  Saw every single 253 and every 50 except 50 031 which, luckily, is preserved so I've seen it now!

[MJI]

1 hour ago, rogerzilla said:

If I had one I'd number the set L577.  It was a regular on the Newbury main line in the 1980s and it was the roughest-sounding, smokiest DMU on the route.  I think it had a permanent engine fault and the exhaust system was full of holes.  We used to laugh when we saw it coming. 

 

On a bad day at Thatcham we'd see about 50/50 Class 119s and HSTs (Class 253 then).  On a good day we'd hear a thunderous rumble from far off and then, about a minute later, a Class 50 would appear at full line speed (only the DMUs ever stopped there).  Saw every single 253 and every 50 except 50 031 which, luckily, is preserved so I've seen it now!

 

 

You are not having mine.

 

Ran fine when I rode on it, probably a Gloucester/Swindon service.

[Rich Papper]

Mine will be L588. I have a picture I took of it somewhere at Oxford looking something like this. My attempt has just had it's first shot of primer. Still some snagging to do.

 

[Tallpaul69]

On ‎18‎/‎01‎/‎2020 at 16:40, Rich Papper said:

Mine will be L588. I have a picture I took of it somewhere at Oxford looking something like this. My attempt has just had it's first shot of primer. Still some snagging to do.

 

Looks good, keep us informed on progress!

 

Paul