Bachmann 2020 Range

[tomparryharry]

21 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Since when?

 

Name one 4MM scale GWR steam locomotive model that Dapol have produced in the last thirty years. Not including the 63XX and Large Prairie. All previous Dapol GWR models have came from other sources such as Airfix and the left over Mainline stock bought in the fire sale, apart from the County which was a rebodied Castle. Reliveried Terriers don't count.

 

I'm tripping over all those Dapol GWR models as I have so many of them. Not.

 

 

 

Jason

 

 

Edited January 13, 2020 by tomparryharry
Post deleted:- Not helpful

[mdvle]

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Since when?

 

About 2016, when Dapol had a staffing change and the new staff brought in at the very least an experience in GWR if not a liking - see the various Lionheart GWR models in O that were brought with.

 

2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Name one 4MM scale GWR steam locomotive model that Dapol have produced in the last thirty years. Not including the 63XX and Large Prairie.

 

Never said anything about the last 30 years, as to a large extent that doesn't matter.

 

What matters is what the current people like and want to do.

 

 

[TomScrut]

On 07/01/2020 at 22:53, Ron Ron Ron said:

I’d love it if the Autoballasters were rerun, especially in NR yellow
However they would cost £50 to £70 a wagon at today’s prices.

 

One of their top dogs said at Ally Pally last year, or maybe it was the previous Warley (2018), that it would be unlikely that most of the complex and highly detailed modern wagons they’ve done over the last decade, would ever see the light of day again.

The reasoning being that the inevitable high prices would put many would be purchasers off and sales volumes wouldn’t justify the outlay. i.e. just too risky.

In my initial enquiry, I mentioned that these and certain other wagons had flown of the shelves and hardly ever appear S/H, but it seems it’s a risk they are not currently prepared to take.

 

Complex and expensive to produce might now be limited to novel and attractive items, such as the crane, that will sell well on a one and only production run.

 

 

Ron

 

The thing with the Autoballasters is they would probably be able to just about get away with one run of the non-generator ones. These are simpler than the generator ones but based on eBay experience are the most in demand. 7 non generator ones went last night for a combined £345. So over £49 each for second hand Railtrack ones! OTOH I am trying to sell my 3 generator ones for £40 each (what I bought them for but have changed my mind on them) and they aren't going anywhere.

[Ed-farms]

21 hours ago, TomScrut said:

 

The thing with the Autoballasters is they would probably be able to just about get away with one run of the non-generator ones. These are simpler than the generator ones but based on eBay experience are the most in demand. 7 non generator ones went last night for a combined £345. So over £49 each for second hand Railtrack ones! OTOH I am trying to sell my 3 generator ones for £40 each (what I bought them for but have changed my mind on them) and they aren't going anywhere.

 

The problem with this is supply and demand - in N Gauge Dutch Seacows go for over £50 each, yet I have heard Bachmann would suggest that as the price (RRP or Discount not sure), problem is whilst 1 or 2 might go on ebay at that how well would a shop sell them if they had 20-30 in stock, same logic could apply to OO Auto ballesters - would they fly out if they were in ample supply?

[TomScrut]

38 minutes ago, Ed-farms said:

 

The problem with this is supply and demand - in N Gauge Dutch Seacows go for over £50 each, yet I have heard Bachmann would suggest that as the price (RRP or Discount not sure), problem is whilst 1 or 2 might go on ebay at that how well would a shop sell them if they had 20-30 in stock, same logic could apply to OO Auto ballesters - would they fly out if they were in ample supply?

 

Yes good point. It only takes 2 people to want them. Some more went last night for £50 each by the way!

[Covkid]

On 07/01/2020 at 12:42, Denbridge said:

The obvious choice for Bachmann would surely be another Maunsell mogul of the U class or N1/U1. Similarly, a Bulldog using CADs from their Earl.

 

Wouldn't that be too samey though ?

A Bulldog and a Dukedog would look very similar to the majority of railway modellers and collectors surely ?

As do the U and N to me, much as I like the chunky look of them, especially as mixed traffic moguls

 

I agree with the poster that the "K" would be a good choice of being an older loco but which lasted into early BR 1960s with a good period of livery choice - well BR black or BR black or erm LBSC !!! 

[Covkid]

On 07/01/2020 at 14:48, The Johnster said:

A decent 5-plank open, a decent Fruit D, an Iron Mink, a decent 2721 or 1854, a Collett 31xx, a rebuilt Taff Vale A class,  57xx/8750/64xx panniers and Dukedogs without top feeds, a 54xx, more non gangwayed stock that isn't B sets, A43/4 'Cyclops' auto trailers (admittedly these are BR (W) rather than GW), Collett BG.  Retooled sunshines and toplights would be nice, but of no interest on my BLT.

 

On 07/01/2020 at 15:06, tomparryharry said:

 

Well, I too would like a decent little non-topfeed pannier. An early 57xx pannier would be just the thing. You really need to engage with Hornby, but I'd guess that you won't see one until the Large Prairie makes its debut. 

 

For people with a certain predeliction for things Western, it would appear that 'the trade' is a bit more open these days towards polite requests. We can lead, but demands are a no-no. No, we won't see an Aberdare or any such rare jewellry, but the bread  might have a better class of butter, if you get my drift. Dean Sidings and his successors might be the way to go.

Happy modelling,

Ian.

 

 

 

I would agree with GWR or BR(WR) non corridor stock. Every year tis a letdown !!  But hey

Not so sure about the GWR panniers though.  The Bachmann 8750 and 57xx aren't that rough are they ?

 

Why suggest going to Hornby for the pannier when Bachmann already produce more of the GWR pannier range ?

I would prefer Bachmann to make 2020 the year of the Suburban non corridor coach.  

[tomparryharry]

1 minute ago, Covkid said:

 

 

I would agree with GWR or BR(WR) non corridor stock. Every year tis a letdown !!  But hey

Not so sure about the GWR panniers though.  The Bachmann 8750 and 57xx aren't that rough are they ?

 

Why suggest going to Hornby for the pannier when Bachmann already produce more of the GWR pannier range ?

I would prefer Bachmann to make 2020 the year of the Suburban non corridor coach.  

The Bachmann panniers are nice little models; I've got a couple or 3 sitting around here. What Bachmann fail to realise, is that some panniers had quite a long life without topfeed.  The Hornby models do indeed portray the locomotive in an earlier period.

 

It comes down to the wallet. If I like it, I'll buy it. If not, well.... 

 

Ian.

[Dungrange]

On 13/01/2020 at 16:05, TomScrut said:

The thing with the Autoballasters is they would probably be able to just about get away with one run of the non-generator ones. These are simpler than the generator ones but based on eBay experience are the most in demand. 7 non generator ones went last night for a combined £345. So over £49 each for second hand Railtrack ones! OTOH I am trying to sell my 3 generator ones for £40 each (what I bought them for but have changed my mind on them) and they aren't going anywhere.

 

I agree that there would be no need to produce any more generator ones.  I've got two generator fitted JJA's and four without a generator (albeit two have the same number), so I have enough for a five car set.  I'd be tempted to buy another four without generators, but that would be it.

 

That said, if Bachmann were to announce just one of the non generator variants (probably the round top variant), I'm sure that there would be some complaints from people that they couldn't go into their local model shop and purchase a prototypical rake.

[The Johnster]

On 12/01/2020 at 13:47, Steamport Southport said:

 

Please ignore my spurious quote of Steamport Southport...

 

GW parallel boilers were often common to more than one class of loco, so that the same boiler could be fitted to 2721, 57xx/8750 and the 67xx/6750/97xx condensing panniers, and I believe a similar situation pertained between 14xx/58xx, 54/64/74xx, and 16xx.  Dean Goods and Dukedog boiler were interchangeable as well I think, but would not swear to it.  

 

This means that boilers got swapped around between suitable locos at overhauls.  The reason for this was not a plot to make things difficult for modellers many decades later, although it is very effective in this role; it is because, while it takes about 3 weeks to overhaul a loco, it takes 4-5 weeks to overhaul a boiler.  So, in order to return the loco to traffic sooner and avoid blocking workshop bays, the overhauled boiler that happened to be available that day was put in the loco, while the boiler it came in with ended up on a different loco a week or so later.  If the system failed to provide an overhauled boiler, there were spares to get the loco back into traffic earning money.

 

Now, newly constructed boilers began to be fitted with top feeds, covered in a housing and with the associated pipework, in the early 30s (I'm sure someone will be able to provide us with a date).  But it isn't as simple as saying, for instance, that all 57xx/8750s built after that date had top feed boilers and all those built before it had back feeds, not visible from outside the loco.  This works for newly built locos, but locos are overhauled when they have reached a specific mileage and a workshop bay becomes available.  An early 57xx may have had a working life of 35 years + during which it will have been overhauled half a dozen or so times, all of which will involve a different boiler being fitted, with the presence of a top feed being pot luck.  A late 96xx series might equally well have only one overhaul during it's working life, but the top feed boiler it was fitted with from new might be replaced by a back feed one at that overhaul.  Some 2721s were fitted with top feed boilers and then reverted to back feed in their final years.

 

This is a minefield for modellers of GW locos with parallel boilers.  Unless you are modelling fairly newly built locos that have not had. their first overhaul yet, there is very little to confirm with any certainty that your prototype did or didn't have a top feed boiler, unless you are fortunate enough to have verified and dated photographic evidence.  This is not so rare in the case of the well-photographed Dukedogs, but akin to rocking horse doo doo with the panniers, the situation becoming less easy to get a handle on over time.  It's sort of Schroedinger's top feed, which can be said to simultaneously exist and not exist for the purposes of quantum modelling...

 

This is the basis of the top feed angst expressed by the likes of myself and Tomparryharry.  I would rather see the locos modelled in back feed boiler form and the top feed and associated plumbing being available to retro fit. or at least as removable separated pieces. but Bachmann's policy is that all panniers have top feeds all the time.  I have 2 57xx and 3 8750s, all Bachmann, and have removed the top feed from one loco only, numbered as 5707 in early BR condition.  I am, frankly, guessing this, and the only certainty is that the locos was built with back feed, in 1926.  5756 has a top feed, verified by photograph, 6762, 9649, and 9681 are newish locos at my period and must have had them, so I'm on fairly safe ground with those 4.  I also have a Hornby 2721, 2761, which has no top feed and there is photographic evidence that the loco was withdrawn in this state, so I'm happy with that one as well.

 

The Baccy panniers are excellent models in all other respects, with as much detail as one can reasonably expect from volume RTR, and they are very smooth performers with good slow running capability.  I am very happy with them.

Edited January 15, 2020 by The Johnster

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

On ‎12‎/‎01‎/‎2020 at 14:05, No Decorum said:

... a nice big, fat GWR tank loco would have done the job, would they not? 

You may not know this, but at that time Swindon was persisting in a major gauge error, so the answer is 'no'.

[Steamport Southport]

Seeing as we are probably going to be mostly getting reliveries of current tooling, the open goal must surely be Crimson LMS Compounds. They've still not done one. There were only 195 of them after all.

 

 

 

Jason

[Downer]

Another open goal would be a plain green Class 44, which as far as I know they’ve never done. 

[The Johnster]

1 hour ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

You may not know this, but at that time Swindon was persisting in a major gauge error, so the answer is 'no'.

But the GW had a works at Wolverhampton which was turning out standard gauge big fat saddle tanks at the time, so the answer is 'possibly, but they'd have to be tender loco versions'.  What the GN really needed was track to GW standards, and it got it later, leading to it being one of the early British proponents of big boilers, a policy which proved very successful for it.

Edited January 15, 2020 by The Johnster

[ThaneofFife]

maybe they will announce a retool of their Mk1 range to include DCC on Board?

But if not I reckon the Mk1 Blue Grey Sleeper will be announced in SLC guise on commonwealths.

they need to guard their class 20 future proof against the new players stealing their thunder......Heljan are doing the 47 and accura the 37 and 55.

The AL1 is worth a bet.

I was thinking about the class 303 EMU as I am sure this would only require 2 x toolings for a 3 car unit.  The outer driving cars appear identical to my eye. Not sure if the Gresley bogies could be lifted straight from their existing Gresley coaches........at least for the unpowered bogies.  I learnt too that some 303 had the later carmine and cream livery which could be added to the original blue train livery the blue grey era and the red and black strathclyde livery unless the windows were changed mid life?.   Maybe they shared the same style of pantograph with the Class 85 loco?

 

[Legend]

Err I still don’t think people have quite got that February announcement will be about EXISTING projects . 

[daltonparva]

6 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Seeing as we are probably going to be mostly getting reliveries of current tooling, the open goal must surely be Crimson LMS Compounds. They've still not done one. There were only 195 of them after all.

 

I've been banging on this particular drum for years, usually in Mr Lovett's ear at York show, with a generally non committal response. However, at last year's Derby exhibition I had a bash at his younger replacements, and got the response "I suppose it is about time we did one"; so I am now as optimistic as I have ever been that it might actually come to fruition.

[Markwj]

1 hour ago, Legend said:

Err I still don’t think people have quite got that February announcement will be about EXISTING projects . 

The impression I had from Andy's post is that it is existing products and reliveries but there may be new announcements if they are far enough along the development process. If this is not the case will Bachmann just announce new products as we go through the year? I would agree though I can't imagine there would be anything more than the odd brand new model announced like last year was there just one new Wagon announced in OO?

[No Decorum]

9 hours ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

You may not know this, but at that time Swindon was persisting in a major gauge error, so the answer is 'no'.

I was only pulling The Johnster’s leg. By the time the big fat GWR tank loco I had in mind came along, broad gauge had long gone and the GNR was only a memory.

[No Decorum]

2 hours ago, Legend said:

Err I still don’t think people have quite got that February announcement will be about EXISTING projects . 

A dull catalogue, then.

[Legend]

8 hours ago, No Decorum said:

A dull catalogue, then.

 

But possibly more realistic .   I feel sorry for Bachmann . Announce new models and be met with derision that we will get them in 5 years . Announce nothing in the hope of recovering the backlog and be met with criticism for being boring .

 

Best course of action is the one they are taking , update on where they are with models already announced and maybe some exciting reliveries . The LMS Crimson  Rambler seems a good one . Then maybe give us a surprise in the year.

 

[Phil Parker]

9 hours ago, Markwj said:

The impression I had from Andy's post is that it is existing products and reliveries but there may be new announcements if they are far enough along the development process.

 

No. New. Models. At this stage anyway.

 

4 minutes ago, Legend said:

 

But possibly more realistic .   I feel sorry for Bachmann . Announce new models and be met with derision that we will get them in 5 years . Announce nothing in the hope of recovering the backlog and be met with criticism for being boring .

 

Best course of action is the one they are taking , update on where they are with models already announced and maybe some exciting reliveries . The LMS Crimson  Rambler seems a good one . Then maybe give us a surprise in the year.

 

 

I think the Thomas range couldn't have come at a better time. No need to compete with Hornby's announcements, instead concentrate on shipping an already existing product (in the USA) to lots of places that you've never delivered to before. I suspect the Boys from Barwell are going to have a busy time unloading containers for a while.

[No Decorum]

7 minutes ago, Legend said:

 

But possibly more realistic .   I feel sorry for Bachmann . Announce new models and be met with derision that we will get them in 5 years . Announce nothing in the hope of recovering the backlog and be met with criticism for being boring .

 

Best course of action is the one they are taking , update on where they are with models already announced and maybe some exciting reliveries . The LMS Crimson  Rambler seems a good one . Then maybe give us a surprise in the year.

 

I feel sympathy too. There has been a succession of difficulties causing the notorious delays and the reputation persists. Now, however, I see Bachmann products starting to come through as fast as I can cope with them. What products too! It isn’t only the panto on the Class 90; the lighting control is spot on. Expensive Mk. IIs perhaps but tail lights on coaches at last! I venture to add that models wear liveries which are consistently good.

 

Before anyone says it, things do go wrong, I know. I like Bachmann products but I’m not as uncritical as the above might suggest.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

11 hours ago, No Decorum said:

A dull catalogue, then.

No catalogue with a V2 in it can ever be dull. Bachmann have already said this is their lead release for 2020 and if they deliver on that this drysider is made up. (Have the Thompson coaches in maroon out as well, joy unbounded.)

[TomScrut]

So are they not doing any reruns or fresh liveries either? Thought it was just new tooling they weren't doing?