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Bachmann 2020 Range

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Clearly a brilliant marketing ploy by Bachmann to generate more interest in their products on this forum. Froth and wishlisting can now be a quarterly ritual with the inevitable 'nothing for me this quarter' after each issue. Still there is always next quarter.......

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I've yet to receive my Bachmann Times and Combined etc. But hang on a second, I'm beginning to feel a bit cheated here. Perhaps I will change my mind when I see it.... BUT

 

The marketing for the Bachmann club includes a catalogue every year... thats their offer included with the last BT of the year. (Older members year started in July)

 

We have subscribed on the basis that is what Bachmann have committed to.

 

Maybe the combined is as good as a Catalogue.... or maybe its just this year to get Bachmann out of a hole.

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Not sure i’m too keen on this revised approach...

 

ive nothing to look forwards to, until its here..then ive got to scramble if I want it.. but no plan to save in advance as I don't know what to expect...a £500 EMU or a £5 accessory.

 

Its not easy for retailers to plan either.. a customer asking whats best, the shop cant give an answer.. if someone wants a mk2f.. do you refer them to Hornbys timeline and livery choices, or say a say wait for a Bachmann one that may never be made ? 

 

Maybe they too dont know whats coming until it arrives. It sounds a bit “wrenn” and their limited special releases,  All feels to me a bit (edited) sad.

 

 

Edited by adb968008
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Got my 'Combined Volume' yesterday. Half of it repeats the information on 00 items that I received in last year's catalogue and the other half information on models in scales I have no interest in. On that basis I fail to see the point of it and it's gone straight to recycling!

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35 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

Not sure i’m too keen on this revised approach...

 

ive nothing to look forwards to, until its here..then ive got to scramble if I want it.. but no plan to save in advance as I don't know what to expect...a £500 EMU or a £5 accessory.

 

Its not easy for retailers to plan either.. a customer asking whats best, the shop cant give an answer.. if someone wants a mk2f.. do you refer them to Hornbys timeline and livery choices, or say a say wait for a Bachmann one that may never be made ? 

 

Maybe they too dont know whats coming until it arrives. It sounds a bit “wrenn” and their limited special releases,  All feels to me a bit like a slow sunset of retreat from the market.

 

 

 

I don't know if you've noticed, but Bachmann have been pilloried for too large a gap between announcement and arrival of models. Now you are doing the same because they wish to fix this. I think it's unlikely we'll see models appear on the shelves before anyone has heard of them. More like a year/18 month warning, not 5.

 

And no, I don't think it means they are retreating from the market, although after all the constant criticism, I wouldn't blame them leaving the UK for Canada...

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1 hour ago, Phil Parker said:

 

I don't know if you've noticed, but Bachmann have been pilloried for too large a gap between announcement and arrival of models. Now you are doing the same because they wish to fix this. I think it's unlikely we'll see models appear on the shelves before anyone has heard of them. More like a year/18 month warning, not 5.

 

And no, I don't think it means they are retreating from the market, although after all the constant criticism, I wouldn't blame them leaving the UK for Canada...

People can say what they think about Bachmann or any supplier (within limits obvs.) Human nature means you're more likely to hear the negative views on any given subject. This should not be surprising or annoying...

 

Who said anything about Bachmann retreating from the UK market? Why even raise that possibility? (Edit: Sorry, I see it was mentioned above but I don't think someone in the know should be referring to it for fear of starting more rumours.)

 

Edited by Harlequin
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I think the concern is whilst they have the issue at the moment of announcing stuff too early, giving only 3 months notice isn't ideal either (is this what they have said or speculation?). If it was a year or so I don't think anyone would complain, long enough to save up and plan without it being lost in the ether. And that's also how most of the other manufacturers work too as far as I am aware? It's when it's 4 or 5 years where people don't know where they stand that's the issue I think?

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10 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

To quote from the letter accompanying the Combined Volume.  (my bold highlights)……

 

2 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Its not easy for retailers to plan either.. a customer asking whats best, the shop cant give an answer.. if someone wants a mk2f.. do you refer them to Hornbys timeline and livery choices, or say a say wait for a Bachmann one that may never be made ? 

 

The quotes from Ron Ron Ron appear to confirm what I suspect (what "new" means). We will (still) not be getting updates on the timing of re-releases of existing models in new liveries, just "new tooling". Whilst I fully support the new approach to the timing of announcements, I really don't understand why the quarterly announcements/updates won't include ALL releases not just new tooling. An image of a livery sample, for example, may go a long way in encouraging me to pre-order. Sight unseen and I will wait, and maybe by then have bought someone else's model, taking the example mentioned by adb968008.

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1 hour ago, Phil Parker said:

 

I think it's unlikely we'll see models appear on the shelves before anyone has heard of them. More like a year/18 month warning, not 5.

 

Thats the first time ive seen someone in authority give some clarity on timescales.... all other posts say 3 months.

 

18 months is a fairly average headway, but do I have to assume on that basis theres no as yet new unknown tooling to surprise us until July 2021 at least ?

 

if I am not allowed to have feelings of  a slow retreat, then i’ll reword it to say.. I just feel sad about Bachmann instead.

 

Ive been a big fan of their models, but I am spending less on Bachmann than I used to, but I dont feel thats down to my changing tastes.. my spend elsewhere is up. 

One issue I see is duplication, I still like some of my Bachmann locos, despite other vendors tooling them.. but do I wait and see if Bachmann decides to do a certain livery maybe sometime whenever.. or take the bird in hand for risk of missing out ? Personally I prefer to know and wait within reason, than just be sprung a surprise... my wallet likes that too.

 

 

Edited by adb968008
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24 minutes ago, brushman47544 said:

The quotes from Ron Ron Ron appear to confirm what I suspect (what "new" means). We will (still) not be getting updates on the timing of re-releases of existing models in new liveries, just "new tooling".....

....I really don't understand why the quarterly announcements/updates won't include ALL releases not just new tooling.......


To be fair, I don’t think it says that at all.

There’s a subtle difference in the wording.

They talk about unseen re-llivery and new tooling products.

“Completely new”, in this context, I take to mean all items not previously in the range, to include both re-liveries and completely new tooled models.

 

 

Ron

Edited by Ron Ron Ron

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31 minutes ago, Ron Ron Ron said:


To be fair, I don’t think it says that at all.

There’s a subtle difference in the wording.

They talk about unseen re-llivery and new tooling products.

“Completely new”, in this context, I take to mean all items not previously in the range, to include both re-liveries and completely new tooled models.

 

 

Ron

 

21 minutes ago, Wickham Green said:

How complete is complete ?

 

Exactly. In English the word "completely" is redundant unless it is meant to distinguish between something "new"  and something "completely new". The way it's quoted, the reference to unseen re-livery and new tooling products appears to be related to the content of the new catalogue, not the quarterly announcements. Re-liveries could include a new variation of a livery that has already been produced and I don't consider that to be in the same category as an all new tooling, so not completely new.

Edited by brushman47544
Improve clarity

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They refer to totally new models as “new tooling products”.

”Completely new” is only used in the context of announcements of additions to the range of available items.

 

It is inconceivable that they will not pre-announce re-livery or re-issues and somehow just sneak them out without warning.

 

 

Ron

Edited by Ron Ron Ron

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58 minutes ago, AY Mod said:
Quote

In response to customer and consumer feedback, we have taken steps to reduce the lead time between the announcement and release of new products.

 

 

What a polite way of saying "Due to the whingers on RMWeb...." :jester:

Edited by 57xx
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It is an expected sort-of letter/press release that any good director would issue to keep his business in the public eye. 

 

I do expect to see lots of panniers & 56xx models, along with generic toad brake vans for years & years to come. I'll expect to see a van branded 'Ventnor West' in due course, as the geography thins out. With 800-odd panniers, and 200-odd 56xx, times a 3-yearly release, the future's looking bright. 

 

"In the year 25-25...."

 

Cheers,

Ian.

 

 

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18 months or so is fine by me; in fact I’d be quite happy if models were announced the day before they are in the shops.  As one of the principal whingers on RMWeb (though I like to think I balance it with due praise), I see no need to be ashamed if my actions have led a major manufacturer to change their policy!

 

Being a major supplier to a market such as our hobby’s, where long lead times combine with instant whinging from the likes of me, criticised for announcing too soon and having to announce price increases, or of undermining other efforts if somebody else beats you to the punch, isn’t much fun, and occasionally events outside the company’s control intervene and make things worse.  I love RMWeb, but know at least one retailer who complains that it’s full of moaners!

 

Tbh, I’d be happy if someone announced a model for 2030, if I could be reasonably sure it was going to appear in 2030.  But blue box have some way to go to restore that sort of confidence from, and any further 94xx sagas will not help...

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9 minutes ago, The Johnster said:

 

 

 .....and any further 94xx sagas will not help...

 

Whatever you do, don't mention the **xx models. I very nearly did, but I think I've gotten away with it.......

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Well damned if they do damned if they don't . Its really a no win for Bachmann . But then they got themselves in this position in the first place. Looks like they are taking steps to get out of backlog, although there's still quite a lot to get through . But I'm wondering if they've now made it more complicated than it need be  .  They used to claim that the catalogue represented items to be released in the next 12-18months  and maybe 6 or 7 years ago that was close , even if maybe 2 years fruition . Its really since Kader reorganised that there have been issues , indeed some models announced then , like the 158 and 90 are only now appearing . so its the 5 to 6 year lead times that have resulted in derision and lack of credibility.  But I'm puzzled as to why there needs to be an announcement every 3 months ,certainly for models that are 18 months away,  unless its to bolster interest in the Collectors Club . I let my membership lapse , as although a fine magazine I found it was increasingly becoming irrelevant to me . The decision not to do the calendar with paintings was really the decider  .

 

I think most folks recognising there was still a catch up would have been happy with a catalogue that showed what reliveries are coming and maybe new models planned for the next 12-18 months , in other words get back to the old position even if that meant there were no new toolings for the next couple of years.

 

No need to buy the new combined edition if its essentially just last years catalogues combined.

 

Just hope the 94XX saga is not replaced by the Rails 812 saga .2 years in ,come the end of next month, its not making much progress.

 

 

Edited by Legend
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5 hours ago, Ron Ron Ron said:

It is inconceivable that they will not pre-announce re-livery or re-issues and somehow just sneak them out without warning.

 

I agree. I am more concerned about the reliveries that have already been announced in previous catalogues but not a sight nor sound of since. Let's hope we do get progress reports/announcements on them too from now on.

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I have been looking forward to Bachmann's Bulleid coaches ever since the were announced.

An update in 2020 on progress would do me fine, it's the not knowing that's frustrating.

OK they will come one day and I am sure they will be superb, hopefully they have, or are about

to leave the drawing office.

 

Wishing as always all the best to Bachmann.

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I want a proper catalogue, I see no point in spending money on a publication two thirds of which is completely irrelevant!

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9 hours ago, Phil Parker said:

I don't know if you've noticed, but Bachmann have been pilloried for too large a gap between announcement and arrival of models. Now you are doing the same because they wish to fix this. I think it's unlikely we'll see models appear on the shelves before anyone has heard of them. More like a year/18 month warning, not 5.

 

I fully understand why Bachmann are changing how they announce things.  But I have to agree, I don't think the proposed new system is all that great and adb968008 would seem to have a point that it is going to be difficult to budget for Bachmann items, which won't be great for either the customer or Bachmann (who could end up with stuff in the warehouse because people don't have the budget to buy it).

 

Nowhere have Bachmann stated that there will be a 12 to 18 month warning - I agree it can sort of be implied by the following statement (from letter posted by Andy Y):

 

"New tooling announcements will no longer be illustrated by black and white photographs of the original prototype, replaced instead by pictures of our actual models."

 

That could mean 12 to 18 months if they mean EP photos, or it could be 6 months or less if they mean final paint sample photos.  The statement is too ambiguous for us to know.

 

But that confusion only applies to new tooling.  Specifically, the following quote from the Bachmann letter posted by Andy Y:

 

"feature a new product brochure, highlighting completely new items to be released during the following three months."

 

Based on this statement, a second release of the crane, another release of the Blue Pullman, or any number of (relatively) expensive(*) items could be announced with less than 3 months before arrival - thus leading to a scramble to try and juggle the hobby budget or more likely deciding the item will need to be skipped.

 

Personally, I hope (if the above assumptions are correct) that Bachmann reconsiders otherwise they are simply going to be having unhappy customers and retailers again but for the opposite reason - items arriving too quickly.

 

* - I am not complaining about the cost of items, I think they are all acceptable prices - but some items can take a big hit of a hobby budget, particularly if that budget has already been allocated to saving up for other companies products that have allowed more lead time to save.  There is a difference between the imminent arrival of a goods wagon vs a 4-car EMU in the hit to the budget.

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