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Meursault 2019


Philou
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In this shot there are two covered bogie wagons (sorry it's fuzzy but the train was on the move and I didn't set the camera to flash). These seem to be similar to stock that is currently being used on steel trains in the UK especially on the South Wales mainline. There are referred in the UK as 'SNCF' wagons for carrying steel coils. In another thread, someone made reference to UK stock formations with these particular wagons within them. What I would like to know is this:

Are these the same wagons? If so, who makes the model? What is the UK TOPS designation (it's something like INA but it's not that and I couldn't find any reference to them)? If they're not the same as the UK ones, is there a model of them and by whom? Here's the picture ......

 

P1010372.JPG.b154abbd2dc1e6d5af068cea56950cb3.JPG

 

 

There are a few other pictures that I took and if you would like to see them just leave a reply and I'll post them up (about another four or so).

 

Anyway, hope you enjoyed all the ones above.

 

Cheers et bonne nuit,

 

Philip

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On 08/12/2019 at 22:01, Philou said:

This next layout (diorama?) was based on a real location ................

 

 

P1010337.JPG

But look at the sleepering (perhaps a little clean) bleached but more correctly the split ends wire-strapped just like the real thing and all in HO. Also I spotted that the timbers were spaced out more correctly reducing the distance apart on approaching the fish-plates - top marks IMHO ....... (next post)

 

 

 

 

Hi Phil

Thanks very much for these excellent images.

I'm sure you could produce a reasonable facsimile of the frettes, the steel bands used by SNCF to stop the ends of wooden sleepers splitting, with common office staples However these are far more detailed and look like the ones supplied, on an etched brass  fret of 350, by Decapod. 

https://www.decapod.fr/equipements-voies-et-aiguillages/257-frettes-sncf-ho--2001500032209.html

they also offer dummy fishplates and almost every conceivable lineside item from emergency telephones and mileposts to several types of heurtoir (buffer stop) and assorted planking for level crossings.

Though it's not difficult to make one for yourself ( have so it must be simple),  Apogee Vapeur produce etched brass templates for spacing sleepers precisely within a panel according to the practice of different companies (including SNCF and the Paris Metro) and types of track,

If you cut out the webs of say Peco track, it's possible to space the sleepers very well with some kind of template. Doing the same with pointwork is rather more tricky!  

https://www.apogee-vapeur.ch/collection-vmm/gabarits-de-pleine-voie

Edited by Pacific231G
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Ah ... there we are. I have learned something new today as I knew nothing about the frettes or their availability. I was making the comment as I'd never seen it before (except on the 1:1 version). I shan't probably use any as I'm into UK stuff and unless I'm mistaken, they're not used, probably as the UK timbers are/were imported from Australia made from Yarrah (or is it Yarrow). It seems to be of a different profile - the UK timbers being rather squarer. I don't know what the timber is used in French sleeperwork - at a guess homegrown and perhaps more prone to splitting. It seems also that the profile is not as deep as the UK ones, (might be an illusion, or my eyesight, regarding the profile) which may affect their resistance to splits.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

Added to say that there was a discussion on another thread regarding sleeper spacing when panels were being made up - it depended, as you mentioned, company policy (GWR, LNWR etc., UK-wise) and also, the length of the panel itself. Again, another item that I did not bookmark at the time :(.

 

Edited by Philou
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9 hours ago, Philou said:

In this shot there are two covered bogie wagons (sorry it's fuzzy but the train was on the move and I didn't set the camera to flash). These seem to be similar to stock that is currently being used on steel trains in the UK especially on the South Wales mainline. There are referred in the UK as 'SNCF' wagons for carrying steel coils. In another thread, someone made reference to UK stock formations with these particular wagons within them. What I would like to know is this:

Are these the same wagons? If so, who makes the model? What is the UK TOPS designation (it's something like INA but it's not that and I couldn't find any reference to them)? If they're not the same as the UK ones, is there a model of them and by whom? Here's the picture ......

 

P1010372.JPG.b154abbd2dc1e6d5af068cea56950cb3.JPG

 

 

There are a few other pictures that I took and if you would like to see them just leave a reply and I'll post them up (about another four or so).

 

Anyway, hope you enjoyed all the ones above.

 

Cheers et bonne nuit,

 

Philip

The SNCF (actually France-Wagon)  covered coil carriers used in the UK are slightly smaller than their mainland counterparts. I've done a couple, using left-over bits of  Tiphook wagon that I'd 'modified'. Here is a link to some photos:- https://ukrailwaypics.smugmug.com/UKRailRollingstock/I/IHA/

 

Scenically, the models at Meursault seemed to be of a pretty high quality. Regarding SNCF wooden sleepers; they are domestically sourced. One source is Epoisses (where the cheese comes from), between Montbard and Dijon; there is another near Brive-Gaillarde in Quercy.  I suspect the reason for the 'bound 'ends is that the yield per tree can be increased, in the same way the SR used wide and narrow planking.

Edited by Fat Controller
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I have an idea that UK gauge steel carriers may have been produced as a kit by Acopoca.

 

Those sleepers are just the right colour. Many lines in France have pine sleepers (from the Landes) and they do weather to a shade of grey. UK sleepers are hardwood and treated. So they stay much more brown. 

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@Fat Controller Thanks for the info regarding the IHAs. As for the moment they're not being made commercially for the UK market (though Cavalex seem to be working through the catalogue of UK steel carriers - so you never know) I wondered if I could get some as placeholders. In my mind, as the Euro-gauge is more generous than the UK one, at the slightly reduced scale size (1:87 v 1:76.2), would they look out of place?

 

And thanks to you and @Joseph_Pestell for the sleeper information.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

Edited by Philou
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6 minutes ago, Philou said:

@Fat Controller Thanks for the info regarding the ILAs. As for the moment they're not being made commercially for the UK market (though Accurascale seem to be working through the catalogue of UK steel carriers - so you never know) I wondered if I could get some as placeholders. In my mind, as the Euro-gauge is more generous than the UK one, at the slightly reduced scale size (1:87 v 1:76.2), would they look out of place?

 

And thanks to you and @Joseph_Pestell for the sleeper information.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

Given the enhanced loading gauge on the Continent, the cross-sectional loading gauge of mainland stock in H0 is a reasonable fit. Amongst other items, I've stretched a Lima 'Tiphook' Debache-vit to scale length, using parts of two wagons. Sat on a pair of decent sized bogies, it has the presence of the prototype. The left-over bits of hood, are used, in conjunction with scratch-built ends and underframe, to build a French 'Shorty' coil carrier.

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If anyone is interested the Orelle-Prémont layout is in the latest issue of the Peco Guide to Modelling French Railways. Here's a reminder:

 

P1010379.JPG.aa1c5e35b1500199c0f0c8e41a1ef84b.JPG

 

This is one the photos that I hadn't posted up last week.

 

I may have given some mis-leading information about this layout and the Maurienne one as it is quite possible that although adjoining one another, there may well have been no physical connection - although I do have to say that the modelling styles were very very similar.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

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On 09/12/2019 at 22:18, Philou said:

In this shot there are two covered bogie wagons (sorry it's fuzzy but the train was on the move and I didn't set the camera to flash). These seem to be similar to stock that is currently being used on steel trains in the UK especially on the South Wales mainline. There are referred in the UK as 'SNCF' wagons for carrying steel coils. In another thread, someone made reference to UK stock formations with these particular wagons within them. What I would like to know is this:

Are these the same wagons? If so, who makes the model? What is the UK TOPS designation (it's something like INA but it's not that and I couldn't find any reference to them)? If they're not the same as the UK ones, is there a model of them and by whom? Here's the picture ......

 

P1010372.JPG.b154abbd2dc1e6d5af068cea56950cb3.JPG

 

 

There are a few other pictures that I took and if you would like to see them just leave a reply and I'll post them up (about another four or so).

 

Anyway, hope you enjoyed all the ones above.

 

Cheers et bonne nuit,

 

Philip

Bonsoir, Phillipe!

Are you referring to the covered "Fret SNCF" bogie wagons between the gas tanker and the wagons with steel coils visible?

I strongly suspect they will be by Roco as I have some very, very similar wagons but mine are in different liveries.

I'd love to know who makes the 'open' coil carriers but they may well be Roco too.

My next guess would be Piko as they have a large catalogue of really good quality wagons available but - expensive!

Many thanks for the photo report, it is most interesting.

Cheers,

John.

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Bonsoir Jean!

 

Yes, those are the wagons. There were similar ones in 'Railion' colours. I raised the question if the wagons photographed on the layout were the same wagons used on the steel freight workings between Margam and Newport via Cardiff Central referred to as 'SNCF' wagons. Currently I'm slowly collecting different steel carriers that run on the SWML. The Fat Controller had indicated that the models are the same as the UK TOPS IHA wagons - but of course the Roco ones are to HO rather than OO scale.

 

I think I have seen the other steel carriers advertised. I will see if I can find the ad and I'll post it later.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

Edited by Philou
Can't tell my ILAs from IHA
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5 minutes ago, Philou said:

 

The Fat Controller had indicated that the models are the same as the UK TOPS IHA wagons - but of course the Roco ones are to HO rather than OO scale.

 

 

From what I can gather these are a continental design built to the British loading gauge, in a similar way that the Tiphook JRAs are closely related to their European relatives!

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Regarding other coil types available if 4mm:

Bachmann cover the BAA/BRA and BYA

Cambrian do the BAA and BBA

Cavalex make the BBA, along with covered variants

Dapol used to make a VTG/ Tiphook sliding-roof wagon.

Quite a reasonable selection, I think.

This site often has reports of new/modified types of steel-carrying wagons in France:-

https://lapassiondutrain.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2019-12-20T18:30:00%2B01:00

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9 minutes ago, Fat Controller said:

Regarding other coil types available if 4mm:

Bachmann cover the BAA/BRA and BYA

Cambrian do the BAA and BBA

Cavalex make the BBA, along with covered variants

Dapol used to make a VTG/ Tiphook sliding-roof wagon.

Quite a reasonable selection, I think.

This site often has reports of new/modified types of steel-carrying wagons in France:-

https://lapassiondutrain.blogspot.com/search?updated-max=2019-12-20T18:30:00%2B01:00

 

Not forgetting the soon to be available JSAs converted from former BSC 100 tonne tipplers from Accurascale in both covered form and more recently modified without hood for hot rolled coil. https://accurascale.co.uk/collections/jsa-coil-carrier

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  • 3 years later...

Hi @SimonHMT, Glad you liked the photos. Covid put paid to the following Meursault show and I haven't been to another big show since.

 

However, our club did do a small open door (no entry charge) show earlier this year. They do Junior Modules mostly made by members of the club - 135m running length!

 

Here are a couple of photos (apologies for the poor quality, small hand-held camera) if you're interested in French layouts:

 

P1020009.JPG.5d0eb2703c41e3626db7e3c4f48bb9a9.JPG

 

^ This is a model inspired by a viaduct near the club - its name is 'le saut du mouton' (the sheep jump). It was an avoiding line from the station at Culmont-Chalindrey towards Gray. The line to Gray was lifted years ago but the viaduct plus the track remains and is linked now to the main Dijon - Metz line, but little used. Modellers' licence has been used regarding its position over the double track.

 

P1020014.JPG.0e992c56a77d07f434a2918540c1eeea.JPG

 

^  A view of the main line under the saut de mouton.

 

P1020022.JPG.475d7b8e69a11796db957f6756465b5b.JPG

 

^ There is a cutting very similar to this not far from where I live except the real thing is double tracked. It's literally cut the village through which it passes, in two.

 

P1020029.JPG.4020a0257706064bf23101839f9cb748.JPG

 

^ This module belongs to someone from the south of France who drove 500 miles just to exhibit at our show! I thought the modelling was very good - pity I hadn't seen the 'object' on the rails before I took the photo.

 

Cheers,

 

Philip

 

 

Edited by Philou
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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks, Philip...sorry i didn't reply before, life has been a bit busy lately so I forgot! 

The modular set-up is most impressive, I love the wide, sweeping curves and open scenery. Unfortunately, all the various layouts I've built so far have had to fit in very small spaces, however, hopefully that will change soon. 

In the late 1990s/early 2000s, I visited France quite a bit, attending several model railway shows and also standard and narrow gauge preserved and abandoned lines...at the time, I started on a standard gauge "secondaire" but other things got in the way and it was never finished, with most of my stock etc. being disposed of. More recently, I've been collecting older RTR models, kits and other items so that I'll be able to build something once I have time and space to do so.

Kind regards, 

Simon. 

 

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