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Scotrail Mk2 Coaches - query

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Hi all,

 

Ref to - mk.2E Open First (FO)  3221–3275

 

Farish do this coach (nearly) as 3265 in Scotrail Provisional livery.

 

But I can find nothing to confirm that the coach was in Scotrail livery - unless I have missed it somehow!

 

So, before I go and strip it to proved the basis for tuning it into a Caledonian Sleeper RFO, is the model correct?

 

Thanks

Phil H

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1988 Platform 5 book has 3247, 3248 and 3265 as ScotRail livery, PXXX (Provincial General) pool and allocated to EC (Craigentinny).

Provincial livery has a different code letter, so I presume the entry to mean proper ScotRail livery. I think there were some coaches in Provincial with a ScotRail blue stripe, but these were non-a/c mk2 or 2a?

 

Edited by keefer

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Hi Keefer,

 

Thanks for the info - much appreciated.

 

Looking at my notes I must never have seen this coach in service!

 

Off to find another donor FO coach to go into Caledonian Sleeper livery.

 

Phil H

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2 hours ago, keefer said:

1988 Platform 5 book has 3247, 3248 and 3265 as ScotRail livery, PXXX (Provincial General) pool and allocated to EC (Craigentinny).

 

Plus 3245 as well.

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“But I can find nothing to confirm that the coach was in Scotrail livery - unless I have missed it somehow!”

 

Careful,  there may be errors in the allocations within the P5 books...

 

 

 

Edited by bigP

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2 hours ago, bigP said:

“But I can find nothing to confirm that the coach was in Scotrail livery - unless I have missed it somehow!”

 

Careful,  there may be errors in the allocations within the P5 books...

 

 

 

True there are errors but the 1987 Platform 5 book lists all the ScotRail coaches correctly, as does the 1988 Ian Allan ABC. The 1986 Ian Allan ABC has 3265 at Craigentinny but no note for ScotRail. This is incorrect as I saw 3265 at Dundee on 9 July 1985 and noted which of the rake were in ScotRail livery.

155722282_1985Scotland10.jpg.5e4af9632705c43e4a70166d6f08a52b.jpg

 

Edited by Flood

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I think this is the best place to put this.

I'm trying to see if there is a reference for which blue grey MK2 coaches had varying branding.

 

Inter-City

Inter-City ScotRail

ScotRail

 

I have a few copies of photos I got from 80's rail before it disappeared, looking for some more options

 

Thanks

Mark

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I'd create a new post for that question. Not many will see it buried at the bottom of another query.

 

 

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All Mk2 air braked stock carried Inter-City from 1970 (I think) onwards. The date is in Harris but I'm at work. This includes the Mk2z stock converted to air brakes for the Edin - Glas push-pull and Mk2a air braked stock that was converted to vacuum brakes between 1976 and 1978. A very small number of Mk2z vacuum braked TSO coaches also got Inter-City in error.

 

Inter-City Scotrail (small r) was carried for a very short time. As you have said 80s Rail had some examples, I can check Railway Observers from 1984/85 when I get home and they may have a few but don't hold your breath. The vast majority of Polmadie Mk2d and Mk2e stock solely carried Inter-City.

 

ScotRail was carried by the Mk2 air-braked Provincial allocated stock for the Inverness services, including 6607 which later was used on push-pull services. The Craigentinny Mk2a and Mk2c stock for Cross-Country kept their Inter-City branding.

 

ScotRail was also carried by Mk2z stock for the West Highland and Aberdeen - Inverness services, these were allocated to Polmadie and Inverness respectively.

 

Once I get home tonight I'll see if I can find any more info.

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15 hours ago, Flood said:

All Mk2 air braked stock carried Inter-City from 1970 (I think) onwards. The date is in Harris but I'm at work. This includes the Mk2z stock converted to air brakes for the Edin - Glas push-pull and Mk2a air braked stock that was converted to vacuum brakes between 1976 and 1978. A very small number of Mk2z vacuum braked TSO coaches also got Inter-City in error.

 

Inter-City Scotrail (small r) was carried for a very short time. As you have said 80s Rail had some examples, I can check Railway Observers from 1984/85 when I get home and they may have a few but don't hold your breath. The vast majority of Polmadie Mk2d and Mk2e stock solely carried Inter-City.

 

ScotRail was carried by the Mk2 air-braked Provincial allocated stock for the Inverness services, including 6607 which later was used on push-pull services. The Craigentinny Mk2a and Mk2c stock for Cross-Country kept their Inter-City branding.

 

ScotRail was also carried by Mk2z stock for the West Highland and Aberdeen - Inverness services, these were allocated to Polmadie and Inverness respectively.

 

Once I get home tonight I'll see if I can find any more info.

Cheers 

 

What I have so far is 

 

Mk2a BSOT 9100 Sc

Mk2      TSO 5170 Sc

Mk2a    TSO 5273 IcSc

Mk2a  BFK 17083 IcSc

Mk2c  TSOT 6514 Sc

 

It's all Mk2a Farish I have 

 

Wish I'd got hold of more photos of 80's when it was on the go

 

Cheers

 

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DBSO 9706 carried 'Inter-City Scotrail' before being involved in the Polmont crash - there's a pic on Robert Carroll's Flickr.

The only other pic I remember seeing was a mk2e TSO at Carlisle - iirc it was PO allocated

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Posted (edited)

June 1984 Railway Observer, stock noted late April

Scotrail

4205, 4704/74, 4904/15/6, 5082/91, 5132/43/8/51/5/70/4/91/6, 5201/7/21/7, 9003/7/12, 9364, 9145

 

July 1984 R.O. (approx. late May 1984)

Scotrail

1863 (one side), 7227, 18798, 18901

 

August 1984 R.O. (approx. late June 1984)

Scotrail

4221/93, 4316, 4561, 4750/63, 4850, 4902, 5083/91/3/6/7, 5102/17/24/8/9, 5217, 9001/5/8/11, 9383/9, 9401/7/13/4, 14024, 19089, 19172, 35123

Inter-City Scotrail

9706/7, 11006

 

October 1984 R.O. (approx. late July 1984)

Scotrail

18896, 25376, 35116

Inter-City Scotrail

5272, 11004, 12005/24/6/58

 

November 1984 R.O. (approx. late Aug 1984)

Scotrail

18304, 18865, 1898, 24882, 35338, 35477

 

December 1984 R.O. (approx. late Sept 1984)

Scotrail

5282, 5327, 9451, 18303

Inter-City Scotrail

3248/65/84, 5146/52/3/97, 5333/52, 5623/73, 5711/26/40/55/62/95/6, 5820/2/3/8/9/36/9/42/3/78/91, 6607, 9423/8/36/60, 9701/2/3/8/9, 11005/7/8/10/43, 12007/8/9/11-7/20/2/3/7/8/50, 13411

Full ScotRail livery

5176, 5653/71, 6601, 9705/10, 12009/15/9/25/9/51

 

February 1985 R.O. (approx. late Nov 1984)

ScotRail/Scotrail?

4749/55/78, 18252

Inter-City Scotrail

5761, 5802/89/98

Full ScotRail livery

6605, 9701, 11005, 12004/17/20/2/3/4/30/1

 

April 1985 R.O. (approx. late Jan 1985)

ScotRail/Scotrail?

4096, 4582, 4758, 4911, 5125/45/83, 5540, 6510, 9006, 13380, 17003, 19120, 21072, 35122

Full ScotRail livery

5740, 6613, 9704/9, 11005/6/10, 12005/7/27

 

June 1985 R.O. (approx. late March 1985)

Scotrail (really? more likely the ScotRail style)

4472, 5271, 6514/8, 7221/38, 9000, 9273, 17021, 18296, 18381

ScotRail

3284, 5082/3/93/7/9, 5102/25/39/51, 5392, 9383, 9413/6/34, 17024 (many changed from Scotrail variant)

Inter-City Scotrail

5271/3/9, 5831, 9444, 13558

Inter-City ScotRail

9428

Full ScotRail livery

5153, 9707/12, 12014

 

August 1985 R.O. (approx. late May 1985)

Scotrail variant now stated as almost extinct

ScotRail

5086/91, 5114/7/24/8/9/43/8, 5359, 9016, 9382, 9407/14/5, 18357/85, 18405, 35062, 35340

Inter-City Scotrail (stated as now mainly seen on Glas/Edin - Inverness/Aberdeen services)

5279, 5300, 5830/83, 7561, 9425/51/60

Full ScotRail livery

12026 plus 12019/51 repainted from dark stripe to light stripe

 

This was the last mention of fleet names on blue and grey stock, subsequent observations are of full ScotRail repaints. Note that quite a few of the Inter-City Scotrail Mk2e stock were then being repainted into Executive livery.

 

Edited by Flood
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great stuff Flood, i'd no idea this had been covered by the RO - livery maybe, but not the branding.

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Posted (edited)

wasn't really able to post links before:

mk 2f DBSO SC9706 at Edinburgh 13/04/84: https://flic.kr/p/bgLQK6

mk2e TSO SC5834 + another at Carlisle 26/09/84: https://flic.kr/p/cBqf6w (that's the pic I was thinking of but doesn't mention Polmadie - I must've read that somewhere else. Or was that where most of the mk2e were allocated?)

 

 

 

Edited by keefer
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