tortoise point motors

[todeni]

I am building a new layout and want to use my tortoise point motors, but need to make new actuator arms, what wire do I need as a search of the net has not revealed any spare ones. Does anybody have any experience of replacing them please?

Thanks Guys

Todeni

[RFS]

I replaced the actuator wire on my Tortoises as, after the points had been ballasted, the supplied wire wasn't strong enough to be completely reliable. What you need is some piano wire easily available from multiple Ebay sellers such as this one:-

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/39-Sizes-0-152mm-to-1-600mm-Piano-Wire-39-inches-3ft-3-1-metre-Length/383139417952?hash=item5934e38f60:m:mUEiHdOH2pvUzfmiCbTIHlw

 

I found size 16 widely recommended and this is the one I used. You will need a thin file (or drill bit) to open out the hole slightly in the fulcrum. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by RFS

[brossard]

Agree, the 0.020" wire supplied is way too wimbly.  I obtained some 0.032" steel wire which works much better.  As an aside, I believe Cobalt motors from DCC Concepts come with 0.032" wire.

 

John

[Michael Edge]

.8mm piano wire is much better than the wire supplied with the point motors, still goes through the hole in the fulcrum and can be pushed into the crank arm.

[gordon s]

That’s what I use Michael. It equates as size 13.5 from a similar eBay supplier. Hugh Craig Harpsichords trading as Global Wires.

Edited December 24, 2019 by gordon s

[Phil Bullock]

Another vote for piano wire - used reliably on Abbotswood

 

 

[jpendle]

I find that Tortoises can't cope with the spring in Peco N Gauge points, I'm sure it's worse in OO and above. If that's the issue, it begs the question, why not remove the spring and let the Tortoise do it's slo-mo thing?

 

Regards,

 

John P

[brossard]

1 hour ago, jpendle said:

I find that Tortoises can't cope with the spring in Peco N Gauge points, I'm sure it's worse in OO and above. If that's the issue, it begs the question, why not remove the spring and let the Tortoise do it's slo-mo thing?

 

Regards,

 

John P

 

It would be my practice to remove the spring, it serves no purpose when the Tortoise operating wire locks the turnout.

 

John

[Foden]

Agree with the above, it seems a little contradictory to use a slow-mo point motor for realism (amongst other benefits) and then still have the switch click over as it operates.

 

And then there is the issue of the polarity switch changing over whilst the switch blades are still held against the travel momentarily, which in some instances can cause a short circuit to occur on Electrofrog points.

 

Removing the spring is but a moments work with a fine pair of tweezers or very fine pliers.

[RFS]

8 hours ago, Foden said:

And then there is the issue of the polarity switch changing over whilst the switch blades are still held against the travel momentarily, which in some instances can cause a short circuit to occur on Electrofrog points.

 

Not if you've modified the points to completely isolate the frog as recommended. Also the changeover switch in the Tortoise is not instant but works with the motion of the blades so there's little chance of a short occurring if you've not modified the points. This sort of problem only arises if you've used a fast-acting relay that is wired together with the motor to change polarity. 

[Foden]

33 minutes ago, RFS said:

 

Not if you've modified the points to completely isolate the frog as recommended. Also the changeover switch in the Tortoise is not instant but works with the motion of the blades so there's little chance of a short occurring if you've not modified the points. This sort of problem only arises if you've used a fast-acting relay that is wired together with the motor to change polarity. 

Fair point regarding the isolation, however I’d think most people who go to this effort would also make the step to remove the spring if using a slow action anyway.

 

I can’t speak for the Tortoise but I’ve certainly had this polarity short circuit with Cobalt point motors where the polarity changes over before the resistance of the spring is overcome. In this instance I changed from Seep motors on a small layout I bought s/h. The points were not modified as lifting the track to do so was undesirable.

[ELTEL]

On the the YouTube video Chadwick Model Railway Charlie Bishop suggests 1mm Wire 

He also suggests drilling out to 1.2 mm the hole that secures the wire.

 

Hope it helps

 

Seasonal Greetings 

 

Eltel 

 

[doilum]

In 7mm, 0.9mm wire from Eileen's Emporium. The motors are controlled with a 4 pole changeover switch (one set unused) which also feeds the frog. There are only 3 points on Houghton Street.

[todeni]

Thanks to you all for your help and ideas, I thought it would be piano wire but was stumped as to the size. Thanks again folks and for the links to obtain some.

Happy modelling in 2020

Regards,

Todeni

[beast66606]

On 24/12/2019 at 19:56, jpendle said:

I find that Tortoises can't cope with the spring in Peco N Gauge points, I'm sure it's worse in OO and above. If that's the issue, it begs the question, why not remove the spring and let the Tortoise do it's slo-mo thing?

 

Regards,

 

John P

 

We left the springs in place for the fiddle yard points, gives a far more positive action. Tortoise motors can drive the points easily enough with a replacement wire as mentioned above. We had 80 of them, changed by Tortoise, in the fiddle yards including double slips and 3-ways - all worked almost 100% prefectly over several years, lots of shows and a huge amount of direction changes - we had very few failures (less than 5 failures in total over the years) of either a Tortoise or a Peco point.

 

For the scenic section I'd agree that letting the motor hold the blades over is better looking and of course for hand built points there is no option.

 

Make sure you get some hard wire cutters (Xurons for example) otherwise you will damage your normal cutters.