RMweb Gold Barry Ten Posted February 2, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 2, 2020 Will you be using the full depth of the boards, Rod? I wasn't sure how to deal with those ribs that come down the back on mine, so in the end I built the backscene forward an inch or so, concealing the ribs but at the same time losing a valuable bit of layout width, which irked a bit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 2, 2020 Author Share Posted February 2, 2020 2 hours ago, Barry Ten said: Will you be using the full depth of the boards, Rod? I wasn't sure how to deal with those ribs that come down the back on mine, so in the end I built the backscene forward an inch or so, concealing the ribs but at the same time losing a valuable bit of layout width, which irked a bit. Good question! There will probably be a mixture of full and partial relief buildings and some trees to help disguise them, but I haven't yet come to a complete solution to it. Your method is interesting, but as you say losing one of the valuable 18 inches depth isn't ideal. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 4, 2020 Author Share Posted February 4, 2020 Dropper positions drilled and wires poked through prior to soldering (having checked they were not conflicting with any of the board cross-members beneath). The wire colours do mean something, but I was also using up some scraps of thinner gauge wire for this. As long as they are all annotated on a plan and underneath it doesn't really matter. This will be DC cab control with about 5 sections, but it's pretty simple compared to other layouts I've wired. Common sense prevailed and I decided against turning the three connected boards all as one unit on my own. So I'm separating them to do them individually. And yes, I did remember to cut through the rails at the board joints first! I used a razor saw for this, making use of the slight gaps between the boards for guidance. This allows for a neater cut without the wastage that you always seem to get if using a minidrill and slitting disc. You can put a sheet of thin card between the boards of the same thickness as the disc if you want to do it that way, and then removing the card so that the rails close up nicely, but I'd forgotten to do that anyway. None of this bit is specifically French of course ... 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 4, 2020 Author Share Posted February 4, 2020 On 29/01/2020 at 18:50, Joseph_Pestell said: I see in the Peco Spring Newsletter that Wills are to do tuiles mecaniques or, as they strangely call them, lozenge tiles. But if in their usual small format, probably not big enough for a station building. Ah good, so you haven't seen the join on mine using the pantiles ... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 5, 2020 Author Share Posted February 5, 2020 (edited) Signal kits have arrived (from Rotomagus, based near Rouen). Instructions are a separate download. This will be fun ... The website www.rotomagus.com has some useful YouTube links, not for the construction itself but the mode of operation using DCC and various servos to rotate the signals. I imagine you could adapt a Tortoise or similar to do the rotation, but that's more expense and there may be a rod/gear/twiddle stick solution. Edited February 5, 2020 by 10800 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 12, 2020 Author Share Posted February 12, 2020 Just received after winning on Ebay - old Nucast whitemetal kit for an FNC X5600 autorail. The castings are not bad at all, and it should be fine with a suitable modern motor/gearbox. The photo shows one with a remorque about to leave Montpellier for Paulhan, Faugères, Bedarieux and Lamalou-les-Bains, just in my neck of the woods! 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianp Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 16 hours ago, 10800 said: Just received after winning on Ebay - old Nucast whitemetal kit for an FNC X5600 autorail. The castings are not bad at all, and it should be fine with a suitable modern motor/gearbox. The photo shows one with a remorque about to leave Montpellier for Paulhan, Faugères, Bedarieux and Lamalou-les-Bains, just in my neck of the woods! I bought one of those old kits (on Ebay) a couple of years ago. A word of warning - the parts do not fit. Repeat: the parts do not fit. If you want a ready-to-run version of that autorail, you can buy this one made by R37: https://www.jura-modelisme.fr/44-autorails/s-6/fabricant-r37/categories_2-autorails By the way, I applaud this layout. My parents spent many years enjoying summer holidays in a house overlooking Bedarieux. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rue_d_etropal Posted February 13, 2020 Share Posted February 13, 2020 The Atlas Editions model is pretty good, if you can still find one. I motorized one using one of the Bachmann Tracksters/Highrails bus chassis(current one). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 13, 2020 Author Share Posted February 13, 2020 I'm sure the RTR one is very good, but so it should be for 300 Euros! Actually most of these whitemetal kits of that vintage can be made well enough with some judicious filing, bending and filling, and trial fits out of the box suggest it's not that bad. Afterwards I thought about the Atlas, but I have an Atlas 'Amphibie' to convert already and this FNC should be a bit of fun. I have today bought a High Level Pacemaker to run it with a Mashima 1220. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Barry Ten Posted February 13, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 13, 2020 I've got the R37 one, I like it quite a lot but there are aspects of the design which aren't quite what you'd want for the price, such as the internal wiring being quite visible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Oldddudders Posted February 13, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 13, 2020 1 hour ago, Barry Ten said: I've got the R37 one, I like it quite a lot but there are aspects of the design which aren't quite what you'd want for the price, such as the internal wiring being quite visible. I find the R37s don't run very well, and the market has been slow to absorb them, compared with the Mobylette by Rail87 (the same chap in Tours, I think) which preceded them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Joseph_Pestell Posted February 13, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 13, 2020 On 12/02/2020 at 16:42, 10800 said: Just received after winning on Ebay - old Nucast whitemetal kit for an FNC X5600 autorail. The castings are not bad at all, and it should be fine with a suitable modern motor/gearbox. The photo shows one with a remorque about to leave Montpellier for Paulhan, Faugères, Bedarieux and Lamalou-les-Bains, just in my neck of the woods! I developed a replacement chassis for that with NuCast/Autocom. I don't know if we could get some more done. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 14, 2020 Author Share Posted February 14, 2020 Another package from France just arrived contained the example ogive and the three Midi masts from Atelier CJ Models. For the money I was expecting they might be at least partially made up - silly me; they were just etches and bits, albeit very nice ones in nickel silver. The bigger bag above goes with the masts below. So today I made a start with the basic structure of the ogive. The main H-section girders are made by seam soldering three pieces together. After I removed the parts from the fret I realised, unlike with any other kit I've built, that the tabs on the curved profile should have been left on instead of cleaning up, because there are slots in the outer pieces to assist with locating them. Oh well. But there are extensions on the inside to help with that, so I did the inner one first. I used an Antex iron, 'Building O Gauge Online' safety flux (which basically seems like dilute citric acid) and 145 degree solder. To administer the flux I used a syringe which enables a minimal amount to be used. I could have used an RSU but you need to use a very narrow bit to get inside the H-section so the Antex was fine. I pre-bent the outer pieces to help with soldering - gentle pressure between thumb and finger, trying not to make any sharp bends. I was able to get in and out with the iron quickly enough to just use my hand to hold the pieces together, although once or twice I singed my fingers a bit. I found that doing it like this gave me better control over centreing the parts, just tack-soldering first in case of any misalignments before completing the seam-soldering later. The outer one was surprisingly easy to fit and tack this way. After doing the two sides, ensuring that they lie flat, you can now Blu-tak them to the template provided to make sure they are symmetrical, and then you can join the two halves together with the half-etched sections at the top. Then solder the brass channel 'crossbars' to each side. You now have a pretty robust basic ogive. These things are quite big! The pantographs on the locomotive are at full extension because they are not constrained by the catenary wire. On the layout the pans will be compressed by the contact wire. I then continued with one of the basic masts. This is a job where the RSU does come into play, although I still had the Antex switched on and used whatever felt more appropriate for each operation. The double lattice is an overlay (reminding me of the Kemilway footbridge on Balcombe) and the structure is very similar in construction to a lattice signal post. To be continued ... 8 1 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted February 14, 2020 Share Posted February 14, 2020 Amazing to think that, sixty-five years ago, two SNCF locos exceeded 300 kph under similar 'Ogive' catenary in the Landes; a speed record for a locomotive that remained in place until 2006. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Re6/6 Posted February 15, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 15, 2020 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Allegheny1600 Posted February 15, 2020 Share Posted February 15, 2020 Many years later, (i'm fairly sure!) SNCF admitted that it was only BB9004 that hit 331 Km/h - CC7107 fell slightly short but only by a few Km/h. 320.6 Km/h according to Wiki (Railway speed records/electric). That's still 199 Mph though - very impressive for a machine with six wheel bogies. REE Modeles have produced a model of CC7107 complete with streamlined shrouds and equally streamlined coaches, quite amazing really. Rod, amazing work on the catenaires - I didn't realise you had to assemble the H sections yourself, sorry! John. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 15, 2020 Author Share Posted February 15, 2020 Thanks John! At least I now have the fret and template so it should be possible to make up our own with suitable H-section, channel, strip and wire; somewhat cheaper than three more kits! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted February 23, 2020 Author Share Posted February 23, 2020 (edited) Earlier this week John Farmer (Re6/6) came round and we started to map out the catenary. I probably only need two more ogives, which will be hand-built, and the three masts I have, plus a pull-off mast which I can make out of some MSE lattice signal frets that I bought before I found out about the CJ Atelier kits (I've also now found the online instruction downloads for the ogives and the masts, especially helpful for the latter!). But before any of that can be installed, I need to get back to track wiring and ballasting first, so today I have been mostly wiring ... I was deliberating between operating switches etc mounted on the front of the layout boards and having a separate (detachable) panel. I've decided on the latter because it will be more flexible between home/exhibition, one operator/two operators, and front/rear operation. If operating from the back and if we can't see over the back of the board I can also incorporate a camera with the monitor on the back so the operators can see what they are doing (and the panel will be upside down in this situation!). So, starting with the left board following on from the 4 February post I soldered the droppers and fitted the single Seep point motor for that board. Some scribbling on a layout plan gave me a rough idea of the scope of the underside wiring. The droppers and point motor wires were all collected to a tag strip near the right hand end of the board. The other side of the tags will be linked to a suitable D-connector to plug in to the centre board, which will be the 'nerve centre' because it has three of the four points and parts of all five cab control track sections. The control panel will connect to the centre board but via a long enough cable that it can be attached virtually anywhere on the layout as required. The Tim Horn baseboard strengthening framework provides convenient half-moon shaped apertures on the underside of the trackbed which virtually eliminated the need for cable ties and other devices for keeping the wires out of harm's way. I'm not one for these super-neat rectilinear wiring loom attachments underneath - as long as it works and everything is labelled it can go anywhere. Having decided on a separate panel, I wanted to keep the layout front entirely clear, and in order to operate from front or back I put the left end controller DIN socket underneath as well (this photo also shows the point motor). I retrieved the DIN sockets from an old panel (and the two-way selector switches for allocating each section to either of two controllers) - actually the panel for Balcombe from the days when it was DC - and then found that the cross-members were more of a hindrance, especially when drilling a 16mm hole for the socket. A right-angle drive on the drill helps, but that's quite bulky as well, so the hole was at a bit of an angle, but the wood is quite thin so no real problem. Maybe I should have planned all this in advance and avoided this, but nobody thinks that far ahead - do they? So next is the D-connector and then a thorough continuity check on all the wires; then I can hook up some temporary power and check up top that the trains run and the point works as it should before moving on to the next board. Edited February 23, 2020 by 10800 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted March 1, 2020 Author Share Posted March 1, 2020 (edited) Rather than run trains on the first board, which would have involved an inconvenient set of jump leads, I moved on to wire up the centre board and do the control panel. I still need to fit the point motors on the centre board, pending the arrival of some milling bits for the drill to make cutting the slots easier - I also discovered that in concentrating on not having droppers conflicting with the underside framework I forgot about the tiebars and ended up with one right over the top of one. It's then that you find how difficult it is to remove a chunk of the framework to make room for the point motor (cf previous post). Suffice to say that a bit of imagination and use of old Xuron cutters, tin snips and pliers came into play. But it's done now - bit of a mess but nothing too serious. So, on to the panel. Very simple, plasticard (quite thick, 60 or 80 thou I think) fascia and bits of odd timber for the frame. Most of the switches were recovered from the old DC panel for Balcombe, although I had to buy some new ones for the points and signals. Here's the front, with the track plan made from self adhesive tape designed for decorating radio controlled cars. The 25-pin D-connector is mounted on the underside and connects to a 1.5m cable linking to the centre baseboard - so I can easily move the panel to anywhere on the layout as the situation requires. The switches are all colour coded - blue for controller selection (centre-off, moving left to right), black for points (centre-off with sprung bias), red or yellow for signals and white to enable isolation of either of the two yard sidings. I might add some labels but there's really no need. The business side looks like this, with all the track and points wiring done. The big 4-pole switches are for the signals in due course. A bit OTT but the carres need 3-pole to allow for the mechanical rotation and light configurations. Wiring is gathered together with cable ties to bring a bit of neatness. Exposed D-connectors will have covers fitted when it's all tested and working. I have used a ribbon/rainbow cable loom for the connection to the layout. This one has 20 wires and of course the number of connections required is 21. So I'm using separate (and heavier gauge) wires for the two positive controller track feeds, and combined two of the ribbon wires for the only common return connection to the panel (for one of the siding isolators). I've not really used ribbon cable much before - it's quite light gauge compared with normal hook-up wire and I hope it doesn't result in any voltage drops. If it does I'll just have to replace it with individual leads bundled together. I have acquired some servos for the mechanical component of the signals, and some controller boards from MERG, so it will be fun setting those up (another new experience). These will need another D-connector, probably a 15, for which I have left room to fit. Edited March 1, 2020 by 10800 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted March 6, 2020 Author Share Posted March 6, 2020 After all the wiring, played trains today for the first time. Just one or two minor glitches to sort. 11 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted March 8, 2020 Author Share Posted March 8, 2020 (edited) Today I got the jigsaw out and cut out the holes at both ends of the layout for the exits to the fiddle yards. At the double track end I marked out the outline of the ogive for the hole, but for now only cut it to 90mm above rail level. This should be enough to give headspace for the catenary but it can be extended if needed. I nearly caught myself out at the single track end because I had laid the track so close to the end - initially I cut it above rail level to avoid damaging the track, with the intention of just carefully drilling a series of holes for the lower section, but fortunately the first drilled hole caused the glued joint to fail at that point and the remaining piece just fell out! The double track exit is very close to the front of the board, so I can't disguise the hole in the sky with a tree or building, which means you can see into the fiddle yard with all the cassettes, the operator's coffee mug etc. So I tested an idea to mask this using a 'black tunnel' from a sheet of plasticard I had handy. Ignore the green tape (pretend it's a bit of vegetation) but a properly built version would probably solve it, and could also include the system of rising contact wire to allow pantographs to engage and disengage safely. The details of this are yet to be designed ... On another subject the 'playing trains' has revealed some stock needing wheel replacements because the flanges are too deep for the Code 83 Tillig. I knew the Jouef 'Picasso' was one, but it also affects this set of Fleischmann all-steel 6-wheelers (originals built in the 50s!) that I picked up on Ebay a while ago - and I have a photo of some on the Beziers-Bedarieux line. So I've ordered a quantity of replacement wheels. I'll also have to replace some older couplings and try and standardise those a bit more. And I must remember to block the exits temporarily to stop me inadvertently driving trains off the end! On that subject what kind of buffer stops would have been used in the yard? Anything that is similar to UK prototypes of will I have to scratchbuild them? I'm conscious that these posts are all a bit scattergun in subject, but that's how it is! To continue in that vein the next one might (or might not) be about annealing H-section brass to make my own ogives (only two more needed); and while I'm on holiday in a week's time I plan on making the signals if we are prevented from going out by adverse weather. Edited March 8, 2020 by 10800 6 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Stubby47 Posted March 8, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 8, 2020 If you made the tunnel straight sided, rather than curved, you could make the top gently slope down towards the scenic divide to a level below that of the pantograph wire. It might need a stiff wire fixed to the sloped roof. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Barry Ten Posted March 9, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 9, 2020 14 hours ago, 10800 said: Today I got the jigsaw out and cut out the holes at both ends of the layout for the exits to the fiddle yards. At the double track end I marked out the outline of the ogive for the hole, but for now only cut it to 90mm above rail level. This should be enough to give headspace for the catenary but it can be extended if needed. I nearly caught myself out at the single track end because I had laid the track so close to the end - initially I cut it above rail level to avoid damaging the track, with the intention of just carefully drilling a series of holes for the lower section, but fortunately the first drilled hole caused the glued joint to fail at that point and the remaining piece just fell out! The double track exit is very close to the front of the board, so I can't disguise the hole in the sky with a tree or building, which means you can see into the fiddle yard with all the cassettes, the operator's coffee mug etc. So I tested an idea to mask this using a 'black tunnel' from a sheet of plasticard I had handy. Ignore the green tape (pretend it's a bit of vegetation) but a properly built version would probably solve it, and could also include the system of rising contact wire to allow pantographs to engage and disengage safely. The details of this are yet to be designed ... On another subject the 'playing trains' has revealed some stock needing wheel replacements because the flanges are too deep for the Code 83 Tillig. I knew the Jouef 'Picasso' was one, but it also affects this set of Fleischmann all-steel 6-wheelers (originals built in the 50s!) that I picked up on Ebay a while ago - and I have a photo of some on the Beziers-Bedarieux line. So I've ordered a quantity of replacement wheels. I'll also have to replace some older couplings and try and standardise those a bit more. And I must remember to block the exits temporarily to stop me inadvertently driving trains off the end! On that subject what kind of buffer stops would have been used in the yard? Anything that is similar to UK prototypes of will I have to scratchbuild them? I'm conscious that these posts are all a bit scattergun in subject, but that's how it is! To continue in that vein the next one might (or might not) be about annealing H-section brass to make my own ogives (only two more needed); and while I'm on holiday in a week's time I plan on making the signals if we are prevented from going out by adverse weather. I scratchbuilt some concrete buffer blocks, but I don't know how suitable they'd be for your project. I also made up some laser-cut ones (from Decapod I think( that are more like a British buffer stop. https://www.decapod.fr/115-heurtoirs 3 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Controller Posted March 9, 2020 Share Posted March 9, 2020 Just had a quick gander at Google. After a brief diversion into door knockers (also heurtoirs..), I found the following:- https://trains.lrpresse.com/A-15657-18-heurtoirs-de-differents-types-6-tableaux-fixes.aspx and https://www.google.com/search?q=heurtoir+ferroviaire&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwji283Dmo3oAhXSbsAKHWT0DzMQsAR6BAgJEAE&biw=1840&bih=864 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
10800 Posted March 9, 2020 Author Share Posted March 9, 2020 Thanks for those links (it helps to know what they are called) - 'un vaste sujet' as one of the images rightly refers! Some look like UK ones, others like Exmouth Junction products on steroids. Some research needed! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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