OO inspiration needed

[gobbler]

Happy new year all.

 

Ive come across some peco code 100 bits and bobs,  a bit of 4.6 x 20inch piece of 9mm.  Sat there thinking......ive built all these wagons and coaches but nowhere to run them.

As you can see space is limited.  Ive got the class 31 parked near the top. A J72, J34 and V1 near the green splotch.

 

I model Easten region transition period, these a class 37 and a scratch nearly built N7, are my locos of choice, i also have a cravens 105 and a partially scratch built Wickham 109.

 

Btw the green splotch is possibly a brewey 

CD cattle dock,

Just above is the goods yard with coal and possibly some oil.

Station and bay.

 

Ive a LH and RH points spare and plenty of flexi.

 

Hints tips and ideas please 

 

Cheers

 

Scott

[mdvle]

No ideas at the moment, but some clarifications that may help others:

• what is the dimensions - you seem to be saying 4.6" by 20" but that doesn't seem right based on the picture
• assume can't go beyond the baseboard
• any openness to additional track purchases or only what is currently available

[Robert Stokes]

I think that the scheme you have sketched out needs a bigger board.

 

Robert

[gobbler]

I'll get my tape measure out over the weekend, otherwise its a case of how longs a piece of string.

 

It may be a case of running smaller loco's only.

 

There is a chance to lengthen it too.  Another 2ft or so.

 

Thanks

 

Scott

[mdvle]

Accurate dimensions are always a good first start as it makes providing suggestions that will work easier.

 

In the meantime you may also want to take a look around the Micro-Layout section which sort of specializes in what you want to attempt

 

https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/forum/151-boxfiles-micro-layouts-dioramas/

 

[Pete the Elaner]

You have squeezed a lot onto those boards. If you want it to look semi-realistic, you'll struggle.

If you want something on which to have fun shunting, then go for it.

Since you live in Colchester, maybe Colchester Town can provide some inspiration?

Back in the 70s, when it was known as St Botolph's, it was a double track terminus. Platform 2 was never used; there was a military wagon (with a tank?) permanently dumped there.

There was a disused yard where the car park is & behind the remaining platform was a factory of some kind which I think had rail access.

My memory of it is vague because I was very young, but if you imagine much shorter platforms, it may help you to visualise something.

[gobbler]

Right.....got the tape out and done some measuring up.  I have 2 9mm ply boards.

 

1) 11" 1/4' x 76" or 285 x 1930mm

2) 20" x 48"  or 510 x 1220.

 

The way i see it, i have 3 main options.

1) have a L shaped layout

2) keep the wider shorter piece and have it flanked either end by some sort of fiddle yard.

3) cut the longer thinner piece into 3 at 510mm and lengthen the wider short puece by 855mm thus one effective board of 510 x 2105mm

 

So, with my available material, what would your suggestions be.  They've all got their own merits.  It will be portable, probably not show standard by the time ive finished with it.  OO/4mm and have an eastern region flavour around the time of transition. 

 

Thanks in advance 

 

Scott

Edited January 6, 2020 by gobbler

[Robert Stokes]

I reckon that length is the most important. I'd go for the top one but maybe slide the two sides back a bit.

 

Robert

[Harlequin]

Don’t spoil the ship for a ha'p'orth of tar.

Why deeply compromise the layout for the cost of a sheet or two of ply?

 

[gobbler]

Harlequin, i basically have no budget, probably will never have, properly.  But i want to start something.  Built quite a few wagons, coaches and other stock, on my scratch building thread, and want/need somewhere to run them.

 

I've come across these 9mm ply boards, and not wanting to turn my nose up, I thought could do something with these.

 

The ultimate distance is shown below.

10'4" 3150mm

 

 

Of course, may even get more length in by adding a bridge or small viaduct into the line.

 

On the above I envisage station and goods in the 510mm wide board, with a scenic run in from the probably a cassette system past a bridge.

 

Ive just sketched this

 

Track plan a very simplified southminster.

 

Well, thats what my minds eye sees at the moment.

 

Thoughts?

 

Cheers

 

Scott

[gobbler]

Done a qhick feasibility test.

 

You can see how much space is gobbled up by the point work and a 3 coach train having a run around loop.

 

I think another double slip is required to the two road engine shed, just below the class 31.  The rest is pretty close to my dketch above.  The points also miss the base board join too.

 

Pinching the double slip from the bay, this is how it will look.

 

I'd like to see a 3 coach service running here, but 2 coaches were prototypical. 

 

Cheers

 

Scott

[Pete the Elaner]

Engine sheds are often at the other end of the station. This would allow for a release loco instead of a run round loop, which is a more modern type of operation but would give you an excuse to have more locos on the layout.

Would a cattle dock be p[art of the station or part of an adjacent goods yard?

By having a viaduct so close to the station, it makes the area very open & therefore harder to hide any scenic breaks.

I found that trying to cram too much onto past layouts left me with something dissatisfying & it took me several layouts to learn to avoid it.

[Baby Deltic]

With the length of baseboard you have, really a Station served by 2 carDMU’s like your Wickham Class 109 would be realistic. You could run in loco’s with a few wagons maybe to serve a warehouse which would make a good back-scene to hide the fiddleyard. I wouldn’t go for the L shaped layout because the curves required will eat up valuable operating space for the station. You need to really have a long enough platform for a 3 car DMU or N7 with a couple of Gresley suburban’s. A small head-shunt with a double slip and kickback to the warehouse would be good with maybe a couple of sidings to store loaded or empty vans. 

[gobbler]

11 minutes ago, Baby Deltic said:

With the length of baseboard you have, really a Station served by 2 carDMU’s like your Wickham Class 109 would be realistic. You could run in loco’s with a few wagons maybe to serve a warehouse which would make a good back-scene to hide the fiddleyard. I wouldn’t go for the L shaped layout because the curves required will eat up valuable operating space for the station. You need to really have a long enough platform for a 3 car DMU or N7 with a couple of Gresley suburban’s. A small head-shunt with a double slip and kickback to the warehouse would be good with maybe a couple of sidings to store loaded or empty vans. 

 

Any chance of a diagram to explain your idea above?

 

DMU's would all be two car, apart from pictures from 1960 onward, haven't seen any pictorial evidence to suggest longer DMU's were used upto the transitional date I'm modelling.  Coaching would be of GE corridor, Gresley and Thompson suburban stock. 

 

The diagram of Southminster shows the two road engine shed at the correct end, the only thing missing in this area is a 55ft turntable, which comes off the little spur from the engine shed road.

 

I could use shorter radius points, but i think it would make it look more 'trainset' like, rather than a model.

 

I may re-lay the track tonight for a two coach loop and see what that looks like.

 

Cheers

 

Scott

[Baby Deltic]

4 hours ago, gobbler said:

 

Any chance of a diagram to explain your idea above?

 

DMU's would all be two car, apart from pictures from 1960 onward, haven't seen any pictorial evidence to suggest longer DMU's were used upto the transitional date I'm modelling.  Coaching would be of GE corridor, Gresley and Thompson suburban stock. 

 

The diagram of Southminster shows the two road engine shed at the correct end, the only thing missing in this area is a 55ft turntable, which comes off the little spur from the engine shed road.

 

I could use shorter radius points, but i think it would make it look more 'trainset' like, rather than a model.

 

I may re-lay the track tonight for a two coach loop and see what that looks like.

 

Cheers

 

Scott

I’ll do a sketch tonight if I get home from work at a reasonable hour.

[Baby Deltic]

4 hours ago, gobbler said:

 

Any chance of a diagram to explain your idea above?

 

DMU's would all be two car, apart from pictures from 1960 onward, haven't seen any pictorial evidence to suggest longer DMU's were used upto the transitional date I'm modelling.  Coaching would be of GE corridor, Gresley and Thompson suburban stock. 

 

The diagram of Southminster shows the two road engine shed at the correct end, the only thing missing in this area is a 55ft turntable, which comes off the little spur from the engine shed road.

 

I could use shorter radius points, but i think it would make it look more 'trainset' like, rather than a model.

 

I may re-lay the track tonight for a two coach loop and see what that looks like.

 

Cheers

 

Scott

The reason I mentioned 3 car DMU’s is really just to give some idea of the sort of platform length I was thinking of.

[DCB]

If you look at full size terminus plans rather than model ones, you will find the run round loop point is almost always the first point trains encounter.  Often 10 coaches in length/ 40 wagons or more.   To make it workable I would put a double slip in and extend the run round as shown.  That way you can easily run round any train the Cassette will hold. The Long siding by the signal box could go to slim down the approach if it looks too busy.

Edited January 7, 2020 by DavidCBroad

[The Johnster]

Engine sheds are not essential and my personal preference is not to have them on BLTs.  In reality they depend on the timetable; does the first train of the day originate here or at the junction station.  This depends on the traffic requirements, so if the main flow is for commuters into town and the town is at the junction, a shed is needed at the terminus and possibly a carriage siding as well.  If, OTOH, a train is required earlier in the morning from the junction end for the newspapers and mail bags off overnight expresses, then you can dispense with the loco shed, as the first train up the branch delivers the papers and mail, and then forms the commuter service into town.  This leaves room for a decent goods yard, with a shed, end loading dock, coal siding, and mileage road, making your shunting more interesting and providing a purpose for various different moves.  Keep the cattle dock the other side of the station and operating the pickup and keeping it out of the way of the passenger traffic makes it more fun for the signalman...

 

I'd avoid 3-way turnouts and slips as well; IMHO they need complex wiring which induces unreliability, and are unlikely on a lightly used branch line in reality, being expensive to fabricate and maintain and used in locations where heavy traffic coincides with limited space.  Your existing coal cells can make way for a private siding to a light industry; cattle docks suggest dairy country, but a sawmill, small brewery, cannery or any other sort of industry that might attract railway vehicles will do just as well.  It will make a nice balance as BLTs by and large had loaded traffic in and empty out unless there was a mine or quarry to be served.

[gobbler]

I think i may be having delusions of grandeur, not uncommon i hear.  TBH when I had my 22ft x 2ft space where i used to live, i got the track laid and started the ballasting, as you can see. (Sorry for the picture quality)

I obviously dont have this space.  Also all points were manually operated as well.  So ive decided to go for a shunting style layout, as i think im trying to run before i can crawl.

 

The plan is to use the long thin plank.  I'd like a loop, a number of sidings, an engine shed and possibly a small station to accommodate my two car cravens 105 or my Wickham 109 if i ever finish it.

 

I am going to experiment with point motors, they seem reasonable price on a certain auction site at around £6 including the switch.  Also i will experiment with elctro frogs as well as ive only ever used insulfrog points.

 

This will end up being a test bed for all kinds of things including static grass and other techniques which ive never used.

 

As Harlequin has said "Don’t spoil the ship for a ha'p'orth of tar"  so taking that on board, as well as other comments im scaling back and i am going to use this to build up my skills.

 

Just need to come up with a track plan now.......

 

The board is only 285mm wide, but is quite long at 1930mm.

 

Im going to need somewhere to run all my scratch built wagons.  So far I've built 2 x salt, 3 x grain, 1 x lowmac, 1 x cattle truck & 2 covered wagons 

 

With more in the pipe line.

 

Suggestions anyone?

 

Thanks, for looking

 

Scott

Edited January 14, 2020 by gobbler
Added a photo

[The Johnster]

So, siding to grain silo, end loading dock for lowmac, and siding to salt distribution depot.  I'd suggest a loop centrally positioned, with the feed road from the fiddle yard and the passenger platform at each end of it.  Kickback to the silo, which is the scenic break hiding a 3 road fiddle yard or cassette system.  The passenger platform has a bay which can be used for handling general merchandise and as the end loading facility, and your salt distribution goes in front of the station.  Train lengths are going to be 2 coaches/6 wagons and a brake van.  It could be a light railway, but doesn't have to be.  

 

Plenty operation and shunting.  A loco hauled passenger needs to set back from the platform on to the loop to run around, and might be held there while a dmu runs in, and then back out again.  Freight needs to delivered to and collected from the bay and 2 private sidings, and the brake van run around as well.  

 

Or, you can use the dodge that some of the private sidings are further down the branch out of site, but the traffic still appears at the terminus on the pickup having been shunted out on the way up or needing to be shunted out on the way back, depending which way the sidings face.  Dispensing with the silo kickback siding means an extra fiddle yard road.  Dmu, pickup, maybe block grain, maybe loco hauled passenger (you've room for an 0-6-0 or small prairie and 2 coaches).

 

Not dissimilar to my own Cwmdimbath layout, loop and 3 sidings.  And I can quite easily tie myself up in shunting knots with this, and run to real time so have sort out my messes before the next passenger train turns up!  The loop avoids a lot of the repetitive back and forth of Inlgenook type shunting problems, and you have to think a few moves ahead to avoid blocking your loco in behind the train assembled for departure, even when you use the platform for temporarily putting wagons out of the way while you run around.