Hornby APT (2020 tooling)

[Markwj]

Do we know yet what vehicles each pack will contain and which add on packs to purchase. I have pre ordered the 7 car pack and reckon I would run a 10 car train.

[PaulRhB]

The coach sets with no suffix complete the 5 car set plus you need the extra power car ( full yellow ends)

The coach sets with an A suffix complete the 7 car set (black mask on ends and includes second power car and test coach)

[Markwj]

3 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

The coach sets with no suffix complete the 5 car set plus you need the extra power car ( full yellow ends)

The coach sets with an A suffix complete the 7 car set (black mask on ends and includes second power car and test coach)

Thank you Paul, are any of the Coach packs duplicated in the 7 car pack do you know?

[John ks]

On 25/01/2020 at 22:41, Markwj said:

Do we know yet what vehicles each pack will contain and which add on packs to purchase. I have pre ordered the 7 car pack and reckon I would run a 10 car train.

 

Here's one I prepared earlier

Set number on top line, vehicle type left hand column. 

 

Vehicle # with Hornby R number next to it

 

John

Edit Added infomation

You can prototypically run the 7 car set (highlighted in green) as it. I believe the APT-U was only run in this configuration. See page 15 for an 8 car train with the APT-U
If you want a 10 car set then remove the APT-U & add the coach packs as required
If you want to run a 10 car set as 2+MDN+MDM+6 then you have problems because you can't get all the requires coaches separately
You could go for DTS,TS,TRBS,TBF,NDM,NDM,TBF,TBRS,TR,DTS Which will require a 7 car set + a TS & TBRS Coach packs 

Edited January 27, 2020 by John ks

[PaulRhB]

1 hour ago, Markwj said:

Thank you Paul, are any of the Coach packs duplicated in the 7 car pack do you know?

As John has shown the extra vehicles in the 7 car set are the NDM & U not ‘set’ coaches  

After the initial confusion I bought the catalogue hoping that would clarify it but it didn’t because it didn’t specify what the extras were! Thanks to info asked on here Hornby cleared that up.
To be honest I probably wouldn’t use the U but I wanted the black mask so they got me hooked  

Edited January 25, 2020 by PaulRhB

[7APT7]

4 hours ago, Colin_McLeod said:

Even if DJ version would have been better, there is an old saying "half a loaf is better than no bread"

 

The DJM version is the "no bread" option. Given Hornby's track record I'm sure their 2020 APT will be a very good model which will suit most in the hobby. 

 

Hi Colin, hope you are well bud.

Great saying by the way...

 

Yes... I guess that's what makes the hobby so interesting for all of us, as there will always be modellers that will modify any model, regardless of how good some may think it is for them personally, for others, it never met my expectations and not enough attention to detail to suit there own standards of correctness or should that be accuracy of a model and how we see the APT-P to true scale and likeness, as some choose to do as a hobbies't. 

 

For the vast majority, most of us will say... "well Hornby have now released the APT and it is good enough for me, they have done a grand and splendid job of the APT" and will think no more of the issue and love to watch it go round on there layout and life will go one. While others will want to take it apart to light up and use a tin of tartan paint haha on every seat, and have lighting in the Buffer Bar and a lift up the nose cone to reveal the buffer beam and all other details (if Hornby doesn't) and these may be the ones we see at Model Shows in the future and drawl over, and wonder just how good there's looks, compared to the APT-P I have at home. 

 

What's that saying... (Don't quote me 'word for word' on this but i'm sure we have all heard it said) ... You can only please some of people some of the time, whereas you'll never please all of the people all of the time blah blah blah... lol However that saying goes....!

 

I do believe this saying was so true throughout every part of the DJ Models APT-P thread and Dave couldn't do right for doing wrong. I do think, there are always going to be ones, (we all know which side of the category we fit in to in the saying above) even ones that will never be pleased because that's the way some are, and some expectation and standards are always set much higher than others, while others are just happy go lucky, which is why we can never please people all of the time. That's why I say, if the Hornby Model is not up to our spec, there will always be those that will hack at it and pull it apart and do there own modifications to it and make it a much better model and its more to scale etc and up to there standards...

 

I for example, expect Directional Lighting as standard just as the old 80's Hornby APT-P had it, (what new model doesn't today) and I would love it to also have full coach lighting, as much as I would like it to have full coach lighting, I am not expecting it in anyway, even if all European coaches do have full lighting as standard and opening doors etc, today.

 

Regard

Jamie

Edited January 25, 2020 by 7APT7

[7APT7]

49 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

The coach sets with no suffix complete the 5 car set plus you need the extra power car ( full yellow ends)

The coach sets with an A suffix complete the 7 car set (black mask on ends and includes second power car and test coach)

 

Hi PaulRhB

 

Thanks for that clarification... I'm pleased about that and I did wonder about the 7-Car Set and what are the extra two coaches over the 5-Car Set, also nice to hear like the old APT, both Yellow and Black fronts will be available, that as helped me to decipher which to buy now.

 

Cheers for that information Paul.

 

Regards

Jamie

[PaulRhB]

1 minute ago, 7APT7 said:

as much as I would like it to have full coach lighting, I am not expecting it in anyway, even if all European coaches do have full lighting as standard and opening doors etc, today.

Jamie, full coach lighting certainly isn’t standard across European coaches and neither are opening doors. There are more with lighting contacts but even then most require a retro fit light set. As for opening doors, Roco and Marklin have offered it on select models but certainly not as standard. I  have recent stock from Roco, Tillig, Liliput and Bemo and none have lights or working doors fitted. 
Why are we bashing stuff based on myths still?  

[PaulRhB]

Just now, 7APT7 said:

 

Hi PaulRhB

 

Thanks for that clarification... I'm pleased about that and I did wonder about the 7-Car Set and what are the extra two coaches over the 5-Car Set, also nice to hear like the old APT, both Yellow and Black fronts will be available, that as helped me to decipher which to buy now.

 

Cheers for that information Paul.

 

Regards

Jamie

The info on the black masks and what’s in the sets is off this thread, someone asked, not me  

[7APT7]

Hi All

 

The Real 14-Car Set as it ran back in the 80's I believe as a full running Train Set, ran as the following Acronyms :-

DTS[1] + TS + TRSB + TU + TF + TBF + N-DM + N-DM + TBF + TF + TU + TRSB + TS + DTS[2]

 

Translates into the Real 14-Car Set as the following running numbers :-

48105 - 48203 - 48401 - 48304 - 48505 - 48605 - 49004 - 49002 - 48606 - 48504 - 48306 - 48403 - 48205 - 48106 (or so I believe)

 

So even if Hornby do not do the actual running numbers themselves in a pack, you can make the Full Rake up by choosing your own Hornby Add-On Packs by choosing the Acronym line.

 

Regards

Jamie

Edited January 25, 2020 by 7APT7

[7APT7]

25 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

The info on the black masks and what’s in the sets is off this thread, someone asked, not me  

 

Hi PaulRhb

 

Yes, I think I have read it and possibly on this thread and also what I watched on YouTube to, I think either with Hatton's or Hornby Channel, and the Older 80's sets had both Yellow & Black so again I wouldn't be surprised that Hornby will repeat the process again anyway to cover as many variants as there once was.

 

Regards

Jamie

[7APT7]

Hi PaulRhB

 

Yes, I know it didn't apply to every EU coach but for those that do have 'Opening Doors' are they 'DCC Opening Doors' they have? that will all open on the press of a function button or 'Opening Doors' as in 'Sprung', that you can push them open with your fingers...? Like some of the UK Class 37's/50's do.

If it's 'DCC Opening Doors', that must be so intricate bit of mechanism and I would Imagine also very fragile and delicate to handle not to mention the price of each coach.

 

On another Note:

The only other form of certainly UK coach lighting, should be standard today is the 'DOORS UNLOCKED' Orange Light on the Outside next to the Coach Doors itself or if DMU's sometime in the Top Centre of the Coach, but that doesn't apply to the APT-P.

 

Saying that, I was watching YouTuber doing a review recently on the very latest Bachmann Class 158's with DCC Sound and it does actually have the Orange Light lite up on a Function Number, which I thought was cool to see, although at £297 for the 2-Car DMU, I thought it was a bit steep for the price, but then, that's the type of price these loco's cost to have the things we would like on our Wish Lists, I guess.

 

Regards

Jamie

[Markwj]

Thanks guys have ordered the appropriate coaches for my apt I wonder how the apt is doing on pre-sales hopefully rewarding Hornby's faith.

[Roy Langridge]

7 hours ago, Colin_McLeod said:

Don't worry MGR. The APT-P was not typical in that the power cars were in the middle of the train instead of either end which is more normal.

Being pedantic, many EMUs have the motor coaches not at the ends. Often a four-car unit will only have one motor coach. 
 

Roy

[Bloodnok]

27 minutes ago, Markwj said:

I wonder how the apt is doing on pre-sales hopefully rewarding Hornby's faith.

 

I would like to think it's doing well. However I can't shake the nagging feeling that it could have been doing better if people hadn't have had to do detective work to find out what condition and vehicles are represented in each set...

[Colin_McLeod]

Perhaps, if Hornby don't do it first, the first model shop to get their allocation of APTs could check what is in each box and advise on here.

[royaloak]

I am sure Hornby will clarify the situation before the release date which is 11 months away.

[7APT7]

3 hours ago, Roy Langridge said:

Being pedantic, many EMUs have the motor coaches not at the ends. Often a four-car unit will only have one motor coach. 
 

Roy

 

Hi RoyLangridge

 

I must admit, have you not seen the new Class 755 Sets, I saw them on YouTube and I must say they look real smart.

 

There is a definite hint of a Modern APT Power Car Look to it and it just so happens to be in the Centre of the Rake, I would call it a 4.5 Coach Set personally, Search for 'Class 755' in your Search Engine for it and you will see why I say 4.5 Coach Set, with it's Half sized Non-Passenger Power Coach in the Centre and then Two Passenger Units either side of the Centre Power Car, I was kind of impressed when I first saw them... they are the New Greater Anglia Train Sets.... very smart indeed.

 

Regards

Jamie

[Roy Langridge]

3 minutes ago, 7APT7 said:

 

Hi RoyLangridge

 

I must admit, have you not seen the new Class 755 Sets, I saw them on YouTube and I must say they look real smart.

 

There is a definite hint of a Modern APT Power Car Look to it and it just so happens to be in the Centre of the Rake, I would call it a 4.5 Coach Set personally, Search for 'Class 755' in your Search Engine for it and you will see why I say 4.5 Coach Set, with it's Half sized Non-Passenger Power Coach in the Centre and then Two Passenger Units either side of the Centre Power Car, I was kind of impressed when I first saw them... they are the New Greater Anglia Train Sets.... very smart indeed.

 

Regards

Jamie

Shame they don’t work as well as they look. Apparently the crews call the 745s and 755s Basils and Cybils - yep, they are Fawlty.
 

Roy

[7APT7]

2 hours ago, Colin_McLeod said:

Perhaps, if Hornby don't do it first, the first model shop to get their allocation of APTs could check what is in each box and advise on here.

 

Hi Colin

 

That's a great Idea...Colin,

 

I actually watch Jack & Dave on YouTube's Hatton's Live Stream every Friday at 1pm GMT, they have all the latest releases on the table in front of them that have been released for that week, along with any news that as been released by manufactures so as and when the Hornby APT-P arrives in Store, I'm sure Jack & Dave will be opening ever APT-P Pack to show us all just how good it is, and sometime, they'll say... this item as Now Sold out on Pre-Order..., Why god, WHY...! lol

 

So I have Pre-Ordered it, to try and prevent that from happening or being disappointed, unless Hornby release a Second Batch but that's normally known information until several weeks or months  later.

 

Regards

Jamie

Edited January 25, 2020 by 7APT7

[7APT7]

1 hour ago, royaloak said:

I am sure Hornby will clarify the situation before the release date which is 11 months away.

 

Hi RoyLangridge

 

Yes, I've sure Jack & Dave on Hatton's Live Stream every Friday at 1PM GMT, will have that information as and when details get released by Hornby, they will have it in the live stream as subject to talk about.

 

Regards

Jamie

[7APT7]

1 hour ago, Roy Langridge said:

Shame they don’t work as well as they look. Apparently the crews call the 745s and 755s Basils and Cybils - yep, they are Fawlty.
 

Roy

 

Hi Roy Langridge

 

Haha... so the same issues as the APT-P had then, you obviously know them better, I'm not in that neck of the woods so I only get to see a working Rake on YouTube haha... so that's why I don't know what issues they are having with them and I'll look in to the Class 745's I didn't know about those ones. I notice the 12-Car Sets don't have a Centre Power Car, but the pantograph is on the second coach in, and no pantograph on the other end of the rake like the Pendolino's have.  I also noticed only One Set of Double Doors per coach in the Centre, rather than Doors at each end of the Coach like most tend to have.

 

They still look nice just like the APT-P did, regardless of the issues they are experiencing with them, Deja Vu all over again then...! Is it the APT-P Look alike Bogies they have the issues with then... or some other running issues. I just thought APT-P look alike in part soon as I saw it.

 

Regards

Jamie  

Edited January 25, 2020 by 7APT7

[7APT7]

Hi Roy Langridge

 

Nice, those Class 745's are 12-Car Sets then and the Class 755's are 5-Car Sets, is that the only difference between the two Classes of 745/755...?

Still look smart, hope they sort out the issues, I guess like all new product, have there problems.

 

I noticed the Pantograph on the Centre Power Car but are they Dual Powered to or even Triple Powered with Pantograph, Diesel and Third Rail...?  I also notice that every Two Coaches share the same Bogie, like the APT-P in part and the Euro Train I guess...

 

Regard

Jamie

Edited January 25, 2020 by 7APT7

[Bloodnok]

1 hour ago, 7APT7 said:

I noticed the Pantograph on the Centre Power Car but are they Dual Powered to or even Triple Powered with Pantograph, Diesel and Third Rail...?

Pantograph isn't on the centre power car -- it's further along.

It's quite a clever design, the centre power pack is only present in bi-mode sets, pure electric sets don't have it. Looks like it could be added/removed from sets later that didn't/did have it at delivery if changes are necessary.
It also apparently has a passenger gangway through the middle, thus not cutting the train in half like the APT-P did...

[Markwj]

2 hours ago, royaloak said:

I am sure Hornby will clarify the situation before the release date which is 11 months away.

I am sure you are right but I like to be organised! Pre orders in can forget about it until release now!